Speculation What if the "big assumptions" are wrong, and the Empire is still in control?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by Ghost, Jun 23, 2013.

  1. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    The Emperor was killed at the end of Episode 6 (along with a massive military defeat)... and there wasn't going to be an Episode 7... so everyone has just assumed this meant the Rebels would inevitably go on to win back the entire galaxy and restore the Republic.

    But with Episode 7 now being created... what if that assumption was wrong?

    And what if the other main assumptions... that Han and Leia get married and have kids (who get trained as Jedi), and that the Jedi are recreated by Luke... are also wrong?




    This is one way it could work, for an example...


    In the year following the Battle of Endor, the Empire is weakened and in turmoil, but still possesses the most powerful starfleet ever seen... and now no longer underestimates the Rebels. Palpatine's son is revealed to the galaxy (shunned and hidden by his father for not being able to use the Force), and he takes command of the Empire. With both the Imperial leaders and Rebel leaders sensing a long and bloody war that could take years or even decades to finish, the new Emperor proposes a compromise after negotiating with Rebel leaders in a deal brokered by Luke Skywalker.. The Empire retains control of the galaxy, but will undergo reforms that give more rights to the people and create a more constructive and egalitarian Empire. Also, Emperor Palpatine II proposes marriage to Princess Leia, and will allow their children to be trained in the Jedi arts by Leia's brother, as a grand symbolic gesture to seal the deal of peace and reform.

    Leia decides to sacrifice her own happiness, and marries Palpatine II, becoming Empress of the galaxy (which is actually very similar to how Lucas planned to use Leia in his original version of the Sequel Trilogy too). Han disappears and never marries. Luke trains Leia's son and daughter in the Jedi arts when they're children, as well as Force-sensitive Royal Guards to become the Imperial Jedi (serving the Empire like how the old Jedi served the Republic). Luke mysteriously disappears a few years before Leia Palpatine's children become adults, however. The Emperor and Empress are in a loveless marriage, but their marriage does keep the galaxy at peace (with Leia continually suggesting more reforms to her husband, and training her children in her point of view), and the two are always respectful and kind toward one another even though they both have very strong differing opinions.

    As for how Episode 7 could begin? Emperor Palpatine the Second is on his deathbed from sickness (older than Leia, in his 70's) and talks to his wife one last time. He's certain that their son, now a fully-trained Imperial Jedi in his 20's, will make an excellent Emperor. And is glad that his father would hate him for allowing his son to be a Jedi, and that a Jedi will soon sit on the Imperial throne... and that he beat his father as a ruler too, having a much longer reign, and it being one of peace and prosperity and reform. He says the galaxy owes it to Leia, for her personal sacrifice to marry him, 40 years earlier. He says that once he is gone, and their son coronated, Leia will be free, and hopes she can find Han Solo and spend the rest of her days in happiness with him. He dies. Days later, Leia's son is about to be coronated, when there is an attack. Leia Palpatine's son is apparently assassinated, along with many of his Imperial Jedi bodyguards. A 40 year old military man, who is an Admiral in the Empire's Starfleet, reveals he's behind it, abducts Leia's teenage daughter and forces her to marry him, and declares himself Emperor and a return to the old ways. Leia escapes capture with some Imperial Jedi, and goes to find Luke and Han to help rescue her daughter. Rebel groups begin to spring up, in backlash against the new Emperor, but they resort to terrorism. So begins the Sequel Trilogy.





    What do you think about the Empire potentially still being in control as Episode 7 begins? Or Han and Leia not being married? Or Luke not recreating the Jedi (or creating something very different instead)? It is all theoretically possible. What other assumptions do we have?
    Last edited by Summer Dreamer, Jun 23, 2013
  2. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    I fully expect the Empire to have a presence in the ST. How big? No idea. They will be there!
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  3. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    But I'm saying, what if there's no Republic, and a (possibly reformed) Empire is in complete control? For example, the Battle of Endor just forced the Imperial leaders to the negotiating table, and the Rebels agree to lay down arms if their conditions of reform were met. Perhaps Leia and Han never married either. And perhaps Luke didn't start up the Jedi again, or at least not like we imagined.
  4. Sistros Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2010
    star 6
    In the year following the Battle of Endor, the Empire is weakened and in turmoil, but still possesses the most powerful starfleet ever seen... and now no longer underestimates the Rebels.
    -----------------

    you just pretty much outlined the Thrawn Trilogy
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  5. Darth Chiznuk PT Trivia Master / Game Host

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    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 5
    I would say there is zero percent chance that the Empire will still be in charge in Episode VII. Honestly, I don't even want a Remnant. I want the Empire to be a distant but painful memory as the new trilogy starts up.
  6. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    The ST should be a wakeup call for those that believe the Empire collapsed immediately after ROTJ. I don't know if it be quite that of a wakeup call as you predict but since we have an ST, the happy ending of ROTJ is over. Anything is fair game.
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  7. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    The most powerful government of the first 6 movies gone for good? The Republic and the Empire it became? I can't see it being gone.
  8. Rachel_In_Red Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 12, 2013
    star 3
    I'm on board with this. I want the ST to move on from the Empire. I want it to be set some 30 years after ROTJ. There is a New Republic, Luke has brought back the Jedi Order, and there is a brand new threat to peace and prosperity. I want very few ties to the OT. I thought there were too many of those in the PT. I don't like for the Star Wars universe to seem small with the same few characters and planets being at the center of everything all the time.
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  9. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    Well, this isn't my prediction... just trying to challenge everyone's assumptions.
  10. chris hayes Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 13, 2012
    star 4
    No Empire please .....
  11. Darth Chiznuk PT Trivia Master / Game Host

    Game Host
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    Oct 31, 2012
    star 5
    I said I think the Empire will be completely gone but I'm hoping the Republic will have been restored in some form by this point. I don't think it's very realistic that the Empire would survive without the Emperor longer than they did with him.
  12. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    The Republic of the PT is dead. Consumed by the Empire. I don't see the Rebel Alliance being exactly the same. The Rebel Leaders wouldn't want to repeat the mistakes of the Old Republic. If the Empire gets someone charismatic and doesn't focus on building Superweapons and attempts to fix its image, a reformed Empire could work.
  13. darklordoftech Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    During the "Tragedy of Darth Vader" era, I figured that when Palpatine died, the Empire went back to being the Republic.
  14. Darth Chiznuk PT Trivia Master / Game Host

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    star 5
    The Weimar Republic was consumed by the Third Reich but after WWII there wasn't any Nazi Remnant in power. The government was reformed into a new democratic state and I expect something similar would happen after Endor. I don't care how powerful the Empire's military was I just don't think it's plausible that they would still be around after thirty something years.
    Last edited by Darth Chiznuk, Jun 23, 2013
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  15. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Not without a fight I'd wager. The Rebel Alliance might take the former Imperial planets under its control but the Imperials would fight until the end. The people might hate the Empire but they would be wary of a new Republic since the last one had so many problems.
  16. darklordoftech Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    That's assuming they were all in love with dictatorship.
  17. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    Well, to be fair... democracy did die with thunderous applause...
  18. Force Smuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    The Third Reich was at the verge of total collapse. Can the same be said of the Galactic Empire? Sure they lost another Death Star and the Emperor and Vader. but was Coruscant under siege? Celebrations you might say? The happy ending of ROTJ is over. Besides since Coruscant is the heart of the Empire, some Imperial in power would exert control over the situation and put down those celebrations. Was the Core under imminent collapse? I don't believe so.
    Last edited by Force Smuggler, Jun 23, 2013
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  19. Han Burgundy Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2013
    star 3
    I don't know about any sort of Empire remnant, but I do think a number of our assumptions about the basics of the story will be proved wrong.

    It was the same way with the PT, wasn't it? GL subverted a lot of expectations with those films... turning the clones into "good guys", introducing us to Anakin as an 8 year old, the major change from how we thought the Jedi Order functioned, etc.

    I think (hope) we are going to see similar narrative risks in the ST, or at least a desire to do things we aren't expecting, and to expand the mythology in ways we can't anticipate.
    Last edited by Han Burgundy, Jun 23, 2013
  20. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    Perhaps without Palpatine, reasonable people came to power within the Empire and agreed to reform in exchange for the rebels laying down their arms. Bail Organa and Mon Mothma clearly wanted a political solution over a violent solution in ROTS. With Palpatine out of the way, maybe the Imperials played it smart and that finally happened. And the Rebels could just be tired of war, and still don't have superior numbers or firepower, so they agree to compromise.


    (In my example above, Empress Leia Palpatine could be hoping that her son will recreate the Senate and begin the transition back to democracy when he becomes Emperor. And Leia could have gotten her husband to enact several reforms in the decades in-between.)
    Last edited by Summer Dreamer, Jun 23, 2013
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  21. darklordoftech Chosen One

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    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    And then came back with equally thunderous applause.
  22. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
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    star 7
    They were certainly applauding... but the voting could have been a nightmare for all we know. Look at Iraq after Hussein.
  23. Ghost Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    Maybe they were only cheering Palpatine's death, and happy that his much-wiser and kinder son would be taking over...
  24. darklordoftech Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    Iraq didn't have a democratic history. The GFFA does. Message to Star Wars fans: use history to make predictions.
    Last edited by darklordoftech, Jun 23, 2013
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  25. Darth Chiznuk PT Trivia Master / Game Host

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    star 5
    That's not exactly an insignificant loss that they can easily recover from. Their ruler and supreme commander were both killed and a great number of ships were destroyed. It was a devastating loss that would have any number of ramifications galaxy-wide. How many worlds would be inspired to join the Alliance and throw off the yoke of the Empire after Endor? It would be just the spark needed to cause a galactic revolution and I think the ending to ROTJ shows just that. I don't think the Empire could survive it.