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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST What happened to the actual Galactic Empire(not the First Order)?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by Erik290121, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. Erik290121

    Erik290121 Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Jan 2, 2016
    I'm just wondering if that's any canon information on it.

    I know that after the Concordance, a lot of pissed off True Believers fled to the Unknown Regions, and eventually reorganized themselves into what would be The First Order.

    But what of the Galactic Empire itself? From what I read, they retain undisputed control of the Inner Rim, sans Coruscant, and that the Galactic Empire itself was exhausted at that point.

    But all of that information is like....I don't know, only five years after Endor?

    By the time of the Force Awakens, is the Galactic Empire in the Inner Rim still a thing? Do they support the First Order? Has 30 years of isolation caused the Galactic Empire to be dismissive of The First Order(while still not supporting the New Republic)?

    Anyways, just curious. By TFA, is there any canon update on The Empire?
     
  2. AmySolo

    AmySolo Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 12, 2016
    Aren't there books filling in the gaps with info? I'm not certain but I've tidbits that are basically "They took off the head, now they had to finish slaying the beast that was the Empire's control" which took.... a while. That ship graveyard on Jakku? The battle happened a year after the events in RotJ.

    So yeah. Info exists but I think this is best asked in the canon thread where people can direct you to specific sources.
     
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  3. Knights of Ben

    Knights of Ben Jedi Padawan star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 30, 2016

    Just to post a relevant passage from the Visual Dictionary regarding the Empire and Jakku:

    "Jakku was once home to a secret Imperial research facility, and was the last rallying point of the Imperial fleet. Entering the atmosphere to tighten its cordon, the Empire fought determinedly to keep the New Republic from capturing the base. In its defence, doomed Imperial vessels used tractor beams to drag New Republic warships into the planet's surface. The retreating Imperials destroyed the base before disappearing into the Unknown Regions."
     
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  4. AmySolo

    AmySolo Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 12, 2016
    iiiinteresting. [face_thinking]
     
  5. Knights of Ben

    Knights of Ben Jedi Padawan star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 30, 2016
    Isn't it just? :)
     
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  6. Ubraniff Zalkaz

    Ubraniff Zalkaz Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 26, 2014
    I think the Empire retreated and came back as the First Order. I think that's what they want us to think, so maybe there's a twist somewhere or maybe not. I'm curious to know what they did once they retreated. My guess is that Thrawn took the Imperial remnant to the unkown regions to meet up with Snoke and plot a new course.
     
  7. Darth Basin

    Darth Basin Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2015
    Maybe there was a civil war between Pro Snoke & Anti Snoke factions?
     
  8. TCF-1138

    TCF-1138 Anthology/Fan Films/NSA Mod & Ewok Enthusiast star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 20, 2002
    Now that's a comic book series I wouldn't mind reading!

    Or better yet, a TV show I wouldn't mind watching!
     
  9. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    Unless I'm misunderstanding, I think he is referring to the post-Jakku treaty. I've not read much of the New EU material except the Tarkin novel and Vader comics, which obviously doesn't touch that time frame.

    My understanding though was that after the Battle of Jakku, a treaty was signed between the New Republic and Imperial Remnant that stipulated severe disarmament of the Imperial Remnant, and the New Republic in turn also began to dispand its forces.

    The segment of the Empire that fled into the Unknown Regions began to build up forces again in violation of the treaty and without the knowledge of the New Republic, who did not believe the First Order to be a threat.

    I think the question being asked here is what happened to the Imperial Remnant that stayed behind and did not flee into the Unknown Regions. Did they get assimilated into the New Republic? Did they join the First Order? Are they a third faction that opposes both FO and NR? Do they even exist during the timeframe of TFA?

    I don't know the answers to any of those questions. The novel's may have explained their fate, or maybe the story is still unfolding. I don't know.
     
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  10. Lt. Hija

    Lt. Hija Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 8, 2015
    This is exactly the core issue I tried to address in various other threads at the JCF in the past week.

    I'd like to believe that the 2nd biggest SW myth isn't really the size of the Imperial Starfleet but rather the notion that "Imperials vs. Rebels" is some kind of conflict between nations while it is indeed (don't take my word for it, just read the ANH prologue) a "civil war" where - put simply - the Rebels (all of them "Imperial citizens", too) are trying to overthrow the political regime governing the Empire and seize control of the "Empire" by themselves.

    So unless the Imperial Starfleet is sworn to exclusively serve the Emperor (and not the Empire), it's the executive force of the ruling body and the moment the government changed the Imperial Starfleet would have been obliged to continue its service under the new authorities.

    Apparently, the nuCanon behind TFA suggests that several officers of the Imperial Starfleet decided to become new "rebels".

    Yet, being expelled from the core worlds and its infrastructure and unless these remnants seized the Empire's treasury, ongoing nuCanon better explains how these "renegades" could successfully establish another political (First) order in the under-developped regions of the Outer Rim.
     
  11. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    While the Galactic Civil War was a Civil War between the State and a substate entity (the Rebellion), the conflict now seems to have evolved into one between States.

    The Rebellion was an insurgency, not a government. When the American Civil War happened, efforts were made by the North to treat the Confederacy at traitors/insurgents, rather than treating them as a sovereign state, since secession was viewed as illegal, and their claims to a new government were seen as illegitimate. This caused issues at the end of the war, since having been labeled as treasonous individuals, handling the South would have warranted harsher action, but nobody wanted to see the wholesale massacre of prisoners of war as the result of treason charges.

    The same thing could be said of the Imperial views of the Rebellion (minus the clemency part). They were not recognized as a sovereign entity, and instead are treated as a treasonous substate entity.

    While the American Civil War ended with unconditional surrender, but the GCW did not. And when a treaty gets signed delineating legal boundaries and terms, the New Republic is now recognized as a sovereign government by the Empire and in turn recognizes the Empire's legal control of various systems.

    In the end, what started as a war to overthrow the government ended up doing little than leading to secession, with the Empire not surrendering unconditionally, but instead entering into a treaty with the New Republic, both as sovereign entities.
     
  12. Lt. Hija

    Lt. Hija Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 8, 2015
    So according to nuCanon the GFFA turned into a condition that could have already been achieved 25 years earlier by allowing the separatists to establish a government of their own.

    Just makes me wonder whether that's what the Alliance truly had in mind when they started taking up arms against the Empire. I don't believe that's what Lucas ever had in mind.
     
  13. Millennium Falcon 888

    Millennium Falcon 888 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 6, 2016
    I have a funny feeling that the remnant of the Empire that didn't flee to the Unknown Regions must have gone from place to place throughout the Galaxy, in a nomadic lifestyle akin to pirates... And will rise as a third force opposed to BOTH the New Republic / Resistance and First Order - led by our new villain, played by Benicio Del Toro!
     
  14. TaradosGon

    TaradosGon Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Feb 28, 2003
    Well, Lucas had been insisting up and down that the story ended after ROTJ. So I don't think it was what he imagined. To him, I think ROTJ was his happily ever after ending. Especially with the special editions, in which all corners of the Galaxy, from Core (Coruscant) to Outer Rim (Tatooine) are celebrating their freedom after Palpatine's death.

    But TFA and the NEU undermined the notion of a happy ending, and that war exhaustion led to a treaty rather than unconditional surrender of the Empire.
     
  15. Ubraniff Zalkaz

    Ubraniff Zalkaz Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 26, 2014
    I think the time between the battle of Endor and the battle of Jakku should be an anthology film. It could pick up right after Endor and follow the chess moves the Rebellion and Empire make up until they meet at Jakku for one huge battle before the Empire basically flees to beyond the outer rim. Call it The Fall of an Empire.