Senate West Coast Secession Talks

If by freedom you mean recognition of native Hawaiians, then yes. But the entire state doesn't have the means or the support to secede. Wont happen. It's a state and part of the union.

 

As far as I know everyone born in the Hawaiian Islands with the possible exception of wake island which I believe to be unoccupied, is a full citizen of the USA.

How is that colonialism?

 

I'm pretty sure he meant the how of its ascension to statehood.

 

That's why I stipulated "if they want it." The internal sentiment doesn't seem to be there, which is fine. But if they did, they have a unique and better case than any other state in the Union; it is basically the only one worth consideration. Whether it's economically viable is a separate question. What outsiders think shouldn't matter.

Because it forcibly suborned and obliterated an existing polity that had international recognition? These things are literally part of the definition of colonialism, not a repudiation of it.

 

Personally, I favor 'Pacifica'. California can pay for the shindig, we'll bring the drinks (at least until we kick the keg, but we were all going to be screwed by then anyway).

You know, despite the fact that secession won't happen--at least not unless things get truly apocalyptic, which is a notion more than a few Oregonians like to entertain--I think a lot of people are finding reassurance in their regional identity right now because their country supports or condones things they find abhorrent. I've certainly taken a great deal of solace from the fact that my state of Oregon is one of--if not the--most progressive states in the union (seriously, we get automatically registered to vote, which happens by mail, can pick up a year's worth of birth control from our pharmacist, weed from a proper store, die with dignity, and our governor is a bisexual lady). That's what's driving the discussion.

I've definitely had many joking conversations about Cascadia since the election, but the truth is I hope states like ours can spread our values, not leave other people in the dirt. Rather than secession, I'd prefer to talk about things like expanding vote-by-mail to all fifty states and fighting against voter suppression laws, or about the merits of the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, and about why it's so important to give actual money to actual newspapers (and Planned Parenthood, the ACLU, the SPLC, etc., etc.), and also have more realistic conversations about how we can act to protect the people in our state from potential attacks on their rights. That's not to say, though, that I think talk about Cascadia or the New California Republic or (again, my fav) Pacifica is a waste of time; I think it helps us form our ideals about what a better country would look like, and that's a useful exercise. We just have to relate that to positive actions we can take in our present situation.

And hey, we can rock the very cool Cascadia flag whether we're secessionists or not.

 

Honestly in purely democratic terms I think they should bemore seriously looking at splitting California up, more representatives in the senate plus I think in a collage system having blocks that large is not helpful as many will feel there votes are irrelevant.

Big question as to how it should be spilt up of course and I'm sure both sides would favour a spilt that benefits them.

 

Eh, you mean like how the northern states were able to successfully convince the south to abandon slavery and.....oh wait.

 

Slightly connected to secession mostly due to the EC reform and recent election.

Zoe Lofgren jumps on the Convention of States train.

Three states away folks. It's going to happen. Better for the dems to get on board now to help guide a process that, until now, has been almost exclusively pushed by the far right.

http://ntknetwork.com/disgruntled-democrats-want-a-constitutional-convention-to-leave-the-union/

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/leader-cal-exit-drops-bid-california-secede-instead-moves-russia-n747706

 

If we secede, we should call ourselves "the United States of America" and this should be our flag:



Because blue states are the real America. Red states can go **** themselves and call themselves whatever the hell they want.

 

Make California Mexican again.
Return the land back to its rightful owners.

 

I agree. Rightful "owners."

 

They're dead now, guy.

 

Many of those tribes and groups still exist. Why hand over California to another successor of European imperialism when you can hand it over to the surviving indigenous peoples?

 

Remember, overall, Hillary won the popular vote.....and she only lost the PV in the Blue Wall states because she opted to ignore them, wrongly believing that because these states went blue twice for President Obama that they would simply remain her loyal Democratic lapdogs.


Hate didn't win the election.....pathetic strategy (including the political maneuvering to eliminate Bernie Sanders as a threat to Hillary's candidacy) by the Democrats lost it.

 

5 of the 7 swing states she lost have new voter suppression laws. In a free and fair election, she wins at least three of those states. Hate did win the election, it was just hate from a different source, the racist and corrupt Roberts Supreme Court.

That doesn't mean she isn't a terrible politician, but it does mean that strategy worked great for Republicans and it will continue to do so.