What does it mean to be a Christian?

Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by JediYvette, Dec 22, 2001.

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  1. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Because God IS. God just IS. God is a WORD, for whatever we are or were or will be. You call him Jesus, i call him God, others call him by other names. God is such a general word, when someone says, "do you believe in God?" most will say "yes," no," or "not sure." Not, "well, i believe in God, but not the traditional Christian Version." or "I believe in God, but not the traditional Buddhist version."

    Nine times out of ten you will get a yes, no, or not sure. That's what i mean. We both believe in God.

  2. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    "Again, I don't believe God kills."

    The Bible says otherwise.
  3. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Ok, Maybe He does kill. Who are we to question His authority though? His the creator, we're the created, He can do whatever He wants to us.


    And Cydonia, calling Him by a different name is not the problem here. Muslims call Him Allah, Jews call Him Jehovah, Yaweh, Elhim, Hashem ect., Christians call Him Jesus, God, ect. But every religion, aside from the ones that believe in the same God, are totally different from each other in many different ways. Many believe God is some pushover that doesn't care that we disobey Him, many believe He is the many forces of nature, many believe that we are Him, and still many believe that He is Lord of all creation. It doesn't matter what you call Him, but how you think of Him, and how you respond to that.
  4. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Alright. I guess you mean when you hear people say they aren't atheists, then they really are athiests if they aren't christian.
  5. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    Two people can both agree that Picasso painted a picture called "The Scream" without agreeing on what he was trying to say with it.

    All views of God are interpretations. Many of them differ, but they all share the same source.
  6. Gandalf the Grey Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2000
    star 6
    I don't believe God kills.

    God doesn't take our lives for sinning, we do through that sin.



    He destroyeth the perfect and the wicked. If the scourge slay suddenly, he will laugh at the trial of the innocent.
    -Job 9:22-23

    Thus says the LORD, 'About midnight I am going out into the midst of Egypt, and all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die, from the firstborn of the Pharaoh who sits on his throne, even to the firstborn of the slave girl who is behind the millstones; all the firstborn of the cattle as well.
    -Exodus 11:4-5

    Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
    -Samuel I 15:3

    Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven; And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.
    -Genesis 19:24-25

    They utterly destroyed everything in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox and sheep and donkey, with the edge of the sword.
    -Joshua 6:21


    In the Old Testament, God has shown himself perfectly willing to kill even "infant and suckling." A new born child should be without sin. Therefore, if the OT is true, then God kills and God kills even kills some of those who have not sinned.
  7. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Yes,(darth geist) that's what i mean.
  8. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    I think Gandolf solved that one.
  9. IellaWessiriNRI Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 3, 2001
    star 4
    cydonia, we both believe in a god. We both believe in a deity. But you don't believe in my God.


    Gandolf, why is it that the only thing you can do is post OT references of how God is a killer? I will explain this yet again, and chances are I'll get a "Oh, that's just an excuse. You're saying it's a parable because you don't want to admit that your God does bad stuff."

    He destroyeth the perfect and the wicked. If the scourge slay suddenly, he will laugh at the trial of the innocent.
    -Job 9:22-23


    You have to be careful with Job. It's a very poetic/symbolic (Yes, the Bible does contain symbolism.) book that is filled with quotes from Job's friends that, when quoted out of context, seem to contradict alot of what the Bible says. In this case, Job is describing God's power over man to his three friends. If God said "I destroy the perfect and the wicked, and laugh at the trial of the innocent" it would be another matter entirely.

    Thus says the LORD, 'About midnight I am going out into the midst of Egypt, and all the firstborn in the land of Egypt shall die, from the firstborn of the Pharaoh who sits on his throne, even to the firstborn of the slave girl who is behind the millstones; all the firstborn of the cattle as well.
    -Exodus 11:4-5


    We've gone over this before. Punishment for sins against his people.

    Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
    -Samuel I 15:3


    Same.

    Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven; And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.
    -Genesis 19:24-25


    Punishment for sin. In this case, they were also warned.

    They utterly destroyed everything in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox and sheep and donkey, with the edge of the sword.
    -Joshua 6:21


    Destruction of a sinful people who were occupying the land that God had promised to the Israelites.


    And I've said this before, and I'll say it again: No one ever said the Bible was pretty. But the truth isn't always pretty.


  10. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    I know, and understand, what you both are saying. But He is Lord. For Him to allow everything would mean that He isn't Holy. Do we all agree there is a Creator? If so, then I think that Creator Lord over His creation, and does not have to explain Himself to anyone. For Him to accept everyone and everything would be to make us equal to Him. He is the judge. We are no where equal to Him, and are therefore under His authority.


    And Gadolf, those verses you posted are true. I guess He does kill. But He is Lord and if He chooses to kill, then so be it. But He also chooses to love. He chooses to show His love for us through the killing. Those that He spares appreciate Him all the more because of those He kills. The evil in the world makes us appreciate the Good so much more. The medicine makes us appreciate the sickness. Without the sickness, death, and evil, there would be no purpose for the medicine, life, and Good.


    Edit: And what NRI said. :p God is Lord, and has power to destroy, but He doesn't do it without reason, as IellaWessiriNRI has pointwed out.
  11. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    "Destruction of a sinful people who were occupying the land that God had promised to the Israelites."

    Yeah, they should have known better. Damn babies.

    "He is Lord and if He chooses to kill, then so be it."

    Does might make right then, 201?
  12. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    Heaven forbid i try to create some common ground here, similar to "at the end of the day, we're all americans." or whatever.

    We're all posting at the same time.

    "We've gone over this before. Punishment for sins against his people.

    Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
    -Samuel I 15:3

    Same. "

    wtf?

    "They utterly destroyed everything in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox and sheep and donkey, with the edge of the sword.
    -Joshua 6:21

    Destruction of a sinful people who were occupying the land that God had promised to the Israelites. "

    wtf pt. 2?

    Is this the Godfather Saga??





  13. IellaWessiriNRI Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 3, 2001
    star 4
    Their parents should have known better. What would you have wanted them to do? Kill the parents, then adopt all the babies?
  14. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    Why not adopt them? More children for God.

    Nah. Killing them is so much easier.
  15. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Or leave the babies there to fend for themselves?


    Edit: Geist, all I can say is God has His reasons. Who are we, as man, to question Him. He gave life, and therefore has the ability to take it away. And besides, physical death is obviously not what you think it is. It's not as bad as you think. By killing the babies, He only takes them to heaven sooner than expected.
  16. IellaWessiriNRI Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 3, 2001
    star 4
    Gentiles. Do you want me to explain it?
  17. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    Don't try to tell me that God favors ethnic purity. Yugoslavia, anyone?
  18. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    I always thought jesus loved the little children, all the children of the world. I guess that song was blasphemy.


    I can't believe we're rationalizing murdering children as an example of God's love. And him showing that he loves us by who he kills, that's probably the first thing Osama bin Laden says every morning when he gets out of bed.
  19. Ender Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 1998
    star 6
    Oh, I dunno. Maybe ask the Jews to adopt them and brain...uh, teach them about Judaism?

    God's a big boy(?)I'm sure he could figure out something other than killing the babies?
  20. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    There he is. I was hoping ender would come along.
  21. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    But He chose not to, Ender.
  22. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    The idea that killing is all right if it's done in God's name is the idea that sent those planes into the WTC.
  23. cydonia Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 6, 2001
    star 5
    You know, since babies are innocent, they should have got the same deal the christians will get, rapture.

    You know, so the innocent can avoid all the tribulations and stuff.
  24. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    No it's not, Geist. Man does not have the right to judge man. God does, however.
  25. Darth Geist Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 23, 1999
    star 5
    "But He chose not to."

    Or, more likely, the Israelites raped their way through their neighbors in a bid for territory, then justified it by writing in their history books that God told them to do it.
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