ST What could George Lucas do legally if they changed his outlines?

I think the slate is a lot blanker than people might think. Remember, Lucas himself said that he felt there was no more story to tell after the redemption of Anakin. Although Lucas originally claimed that he intended there to be more than 6 episodes, it's likely that he envisioned the story of Anakin to span more films than it ended up doing.

Lucas obviously wrote some sort of notes about what might follow, but I don't think he had any concrete, fleshed out story. Just a kernel of an idea.

If the new films are to breath a breath of fresh air into the franchise, then more latitude, not less, is a good thing. And, legally speaking, that's certainly the case.

 

I could care less what GL does. His story telling is questionable after the prequels.

 

Actually the story of the prequels is pretty good. If you think of the actual story then GL was actually trying to do some really interesting things story wise. Unfortuanlty the execution was piss poor. If you actually took the story of the prequels and reworked it a little, it would have made for some great movies. Still wouldn't have tied up exactly with the OT well, but still a great story.

In any case, I doubt Jorge has the power to do anything.

 

"I'm retired. It's not my problem."

Great words, from a great man.


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They could have remade space balls and called it EP7 & GL could not do much about it......

 

Blasphemy! Spaceballs does not need to be remade, it's perfect the way it is.

 

Lucas is right; it's not his problem, it's Disney's. That doesn't mean he doesn't care how the final product turns out.

 

That should be posted in every thread on this forum every time somebody tries to argue their point with quotes from George Lucas. Because right now, that's the only GL quote that matters.

Disney is gonna do what they're gonna do. If they decide to completely throw out GL's Story Treatments for 8 and 9, and change major parts of 7, it's their right. They paid for it, it's theirs.

 

That's why I said 'for me'. As an acknowledgement that this is my own personal view and that I understand other individuals can and will have different views.

We can argue over the exact percentage of content that is perfectly imparted from 'George's grand vision TM' all day, if you like, but I think you misunderstood my point. I wasn't trying to suggest that he had less overall control on the OT than on the PT; but that he worked a lot more collaboratively. For example, instead of penning the screenplays entirely himself, he recognised the need to have them tightened up by others. I understand that even in this situation, he had final approval. But he at least was more willing to recognise the benefit of bringing in other talented creative people. I am aware he asked his friends to read drafts of the PT screenplays; but asking a friend is not really a good idea when it comes to something like that, in my opinion; since a friend is more likely to be enthusiastic about whatever you show them (I'm thinking about the famous behind the scenes footage of George and Steven saying 'it's going to be great' when talking about the droid army battle on the set of TPM).

Any way. My point was not really about that. It was just trying to draw attention to the fact that a lot of iconic Star Wars imagery, came from the talents George worked with, rather than solely springing fully formed from George's head. He needed talented artists to design his world. If he'd worked with different artists, it probably would have looked and sounded a lot different. I think I can safely say that without suggesting that the whole thing wasn't his own original idea. It's just that one man alone does not make a film, and I think that some dedicated fans sometimes forget this.

 

Of course Disney paid for them; but they also signed a contract. They can't just "throw out" Lucas's Treatments if they are part of the contract. If they did, then Lucas would have the right to fight it. Whether or not Lucas still gives a **** about Star Wars is irrelevant. This Thread is about what GL could do legally.

 

Bolding mine. That's the thing: there's a 99.999999% chance that the contract makes no mention of needing to be faithful to Lucas' outlines.

 

There's a big difference between a Treatment and a Shooting Script. Disney could argue that as long as the finished product contains at least some elements of the treatment, they'll probably be on safe footing. That being said, I'm sure there were an army of lawyers involved in transferring the rights to Star Wars from Lucas to Disney and I'd be willing to bet that whatever the contract says, Disney made sure it had the legal high ground where any potential actions by Lucas are concerned.

 

I'm always for changes, but when changes spit all over the creator of a series and their vision, that's when series die to me. It's why DC Comics is dead to me.

 

What can George do?

The stories are Disney's now and they can change and keep as much or as little as they want. It's not like he can sue them for not having the movie be 1000% like his drafts. I dont think Disney would have signed off on that if they had to strictly stick to his outlines without a bit of their say in the movie.

 

Well... Let's see...

The first draft script was based off Lucas' story treatment. If I recall, wasn't that script rewritten? It may still be close, but they have already changed it.

 

Give 10 people a chance at George's story treatment and we will have 10 different treatments. No big deal.

 

And that's exactly why Disney would never pay $4 billion and leave any amount of creative control with Lucas.

Disney bought Lucas' treatments but there is nothing that even remotely implies an obligation to use those treatments. That would potentially hamstring any writer/director they wanted to make the movies.

And I would gladly bet dollars to donuts that Lucas' "treatments" are little more than public relations to make the fanbase think Lucas was involved more than he actually was.

 

I think you screwed up the quoting there, Beezer. I didn't write that.


EDIT, I see you fixed it, thank you.

 

I don't think it's a great story because it's a prequel to something that already exists. There's no impartial way to look at it in light of seeing the OT first.

 

Let's be honest here: Disney, KK, and JJ all seem to have a lot of reverence for George. I highly doubt they will walk all over his (GL's) treatments. I also remember reading that Iger said he was so impressed with the treatments that GL wrote. I bet there will be some changes, but the basic structure of the 3 movies will probably resemble George's vision. This whole thread will, IMO, most likely be a non-issue.


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I have no idea what the agreement was, but from a legal discussion standpoint, how would one determine use of the treatments vs non-use? Here's what I mean: let's say the spirit of the treatments are used as in most major plot points, BUT JJ Adrams/Kasdan add and subtract a couple notable characters, remove and add some scenes etc...I.E., how much flexibility would be allowed? Or if 50% was used vs 25%? And would GL have to approve it? Just wondering if anyone knows from a Hollywood/legal world standpoint how that would even be handled?

Seems too complicated to me, which makes me think that was not the agreement.

 

Does anyone have any idea as to actually how long these treatments are?

There's a big difference between a one-page movie outline and a real treatment, which can be as many as 20 pages. I could be wrong but I strongly doubt GL wrote a full treatment for each of the ST films. I mean this is the guy who said over and over "There's no more story."

My guess is that his "treatments" were really short, describing the general state of the galaxy, who the good guys were, that the Big 3 should be in it, who the bad guys are, and a couple cool action sequences. Then JJ & co are taking his general outline and fleshing it out.

 

This is pretty much how I see it.

Lucas wrote an initial, very basic, outline for the ST - this was only a few pages if I remember the reports right, probably just the very broad strokes of the trilogy

Arndt then wrote a 40-50 page detailed treatment for the ST filling in characters arcs, plot points, etc. before writing the script for VII

JJ disagreed with Arndt's script and re-wrote VII with Kasdan.

I'm seeing this very much as a "different point of view" thing - Lucas' broad outline is still being followed but we're just seeing it from a different perspective (if we believe reports Arndt focused more on the next generation, JJ wanted more from the original cast).

This will likely hold true for VIII and IX as well. Arndt's detailed treatments may be gone (or heavily re-worked by JJ and Kasdan following their re-write of VII) but Lucas' broad strokes outline will still form the basis for the new treatments/scripts whether they come from JJ, Kasdan, Rian Johnson or some combination of the three.

Legally I don't think he could or would do anything if they deviate from his outlines, if he wanted that level of control he wouldn't have sold or he'd have done the ST before he sold.

 

George is retired. I don't even understand how this thread can stay open. I assume this is just a theoretical "what if" kind of thread. But I don't think George cares what they do. He's done.

 

just wondering, but now we know jj will not direct ST8. we dont know for sure if JW will do the music for the next 2 movies. anything going on big behind the scenes or is this nothing to worry about? i'm talking consistency and quality here. like all of a sudden, am i going to hear that danny $^&^&%^* elfman is going to do the music?