Lit What are the biggest weaknesses of Luke/Leia/Han/Jaina/Jag/Ben?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Ghost, Jan 16, 2013.

  1. DARTH_MU Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    Ben -- Being trained by Luke. Whose bright idea was it that he be trained by one of his parents?
  2. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    I had no issue with that, but it would been interesting if Kyp or Kyle had trained him.
  3. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    Well it was actually Jacen that trained him.

    In FOTJ he's already a Knight, and that's really the first time their relationship was even explored, so I'm ok with that.
  4. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    Ben was taken away from Jacen when Jaina noticed her twin was off his rocker.
  5. Team Padme Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    I'd love a YJK series with Ben, Seha, Allana and a bunch of other original characters!
  6. windu4 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2008
    star 4
    Which always bothered me because Ben is how old? 15? 16? I'm not sure if this was the author's commentary on the special privileges that Luke has for his family and nephew or whether the authors think Ben is all that and a bag of chips. As much as I like Ben his abilities ranked unnecessarily high for a 16 year old in FOTJ, prodigy or not.
    Summer Dreamer likes this.
  7. Jedi_Glover Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 30, 2012
    star 1
    Luke felt that since Ben had walked the edge of the dark side and then pulled Luke back from his despair that he deserved to be a Knight. It is kind of like the thing where Anakin Solo was treated as a jedi knight at 16 even more so than Ben that he was able to lead combat missions. So there has been a precedence for them to build Ben off of. Also the fact that Ben pulled 1 person back from the dark and then he came close to doing it again with Vestera.
  8. Joe Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 25, 2012
    star 6
    I think that was a great idea. Who could more effectively teach a child than someone who knows all about them?
  9. DARTH_MU Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    Parents can be biased and over protective in a learning environment.
    Isn't there a rule official or non official where if a student is in a school where a parent also teaches, they have to be in different classes?
    There is a reason for that.
  10. Joe Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 25, 2012
    star 6
    There is such a rule, and parents can be biased. But if the parent could distance themselves enough (as a Jedi should), their knowledge of the child would prove useful.
  11. Reveen Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2012
    star 3
    If it was Mara teaching him it might have worked, and he might not be a punk. I don't think Luke ever distances himself as a teacher, not by how much he hypes him in narration.

    And being taught by your grand master father can only exacerbate the whole "entitled to greatness" mindset. He needs to learn on the same level as other students, with no rank or family advantages. Sleep in the same bunks as the others, eat the same food, and face the same challenges.

    I wanna read a book about the academy on Dathomir where it's treated more as a boot camp than a conventional school.
  12. GrandAdmiralJello Community and Lit moderator person

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2000
    star 10
    Their faith in their friends.

    Obviously.
    Danzo likes this.
  13. DARTH_MU Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2005
    star 4
    Jag has been said to be a captain cardboard, but I don't know why he gets that moniker.
    The thing I do notice is that he just gets accepted into the Solo family from the start. I guess a Mary Sue deserves a Gary Stu.
    There is a strong feeling of enforced exclusiveness within the Skywalker and Solo families. You get in when the author says you are in, and then all
    the other OCs gets shoved to the side. Absolutely no non VIPs need to apply.

    I guess the way to do it is to kiss up to one of Luke's sons/daughters/nephews/nieces and be one of their boyfriend/girlfriend.

    The whole lot of them suffers from the same thing.

    "No, you can't be Ben's platonic friend!!!! You need to take a number here and he'll see if he can take you out to dinner sometimes, say, next year?"
  14. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    I wouldn't say he got accepted right away. It took a while.
  15. Jedifirefly5 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 5, 2012
    star 2
    Too much power, riding on their 45 YO victory. Yes they deserve respect and yes they should not have to do so much, but they also get fawned all over wherever they go. Like rock stars. Don't get me wrong they deserve it, but their perspectives are not what they were.
  16. thesevegetables Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2012
    star 4
    Out-universe, and in: having families.
    So many problems came about because these guys insisted on making babies and raising them.
    If these people didn't have family to worry about, they wouldn't have spawned wars and weird politics.
    There's a reason the Old Jedi Order, which went with better safe than sorry, survived for thousands of year and the NJO began imploding as soon as those annoying selfish little kids became teenagers. The failure of the NJO really mostly stems directly from the actions of this family. The failure rests on them, not the entire order, although that is plagued with problems as well.
  17. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    Having families wasn't the problem. The problem was that they were the worst parents in the galaxy. They would have been better off if Winter raised them. A princess workaholic and an orphan smuggler don't make good parents. Let's hope they are better grandparents.
    Last edited by rumsmuggler, Jan 18, 2013
  18. thesevegetables Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2012
    star 4
    True - all men are created equal and innocent. But the nurture trumped nature, with horrible outcomes. Those kids were some serious problems. Yes, if you don't have kids, you may not produce the one who cures cancer, but you might also not produce the one who creates the atomic bomb.
    And not just Luke/Mara Leia/Han - Jacen having a kid (with a teen, practically?) also made it so complicated. They could have shown self-control.
    The Old Jedi Order survived and prospered because of rules. They seemed harsh, but they worked.
  19. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    Tenal Ka and Jacen were both adults at that point. Both were well past their teen years.
    Last edited by rumsmuggler, Jan 19, 2013
  20. Manisphere Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 25, 2007
    star 5
    Yeah, they're terrible at that too.
    windu4 likes this.
  21. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7
    That's kinda sad.
  22. Team Padme Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    In Backlash they had Allana stay on the Millennium Falcon with Anji and C-3PO for a whole week. Seriously?
  23. Manisphere Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 25, 2007
    star 5
    Actually, I believe it was closer to two weeks.
  24. Reveen Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2012
    star 3
    I'm going to take a wild guess and say that the falcon isn't child, or pet proofed. Fate of the Jedi had alot of forced confinement now that I think about it.

    I actually kind of have a problem with Anji, didn't they clip the thing's claws and do something to prevent it from clamping down with the jaw? Dulling or removing an animals natural defense mechanisms is a pretty crappy thing to do. Especially to a wild animal.
  25. Kyris Cavisek Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 4
    Well when I became a Firefighter in Training at my dad's station (in which he is an officer), he got his best friend and superior officer to train me because it would be best for me. While he trained one of my good friends...
    Much likes the Kol-Shado/Wolf-Cade set up.

    It works well, we both got trained well and unbiasedly too. Needless to say, it was alot of work but I have a good friend because of it. Think if Kyle or Kyp or Corran were to train Ben, while Luke trained one of Ben's best friends of the Order...

    Not only do you get Ben character developed but one of the masters as well as a new apprentice for Luke to be Ben's best friend
    rumsmuggler likes this.