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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST What exactly is "The Awakening"?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by Moojieba, Dec 22, 2015.

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  1. Darth Geezy

    Darth Geezy Jedi Master star 3

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    Jan 29, 2016
    Any chance that Ren felt the force in Finn when he walked past him on Jakku and paused to stare at him? Or was this simply him noticing someone not shooting.

    Also, it could be argued that Finn heard the screams of people on Hosnian Prime. Perhaps he "felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced"
     
  2. DARTH_BELO

    DARTH_BELO Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 25, 2003
    Yeah-after what I've seen now from TFA, I have been wondering what "awakening" was being referred to. Perhaps we'll find out something more about this later in the ST?? [face_dunno]
     
  3. Rancor Keeper

    Rancor Keeper Jedi Master star 1

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    Dec 28, 2015
    [​IMG]

    One of the Topps collector cards was titled "Finn's Awakening". It showed Boyega on set in his Stormtrooper armor, pointing a blaster while taking direction from JJ. Was the team at Topps just making their best guess when naming the cards and they have it all wrong, or perhaps were they basing the title on an earlier script they had access to when designing the cards?
     
  4. Ricardo Funes

    Ricardo Funes Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Dec 18, 2015
    The awakening is Rey.

    Even Snoke said to Kylo "there has been an awakening... have you felt it?"
     
  5. Dagobah Dragonsnake

    Dagobah Dragonsnake Jedi Master star 4

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    Feb 7, 2016
    I would presume that the Force needs to Awaken in someone or in several people or for people in certain situations. There is no allusion in VII that the Force itself ever went to sleep, and for me that whole concept of the Force taking a nap between ROTJ and TFA just does not work. People tap into and use the Force, so it awakens in people. The Force itself is constant, it does not snooze.

    For me it is clear that - as shown to us - Rey is the subject of an awakening within her. From the first hints when she is flying the Falcon, to the psychometic vision, then the major jolt during the Kylo mind probe; she shows an awakening of the force that is much more explicit and direct than any other we may perceive or hope for in the next two episodes. Whether it could refer to others' awakenings, there seems slim to no equivalent evidence to this point.
     
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  6. LORD_BINX

    LORD_BINX Jedi Master star 1

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    Apr 20, 2005
    Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Especially regarding elements of the film that weren't blatantly explained. In my opinion, this post hits the nail right on the head.

    However, one other thing I was wondering was about the possibility that either Kylo, or Snoke was the one who actually suppressed Rey's memories. For Snoke to say, "There's been AN AWAKENING" suggests to me that an awakening has happened before, and that Kylo & Snoke have been down that road once before and that Snoke doesn't want to go back down that road because the last one was pretty bumpy. What if each awakening comes with it's own re-awakened jedi who comes after them.

    I get the feeling that it might be reminiscent of when the clones removed their brain chips (clone wars reference) and became independent thinkers, free of the empire's control.
     
  7. jimtalkbox

    jimtalkbox Jedi Master star 1

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    Dec 22, 2015

    Almost made me spit-take my coffee... almost...
     
  8. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Chosen One star 5

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    Mar 10, 2005
    I think they were just playing around with the title.
    Finn does awaken from his First Order indoctrination, though. Maybe they were aware of that.
     
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  9. DavidSword79

    DavidSword79 Jedi Knight star 3

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    Dec 27, 2015
    The title has multiple applications and meanings.

    The Force awakens in Finn when he decides to go rogue and refuses to gun down innocents.

    The Force awakens in Rey when she has a vision of the past imparted to her by Skywalker's lightsaber.

    It awakens more strongly when she quiets her mind and uses her Jedi powers to escape her bonds.

    It awakens still more powerfully within her during her duel with Kylo Ren.

    Overall, the Force awakens in the galaxy in response to Dark side-users coming into power.
     
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  10. Vorax

    Vorax Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Jun 10, 2014
    Seems to be Star Wars version of the Quickening from Highlander.
     
  11. AllEyezOnTheDarkSide

    AllEyezOnTheDarkSide Jedi Knight star 2

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    Nov 25, 2015
    The awakening was ultimately the lightside awakening in Rey and Finn. But the awakening occurred in Finn first and THAT is what Snoke felt in TFA.

    Snoke mentions the awakening to Kylo AFTER Finns freakout on Jakku (which is obvious because the Jakku raid was the first scene of the film) and BEFORE Reys encounter with Anakins lightsaber.....as in the scene with Snoke is immediately followed by Han and the gang landing on Takodana for the first time.

    I also find it telling that right after Snoke questions Ren on the "Awakening" he says that "if Skywalker returns the new Jedi will rise".

    So what we have is:

    Slip dies while he touches Finns helmet as a "force sound" is heard playing----> Finn has a bizzare freakout-----> Kylo thinks he's felt something coming from FN-2187, prompting an intense stare off scene-----> Snoke mentioning that an awakening has occurred and Kylo agreeing------>Snoke warns Kylo of Luke's return and the rise of new Jedi. ALL before Rey has had ANY interaction with the force in TFA.

    To me this is NO COINCIDENCE. I feel like this is meant to be an "AH HA!" moment for us once we've seen Episode 8 and it's (possibly) revealed that Finn is force sensitive.



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  12. RobbyV

    RobbyV Jedi Master star 4

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    Dec 22, 2015
    AllEyezOnTheDarkSide,

    The Awakening was the Force in Rey, when she piloted the Millennium Falcon. All her force-related acts (I counted 7) were shown with the same pattern of initial failure (sloppy MF take-off), quick recovery, before succeeding in a way that surprised even her. Those patterns were no coincidence. The other instances were:
    1. Saving Finn from the Rathtars (initial mistake was releasing them, then sign of surprise was the "That was lucky" statement)
    2. Shooting stormtroopers with the blaster (again, she surprised herself)
    3. Rey beating Kylo's mind-read (failure first, then again, a face of bewilderment before we cut to Snoke angry with Kylo)
    4. Rey's mind-tricks on the stormtrooper (failure first, success, then surprise)
    5. Rey's saber grab (first beaten by Kylo's telekinesis, then she beats him at telekinesis, then surprised face once more)
    6. Beating Kylo at the duel (though no surprise anymore -- probably by now she's more or less convinced what's been making her do all those amazing stuff)
    Finn's was simply a guilty conscience or wavering loyalty that Kylo sensed -- which we confirm later when he tells Hux it was the "one from the village" who helped Poe escape. Kylo is somehow very sensitive to strong emotions of people nearby -- such as when he senses Rey still wanting to kill him at the start of her interrogation.

    Finn didn't need the Force to decide to defect. Stormtroopers are people too. The book Before the Awakening has Finn already painted as a sympathetic guy who can't follow orders when it comes to aiding his fellow stormtroopers, especially "Slip" (who died in his arms on Jakku). What happened on Jakku with Finn was just the natural progression of his character from the book. So his crisis of conscience has been brewing for some time.

    The TFA novelization makes this clear -- with Kylo's "it is you" statement when Rey grabbed the saber from him. This has been verified by Pablo Hidalgo as referring to the awakening they felt, though he mistakenly says that Kylo also said it in the movie: https://twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/680137218195734528

    And if you want to go with a technical analysis, there would've been two awakenings already by the time Kylo and Snoke spoke of it if Finn were also "awakened", but they only refer to one event: "There has been an awakening."

    Not saying Finn might not still turn out later to be Force-sensitive, but in TFA there were hardly any signs of it. And I don't think there was a "Force sound" at that scene you mentioned.
     
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  13. AllEyezOnTheDarkSide

    AllEyezOnTheDarkSide Jedi Knight star 2

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    Nov 25, 2015
    I'm not really sure what your trying to say here... it seems like your trying to prove that Rey had an Awakening in TFA....OF COURSE she did I'm not denying that shes CLEARLY the SKYWALKER protagonist of the trilogy. Rey used the force MANY times in TFA (though saving Finn from the the rathers or piloting the millennium falcon have nothing to do with the awakening of the force.... especially the former....her natural talents with a space craft may indeed spawn frorm her connection to the force ala Anakin in TPM but her actual knowledge on how to fly spacecrafts come from her days of using a flight simulator on Jakku).

    What I'm trying to say is that this trilogys THREE central charcters are Rey, Ben AND Finn and that EACH are force sensitive and that the Awakening pertained to BOTH Rey and Finn.

    I'm trying to say that while on surface general audiences are meant to assume that the awakening only applied to Rey, JJ and Larry K have place hints throughout the film that Finn had also experienced an awakening himself and that this will fully come to light in the next installment of the trilogy.

    All the evidence is there if your willing to look and as far as the "force sound" I mentioned....its there....I've watched the movie more times than I can count replayed scenes over and over.... its all there.


    Here's a quote by Kasdan himself and a couple others by John....

    Larry:

    "Everyone who has seen these movies thinks about ‘I am your father …’ and ‘There is another …’ But neither of those things were in [1977’s original] Star Wars. Star Wars didn’t say Luke was the son of Vader. Star Wars didn’t say Leia was the sister of Luke. You didn’t understand what these references were: the Empire, dark times, Clone Wars. There were these things that were discussed that don’t get explained. George [Lucas] dropped you into a story and respected you to infer everything necessary to understand what you need to know… Can this movie actually also hold, ‘And Rey is this … And Finn is that … And this is where Poe is from …’ This is the first of a series. There is a story to be told. And it will be."

    John:

    “When I read the script I cried, and I’m not really a big crier. I’m more like a frog-in-the-throat kind of guy, who’ll try to hold it in and make sure I don’t let it all out. Finn is dope. His story is so epic. It’s a story that’s never been seen before, but it also mirrors the stories of Luke Skywalker and Han Solo. And he’s quirky and charismatic and funny. For me, he was the best character in the script.”

    John again:

    "Finn is on a journey, much like the origin stories of gods and superheroes from other mythologies. All the characters we love — Batman, Spider-Man — never ever start off as those guys,” Boyega says in his rich British accent.


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  14. seattlemusicnerd

    seattlemusicnerd Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 23, 2014
    I don't know about the "force sound", but I still think Finn "heard" the sounds of the people in the Hosnian system. People may say it was people from Maz's castle or an error in sound editing, but until otherwise explained, that's what I'll continue to believe.

    That quote from John Boyega was pretty good. There never has been a story of a Stormtrooper who defected before. Somewhere else on this board, somebody suggested that Finn may lead a stormtrooper revolt, that that would truly be an amazing thing to see (though they'd have to learn to shoot better ;) ).
     
  15. dick rodgers

    dick rodgers Jedi Master star 4

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    Feb 23, 2016


    it was definitely the force. Ren isnt going to stop because 1 dumb stormtrooper didnt shoot.
     
  16. FanFromNY

    FanFromNY Jedi Knight star 2

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    Jan 28, 2016
    If going by ANH, then Obi-Wan heard the screams after Alderaan exploded. After the planet's destruction, the scene cut to Obi-Wan catching his breath and saying those lines. In TFA, Rey was shown after the destruction of the Hosnian system, running and stopping in her tracks as if she was catching her breath as well. So, Finn hearing screams before the billions of death doesn't match with how ANH played out.
     
  17. RobbyV

    RobbyV Jedi Master star 4

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    Dec 22, 2015
    I think it was clear what I was trying to say -- that there was one awakening and it was Rey's. I don't deny Finn might awaken later (or not), but all signs point to the Force being much asleep in Finn.

    "There has been AN awakening. Have you felt it?"

    Now people may want to argue that it can also apply to the philosophical sense -- that Finn's awakening is his conscience. But the title is The Force Awakens, not Awakenings (which was a good Robin Williams/Robert De Niro movie). And that's not how the Force works. The Force has never been anything that's been depicted to give individuals a crisis of conscience, which was what happened with Finn. You don't need the Force for that.

    I don't discount that maybe his mooment in Takodana was a FS-moment, but I think the jury is still out on that. It's strange that Finn didn't even wonder why he could hear the voices screaming if he did.

    And the stuff you quoted don't say anything about Finn's "awakening". They just say pretty much that there's still a story to be told about his own hero's journey -- perhaps the hero's journey of a regular guy, not a Force-sensitive (thus the comparison to Han Solo's character as well).
     
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  18. Darth Basin

    Darth Basin Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 15, 2015
    Finn didn't wonder about those voices is because he was watching 5 planets being vaporized.
     
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