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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST What has Rey Actually Accomplished?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by LastJediKnight, Dec 26, 2017.

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  1. LastJediKnight

    LastJediKnight Jedi Knight star 4

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    Dec 19, 2015
    I got to thinking about the question and am curious as to the answer. Lets recap:

    In TFA:

    * She managed to fly the Millennium Falcon.
    * She managed to close a door to save Finn.
    * She did get the Blue Lightsaber.
    * The Starkiller Base was brought down by Han Solo and The Resistance. Rey had no part in this and was largely just a spectator and ride-a-long. She did best Kylo Ren in battle, which had no effect on the overall outcome.

    In TLJ:

    * She doesn't get trained by Luke so much as lectured as to why the Jedi should end. Even that wasn't completed.
    * She gets no real training before leaving Ahch-to with the Jedi texts.
    * Snoke is killed by Kylo Ren, not her. She does manage to help Kylo Ren defeat Snoke's guards.
    * She faces Kylo Ren, which has absolutely no effect on the overall battle.
    * She once again defeats Kylo Ren(implied and off-screen this time), before once again leaving him alive.
    * Snoke's ship and fleet is crippled by Holdo, not her.
    * She does manage to lift some rocks so that the last remaining members of The Resistance can escape and form the new REBEL ALLIANCE. So that's something.

    My big question here being.. where is the big potatoes? She seems to be ancilliary to the overall story with little effect on the outcome, yet she's supposed to be the main protagonist. There doesn't seem to be a character-defining win for her. At this point in the OT, Luke had blown up the Death Star and faced Vader on Bespin, at the loss of his hand, to help save his friends.

    She has no Big Wins that I can see, and No Teacher(or are Force Ghosts as good as alive people at that now?) two movies in, yet she's now left to defeating Kylo's First Order, and restarting the Jedi(even though she has no training), all in one movie.

    So do tell, what has she accomplished that is noteworthy and helped bring down TFO?
     
  2. cerealbox

    cerealbox Force Ghost star 6

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    May 5, 2016
    She stalled Kylo long enough in the Takodona forest, for BB-8 to escape.

    Leia chose her to bring back Luke, which she did at critical time. She and Chewie took care of the tie fighters shooting the resistance.

    She freed the resistance survivors from the cave.


    At present time, she is the resistance's only resource able to counter Kylo Ren.
     
  3. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Aug 5, 2001
    What do you mean "now"? When Ben was sitting on a log shootin' the breeze with Luke in RotJ, what was stopping him from passing on all of the lessons or knowledge that he chose to? Same will apply with Luke.

    As for Rey, it's fair to say her standing up to Snoke was the inspiration for Kylo to turn on him. Did Kylo show any hint of doing so in their previous meetings? She & Chewie saved the Resistance by taking on the TIE's, then Rey again saved the entire Resistance by freeing them from the mine on Crait. She was also crucial in helping to entice Luke out of his malaise. Which led to him saving the Resistance in a way which has made him a legend & inspiration to the entire galaxy. So there's that.
     
  4. SmokeMonster4815162342

    SmokeMonster4815162342 Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 31, 2015
    She helped get BB-8 back to the Resistance and prevented it from falling into the hands of the First Order on Jakku.
     
  5. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    Rey didn’t bring back Luke. Yoda did.

    Luke only came at a “critical” time to allow a few people to survive the decimation of the Resistance. He didn’t return at a critical time to help the Resistance flee undecimated. His absence contributed to the galaxy refusing to help Leia’s Resistance, which directly led to the absolute devastation of the resistance.
     
  6. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    No, they both did. Luke stopped cutting himself off from the Force due to Rey's visit. Which allowed Yoda to appear to him. Yoda held Rey up as the crucial hope left for them. Which inspired Luke to act.
    Yet the final scene points to his act on Crait having potentially huge ramifications. It could galvanize the entire galaxy to the cause.
     
  7. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    The point is, Rey herself didn’t persuade Luke to come back, which was her mission. Luke wasn’t moved by her words or her anything. Rey was just a girl that happened to have a high midichlorian count, and show up with R2, that lied to him, attacked him, and stole from him. Without Yoda talking to Luke, Luke would have sat on Ahch-To until he died. Without R2 and Leia’s message, Luke wouldn’t have trained her. RJ took pains not to make any of these accomplishments Rey’s.

    And yet, the Resistance is still massacred unlike anything we’ve seen in SW since RotS, and 99% of the people that ever believed in Luke and Leia were slaughtered for it with nothing to show for it.
     
  8. Aetius888

    Aetius888 Jedi Master star 2

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    May 23, 2005
    The most under-discussed problem (not that it's been ignored) is that Rey disappears for so long at the end of the movie.
     
  9. LordDallos

    LordDallos Jedi Master star 3

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    Feb 2, 2016
    I think she has accomplished quite a bit. I’m still just trying to figure out how in many ways.
     
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  10. Strategize

    Strategize Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 18, 2017
    Because she's not a hero, not yet. Don't say stuff like "but Luke had done this". She's not Luke, she's Rey and now she's setup to become the hero in 9.

    TFA: Learning she's special.
    TLJ: Learning she needs to use her specialness to become a hero.
    IX: Becoming and being the hero.
     
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  11. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    Yes she did. She moved him to tap back into the Force. Reaching out to Leia & (possibly) helping to save her from her condition. Opening himself up to Yoda's contact, where he persuaded Luke to come back into the fold to help develop Rey. Then Luke declares to Kylo that he would not be the last Jedi. Rey will be, & more following her. Luke is back. Rey succeeded. Your argument is like saying that Luke didn't convince Yoda to train him in TESB. Ben's words did the trick. No, they both convinced him together.
    Losses are suffered in war. It's likely that Luke's act will have more positive effect than anything he could've done in person.
     
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  12. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Chosen One star 10

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    Feb 18, 2014
    She does sorta help with giving Kylo the opportunity to kill Snoke
     
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  13. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    Does she? She tells Chewie before she leaves on the escape pod to wait for her signal to meet up again. Then we're told she escaped on Snoke's craft. I'm not seeing a problem or mystery.
     
  14. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    No. Persuasion has an actual definition. Yoda persuaded Luke. Rey being there led to that. If Rey gets credit for persuasion she didn’t do, you might as well add R2 to the mix to share in the credit with Yoda and Rey.

    It says something about what RJ wrote that people have to stretch so hard to come up with accomplishments for our new hero.


    The Resistance didn’t suffer losses. It was defeated. It no longer exists.
     
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  15. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    Very inflexible simplistic way of looking at things. So I suppose ghost Ben's words were solely responsible for persuading Yoda to train Luke. Luke himself had nothing to do with it o_O
    You have seen the movie right? Specifically the part where Leia says they have everything they need for a Rebellion, & then we see a shot of people in the galaxy being inspired, which is supposed to be one example among many?
     
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  16. ThreeDeathstickProblem

    ThreeDeathstickProblem Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2014
    Rey accomplished going to the dark side in TLJ. Quoth Yoda:
    Rey was full of fear over her abandonment and loneliness, and in that fear she sought an easy path with Kylo. She displays all the dark side traits in the throne room fight too, showing immense anger and aggression.

    Yoda: "A Jedi uses the Force for knowledge and defense, NEVER for attack."
    Rey: "Hold my blue milk while I go murder a room full of people with my new space boyfriend."

    Luke said he won't be the last Jedi, but given all this, and given he refused to teach Rey any Jedi-specific tenets to counter the darker impulses she freely explores and fully enjoys with Kylo, I'm guessing he meant someone other than Rey. Because Rey is pretty clearly a dark sider now. :cool:
     
  17. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    You say “simplistic,” I say “accurate.” But I’m sure you also credit R2 and are generally very consistent in your flexible applications of credit for doing something not specifically done.

    Lol I have never ever ever credited Luke with that lmao. Yoda was always going to train Luke, but he was always ambivalent about it. That specific moment in ESB came across to me, though, as part of his whole act he was putting on for the whiny kid as part of his lesson plan.

    Yes. Leia was being idealistic. I mean, you’ve seen the movie right? Do you call 20 people with one freighter, no army, ships, weapons or allies a “rebellion”? I don’t. It took 20 years to go from no rebellion in RotS but a few well-connected people as “the spark to light the fire” lol, to the rebel alliance’s first victory.
     
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  18. Ruffmeian

    Ruffmeian Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 19, 2015
    JJ: “Long before we had this title, the idea of The Force Awakens was that this would become the evolution of not just a hero, but a villain,” Abrams said. “And not a villain who was the finished, ready-made villain, but someone who was in process.”

    I’ve always felt that Rey was still developing her foundation, and in IX we’ll see her completion as the hero. No one is completely satisfied with Kylo’s villain, but he’s making ground as the series continues. Rey is, too. We get to see the path they both take. She succeeded in TFA and then felt defeat in TLJ, but accepted it. Leia even said “we have all we need” to move forward, and Rey will find her resolve and be even stronger.
     
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  19. cerealbox

    cerealbox Force Ghost star 6

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    May 5, 2016
    More like 40 people.

    But it's always darkest before the dawn.
     
  20. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    Your semantics aside, Rey was instrumental in Luke's choices & actions at the end of the movie. Fact.
    & the FO are not a galaxy spanning long established government. They're a militaristic group who've just lost their super-weapon & leader within a few days. Perhaps Leia's assessment took that into account. Perhaps she has a Force-sense of how things will play out. We'll see.
     
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  21. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    Lol sure, semantics aside she was “instrumental.”

    Now this is actually an interesting point. I have been assuming all along that the FO has unlimited resources more than even the Empire because RJ or someone said that in an interview. Also, vague though the ST has been about the state of the galaxy, I had the impression that the FO was already starting to take over worlds in TFA. Otherwise they wouldn’t have been so well known by that point. In this movie, the fact that the galaxy at large gave up on resisting the genocidal fascists overtaking their galaxy told me that they had a tight grip on things. However,TLJ was pretty pathetically absent on explaining anything about the FO’s actual resources or position in the galaxy. Perhaps you’re right and we’ll learn in IX that the FO is actually quite small, and all we really have is a power vacuum?

    Somehow I doubt it though. Typing it out it sure doesn’t sound like an epic story in those terms.
     
  22. Darth Downunder

    Darth Downunder Chosen One star 6

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    Aug 5, 2001
    We know that the NR was the government. The capitol was destroyed & TLJ happens immediately after that. Clearly the FO don't instantly replace them. The movies explain enough, if you pay attention. SW isn't a series to go into great detail about geopolitics.
     
  23. oncafar

    oncafar Force Ghost star 6

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    Jan 10, 2017
    If Snoke is dead, Kylo wouldn't have been able to kill him without Rey there. Rey's attempt to reach out to the other side took out the big evil.
     
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  24. bluealien1

    bluealien1 Jedi Master star 4

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    Aug 14, 2015
    Astropolitics thank you :p
     
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  25. AhsokaSolo

    AhsokaSolo Force Ghost star 7

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    Dec 23, 2015
    No, this isn’t a question of paying attention, unless you’re going to get specific and cite an example from the movie to make your point, just like I did when I pointed out that TLJ made it clear that the entire galaxy had lost hope in their ability to stand against the FO.

    And SW is a series to go into specifics. The prequels quite obviously were all about that, maybe too much, and the OT made everything quite clear. ANH told us that the emperor disbanded the imperial senate. When someone questioned how he could possibly maintain power over individual systems without the appearance representative democracy, Tarkin explained that that was the entire point of the Death Star. A very specific fear would guarantee absolute power for the Emperor and his empire.
     
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