What EU character could see logically added into a SW movie

The story was not written after TPM, it was written prior to TPM, several years if I'm not mistaken.

My parents would consider me a firefighter. You don't have to be in a organization in order to have a name.

 

in AotC Anakin talks about how much he likes being around Padme to which Obi-wan tells him "his commitment to the Jedi is not easly broken" and he when he wants to go save Padme hes told not to let his personal feelings get in the way or he'll be exspelled.

These show that a Jedi falling in love and developing a relationship with someone is enough to get them exspelled. Whatever Qui-Gon has done wasn't enough. For example, the Corellian Jedi rarly leaving the Corellian system could be against the code, but its not major enough to exspell them, however getting into a relationship is enough, so they aren't getting married.

 

"The Corellian Jedi marrying would be violating the code which would get them exspelled from the order. "

Even if this were true, which it very well be, I don't think the Corellian Jedi would give a rip. So they're not offially recognized by the council, who cares?

 

"Even if this were true, which it very well be, I don't think the Corellian Jedi would give a rip. So they're not offially recognized by the council, who cares? "

Then they aren't Corellian Jedi. So Corrans grandfather was a "force adept" (to uset he RPG terms). Which fits just fine, but he wasn't a Jedi.

 

Being different is fine. Wearing green (even though a Corellian Jedi in the movie doesn't), staying in their home sector etc... But they don't go against the code or the council, if they did they would be kicked otu and no longer be Jedi.


Ok, let me make my analogy better fit what I am trying to convey here...


Say I am part of a very large company. I have been there all my life. There are different departments, but we all do the same things. We all file the same paperwork, we all call the same clients, and we all get paid the same.

Now, my department, Department A, knows it is against company policy to wear jeans. Why? The company thinks it shows informality within their employees.

The department next to us, Department B, is allowed by the company to wear jeans. Why? They are different from our department and there is reasoning that they can wear jeans. But it is OK, but they are Department B and I am in Deparment A. We are all in the same company and ruled by the same Administration, but they don't go on business trips.

Now, one day, I really felt like wearing jeans. I really loved this pair of jeans, and they were very comfortable jeans. So I go to the Administration and ask.

"Can I eat wear this pair of jeans?"

And they say "No."

Now I remember that Department B is allowed, so I say..

"But Department B is allowed, why can't I?"

And they say "Because you are in Department A, not Department B."

But this pair of jeans really appeals to me, so I dig further...

"Why is Department B allowed and not me?"

And they reply "Because, for one thing, they have more individuality. Now get back to work. And they are Department B. You are Department A. You are not in Department B. They are not in Department A. Got it?"






I think you are overrating the Jedi here, ladka. They are not "supreme beings", and they do not always follow the Code. Ever heard of "Rules are made to be broken"? That's right...


Ken Kenobi- And you have a nice day

 

"Which fits just fine, but he wasn't a Jedi. "

accourding to whom? The council? but I thought we already established that the Corellian Jedi don't give a hoot about the council. so who cares if the council recognizes them as Jedi? Certainly not the Corellian Jedi.

 

"I think you are overrating the Jedi here, ladka. They are not "supreme beings", and they do not always follow the Code. Ever heard of "Rules are made to be broken"? That's right" - If they didn't follow the rules then every other Jedi would be married, Qui-Gon (And other Jedi) would have taken more then one Padawan and more then 20 Jedi would have left the order.

It was made very clear in AotC that getting involved with someone and getting married would get a Jedi exspelled, the Corellian's would be exspelled if they got married. So either they were Jedi and didn't get married, or they weren't Jedi and did.

"accourding to whom? The council? but I thought we already established that the Corellian Jedi don't give a hoot about the council. so who cares if the council recognizes them as Jedi? Certainly not the Corellian Jedi" - Then they wouldn't be part of the order. To be a Jedi one is taken from his parents when they are very young and taken to the Corusant temple to be trained (we havn't seen another temple like this so why assume its there?). Then they are picked to be a Padawan. After years of being a Padawan they take a test at the Temple, once they pass it they become Jedi. If the Corellian "Jedi" do all of this independly of the Jedi Council with governs the Jedi and then breaks the code they wouldn't be reconized by the Council or the Senate and wouldn't Jedi. Its like the Police example, if an ex-officer trains people, gives them the tools and orders them to go solve crimes are they really cops? So either they aren't Jedi and marry, or they are Jedi and don't. I don't make the rules, thats just what they are.

 

If they didn't follow the rules then every other Jedi would be married, Qui-Gon (And other Jedi) would have taken more then one Padawan and more then 20 Jedi would have left the order.

Maybe other Corellian Jedi, but most certainly not Qui-Gon, considering the fact that he is NOT Corellian.


ladka, you are failing to see the point here. Many EU Sources- I, Jedi, HoloNet News, Elusion Illusion, etc. - show that Corellian Jedi (and, in reference, all Corellians) are different- yes, they are different- from others in the sense that they have a strong individuality and sense of self.

From the HoloNet News:

...Following Corellia's closing of borders on 3:14, many insiders and Jedi observers were uncertain as to the status of the Jedi Knights operating in the sector...

Already you can see that they are quite independent of the Order, despite having their core connections tie-in with the Council.

..."Our commitment is to the Jedi Council and the Republic that it serves, but we are Corellians by blood and will always have a connection to our home," said returning Jedi Knight Nejaa Halcyon.

This solidifies the fact that the Corellian Jedi were still Jedi, but also had such a strong linking to their customs that they are a bit different from your "run-of-the-mill" Jedi.

The Jedi Council respected this and, being such a organization as it is, prioritized these traditions and let them marry.


I'm not saying that this idea was generally accepted- it wasn't. All Jedi were concerned about the Corellian Jedi- their "rogue" like ways created a concern "to the status of the Jedi Knights operating in the sector."



Now, all of the above stemmed from EU sources (which in turn balances out anything seeming like a contradiction with the movies), but below is a piece of information I found that is not only official, but also a swift end to this debate. Read on.



To begin, one must start the very beginning. Remember that the Jedi in question here is not Nejaa Halcyon (Corran's grandfather) or Valin Halcyon (AKA Hal Horn). To begin, you must remember the first ancestor of these Jedi- Keiran Halcyon.


Now, this debate has been about the marriage of Jedi. Key points have come up in the idea that Corellian Jedi are different and would be allowed to marry. As much as this may be a legitimate reason, there is another one, which should be more accepted to those reluctant to believe the Council would be so leniant to let a sect of Knights marry.


Keiran came from a long line of Halcyon Jedi, as quoted below:

...Kieran was part of the legendary Halcyon line hailing from the planet of Corellia, ancestor to Nejaa Halcyon and Corran Horn.

This not only wholeheartidly shows that an ancestry was created between Corran and a Jedi, but leads up to the information to finally put this debate at rest.

From the Official Star Wars Site, Ask the JC:

If it is forbidden for the Jedi to marry, then how does one explain Nomi Sunrider?

Nomi Sunrider is a Jedi of old, predating the current Jedi Code. Back then, thousands of years ago, one can find examples of Jedi behavior that would be forbidden in modern times. The great Master Arca Jeth trained no less than three Padawans - Ulic Qel-Droma, Cay Qel-Droma and Tott Doneeta. The current Code did away with multiple apprentices to better guide a young Padawan's path in the Force

Now, that question may not have directly pertained to Keiran or the Halcyon line, but it did provide that key sentence...

Back then, thousands of years ago, one can find examples of Jedi behavior that would be forbidden in modern times.

Keiran was one of these Jedi. He had offspring, of which Nejaa was a part of. Granted the Code had changed, but Nejaa was

 

"ladka, you are failing to see the point here. Many EU Sources- I, Jedi, HoloNet News, Elusion Illusion, etc. - show that Corellian Jedi (and, in reference, all Corellians) are different- yes, they are different- from others in the sense that they have a strong individuality and sense of self"

Thats great. But once the MOVIES haev established the Jedi don't married or they get exspelled those EU sources need to change or they create a conflict.

"Key points have come up in the idea that Corellian Jedi are different and would be allowed to marry" - No, they aren't. If one Jedi would be kicked out disobying that part of the code, all would be. If that changed the Jedi code and council would be underminded.

"Keiran came from a long line of Halcyon Jedi" - No he didn't because he didn't have kids. Either that or he came from a long line of "force adepts".

"He had offspring, of which Nejaa" - No, Luke and Leia are the only offspring of a Jedi, which is why GL made the "no marring rule".

"Plain and simple, easy as pie. Case closed, and back to the matter at hand" - Yes Corran's grandfather is either just a force adept or not a Jedi. Take your pick.

 

The movies never said how long jedi haven't been allowed to marry. This was started when the order was revamped after Ruusan. Its conceivable and true that some jedi decided they didn't want to be a part of the newer stricter order, so groups like the corellians stayed isolated. Remember, the Jedi started the council, they can decide whether or not to abide by it. We don't know of anyone getting kicked out of the order, so we don't know exactly what that would take.

 

"Its conceivable and true that some jedi decided they didn't want to be a part of the newer stricter order, so groups like the corellians stayed isolated"

Then they were no longer Jedi, just force users.

 

How? If some jedi decided they wanted to put a council together, it doesn't mean everyone else doesn't count since they didn't agree!

 

I believe that, with all of the information and extremely valid sources that have been both referenced and stated, that there is no longer any room for debate. We have come to a point in this discussion that information is being traded for crude opinion and conversation is being traded for argument.


I think it is long overdue that we get back to the true meaning of this thread.


Ken Kenobi- And you have a nice day

 

"How? If some jedi decided they wanted to put a council together, it doesn't mean everyone else doesn't count since they didn't agree" - Because the Jedi are connected with the Republic, the Corellian force users wouldn't be. Its like the cop example again. If a unit all quits but still do their jobs they aren't cops anymore.

"I believe that, with all of the information and extremely valid sources that have been both referenced and stated, that there is no longer any room for debate" - Your right, the movies (which ANYONE who works on the movies, writes the novels, books or comics) will you tell that the "movies come first". If someone is said in the movies its up the EU to change to that. In the movie we found out Jedi can't marry, if they do they will be exspelled. So the corellian Jedi either didn't marry, or wheren't Jedi. Like I said I really don't see what the problem is its not like Corrans character really changes.

 

I say we just agree to disagree. Deal?

 

ladka: Oh my gosh- do you not get it?

If it ever seems like the EU contradicts the movies, it doesn't- why? Because it balances it self out with clear, precise, and valid justification and reasoning.


Must I post that quote again?

If it is forbidden for the Jedi to marry, then how does one explain Nomi Sunrider?

Nomi Sunrider is a Jedi of old, predating the current Jedi Code. Back then, thousands of years ago, one can find examples of Jedi behavior that would be forbidden in modern times. The great Master Arca Jeth trained no less than three Padawans - Ulic Qel-Droma, Cay Qel-Droma and Tott Doneeta. The current Code did away with multiple apprentices to better guide a young Padawan's path in the Force.

Keiran was of a Halcyon because at that time it was not against the Code to marry. And he had offspring because at that time it was not against the Code to marry.

His offspring included Nejaa- "but he can't have offspring because Jedi can't marry", you say

Well he could, because at that time it was not against the Code to marry.


What was that?

At that time it was not against the Code to marry.



There is nothing to contradict that. Nothing at all. Corran is the descendant of the Halcyon bloodline, of which were Jedi.

"But Jedi can't marry...it says so in the movies..." you say.


Well, that's true, but at that time it was not against the Code to marry. I'll say it again, the key phrase that solves this mess:

Back then, thousands of years ago, one can find examples of Jedi behavior that would be forbidden in modern times.

Yes, Keiran is part of the Halcyon bloodline. Nejaa followed in his ancestors footsteops. Corran did as well.

Why? at that time it was not against the Code to marry.



Now, I suggest we get back to the topic at hand. Like I said, there is no longer any room for debate.


Ken Kenobi- And you have a nice day

 

"If it ever seems like the EU contradicts the movies, it doesn't- why? Because it balances it self out with clear, precise, and valid justification and reasoning" - In some cases, but NOT the case of the Corellian Jedi getting married. You can bring up every single piece of EU there is, but in teh end the movie says they can't marry and if they do they are exspelled, if ANY Jedi (corellian or not) married they wouldn't be Jedi anymore.

"Well he could, because at that time it was not against the Code to marry" - But Corrans grandfather was alive during the clonewars when it was against the code to marry, so either he wasn't married or he wasn't a Jedi, take your pick.