PT Were Obi-Wan and Anakin ever friends?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Garrett Atkins, Feb 16, 2013.

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  1. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I don't say you are wrong but I unfortunately didn't really get a friendship vibe in AOTC either. They care for each other, yes, but they also both act like jerks and don't seem to care when they hurt the others feelings. It even reminded me of a marriage where both partners secretly hate each other a little but still don't find the courage to go separate ways.

    I viewed AOTC twice (by far my least favorite star wars movie) and I just never really "felt" any real friendship. That could've do do with a couple botched lines too, of course.

    Sure, it can be interpreted this way. It can also be interpreted in Obi-Wan wanting some revenge on the pupil who disappointed him. Considering OBWs current state of mind, this interpretation is not that far off.

    But on total, ROTS has made me rethink my stance on Obi-Wan somewhat, and also on Anakin. If I ignore AOTC and include some of the EU in my personal canon, I even like them both.
  2. Placeholder Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 30, 2013
    star 4
    I think that the prequels handled their friendship in a very sloppy manor. The prequels really don't line up at all with with Obi-Wan has to say in ANH at all. They basically show what we are supposed to take as a more mature Anakin in Episode III and accept it on face value that they are like brothers, but they don't sell us on it at all.

    It's a major flaw in the prequels.
  3. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    No, but we saw Cay was keep trying to save Ulic, did we see Obi Wan do this before Anakin? And Ulic was deep regretted for his brother's death, did we see Anakin do this?


    It's not known about Obi Wan cut off Anakin's limbs before PT, we are talking about OT's portrayal, even the novel only said they fought and Anakin fell into the molten pit. And Cay did help capture Ulic then the Senate sentenced him to death.

    Yes Vader spent 20 years in the Dark Side but when Luke tried to save him his good was awakened in short time, didn't even take Luke's death like Ulic did to Cay. But we don't see that in their friendship.
  4. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    His good, though, has only awakened when his son was very close to death. And he does take an awful lot of time to decide about it.
    I'm not even sure Vader would've stayed on the light side if he survived. It is almost ... unfair he was allowed to become a force ghost considering his deeds.
    And what if Luke hadn't been his son? Would he have turned if Luke weren't his own flesh and blood? You can hardly say he acted selfless.
    Difficult questions. They actually make me love the story even more.
    Valairy Scot likes this.
  5. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    No, you can see conflict already began in him when they met in EP VI.

    Luke is his son, and Obi Wan once was his friend, we can see the difference of the two.
  6. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Sure, the conflict began sooner, I think directly after TESB. But he still stood next to Palpatine doing nothing for almost a whole minute while Luke whithered and died.
  7. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Yes, but we don't see a bit when he met and killed Obi Wan, nor did he show a bit of remorse when he talked about Obi Wan's death in EP V.
  8. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    That's because he has no personal reason to hate Luke, yet hates Obi-Wan.
  9. FARK2005 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 2
    As I said, the characters, the context, and the circumstances surrounding the characters are exceedingly different which is why I dispute the comparison you make between the two situations.

    I must admit I don’t understand half of what you’re trying to argue, and when did this discussion become isolated to the OT alone? The PT is an equal part of the Star Wars Saga, and the PT tells us Anakin hated Obi-Wan for cutting his limbs off and for him ending up in that suit. That hate was still there in the OT.
  10. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Aren't we talking about "Is PT's portrayal of their friendship accurate to what we saw from OT?"

    Luke blew up the Empire's Death Star, his friend Han shot Vader's ship and almost caused his death.
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Feb 17, 2013
  11. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I meant "personal reasons". Blowing up the Death Star is a military matter which should be suspected from ones military enemies. I'm not even sure Vader would bother something like this at all. Sure he doesn't want to see the empire weakened, but this kind of stuff probably happens to him at a regular basis. It is certainly not comparable with being burned alive and maimed, both which he could never forget even if he wanted. Vader probably also believes Obi-Wan to be at fault for Padmés death, which is completely deranged but realistic for a person such as Vader.
  12. FARK2005 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 2
    Not really, we are discussing "Is PT's portrayal of their friendship accurate to what we heard in the OT?"

    By the time of the OT the friendship between Obi-Wan and Anakin was non-existent. Obi-Wan named Anakin a good friend - not Vader.
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  13. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    But Anakin is Vader, we can still judge it by seeing their actions.
  14. FARK2005 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 2
    How a friendship is in the now rarely reflects how it was in the past - in one period of time you can be best friends with person A, and suddenly you or your friend move to a different stage in your life and person A is no longer your best friend, you may even dislike him/her, but that doesn't change the fact that person A was once your best friend.

    So if one is to judge whether Obi-Wan and Anakin had been friends before he fell to the Dark side you need to look at the PT. Just because Obi-Wan and Anakin were enemies in the OT, it doesn’t change the fact that they had once been friends.
    Eryndil and BoromirsFan like this.
  15. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Well that means the friendship is not strong enough, Iike I said, from the OT my opinion is they had friendship, but not that strong like some people thought.
  16. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 6
    Friends bicker to each other from time to time. Me and my best friend always will find some way to disagree on something, but at the end of the day, we're still best friends.
  17. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    In The Clone Wars: Wild Space, Yoda gives Obi-Wan a pointed warning that he's supposed to be Anakin's mentor- trying to be Anakin's friend is a mistake. Obi-Wan decides Yoda is wrong in this case.

    In the RoTS novelization "he is proud to be Anakin's best friend".
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  18. Lazy Storm Trooper Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 18, 2012
    star 4
    Yes, it was just not portrayed well in the PT. I think fighting together for three long years would make anyone good friends.
    Last edited by Lazy Storm Trooper, Feb 20, 2013
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  19. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Well if one of you can kill the other without hesitation, the other one could use the friend's son to kill him, that clearly showed the friendship is not strong enough.
  20. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    I suspect discovering one's friend is a mass-murderer of children would shake even strong friendships.

    At what point does "strong enough friendship" become "insanely naive"?
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  21. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    Ulic also became a cruel Sith Lord and helped Exar Kun slaughtered many people in the Great Sith War, but Cay still asked the chancellor to spare him and later Cay's death awakened the good in Ulic.

    Wait, so Luke is insanely naive?
  22. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    To Obi-Wan, he is. It might be that Luke has not witnessed many of Vader's vile deeds, whereas Obi-Wan has seen a few.
    Valairy Scot likes this.
  23. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    In a way, yes. Luke is a fixer type of person. Like Wilson in House MD he has a strong drive to fix other people. He did so with Han, then with Vader, then with Mara. The more broken someone is, the more attractive to Luke, no matter if that is wise or not.
  24. Iron_lord Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 5
    And he tried to do so with C'baoth. That time it failed.
    Darth_Pevra likes this.
  25. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    I won't see redeem Vader as more naive than let Luke kill his father without falling into the Dark Side.
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