What is your consensus RE: The Jedi's faith in the Prophecy, in ROTS

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by DUGGY, Nov 15, 2005.

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  1. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    I for one don't think they believe any of it. aside from ObiWan who seems to believe in Anakin as the Chosen one " Is he not the Chosen one? " " Is he not to Destroy the Sith and bring balance? " . and as for the rest you get Mace " So the Prophecy say's " and " I don't think the Boy can handle it, I don't trust him ", hardly a raving endorsement.
    and Finally Yoda's " A prophecy that missread could have been " . Yoda sounds like he does not even know if the Prophecy is Correctly interpereted.

    Basically Do you think that for a Order that is supposed to be raising theyre own Prophet or " Chosen one ", do the Jedi seem too Skeptical?, or like they don't even believe in it's validity?. and if not why?. and did this lack of faith play a role in their demise? I mean they were at War with the Sith, this is what the Chosen one is born for. why so skeptical?

  2. JediLaura01 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2001
    star 3
    I think they believe it, but they don't fully understand it. They don't understand who the phophet is supposed to be and what he or she is supposed to do in order to bring balance. It's easy to assume Anakin is the answer, but with all the "cloudiness" in his future, it throws in the question marks.
  3. SITHlover Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 30, 2002
    star 2
    I think that GL had Yoda say that to confirm that the Dark Side has finally taken hold to the point that the Jedi are doubting themselves. Which would be fitting for this episode.
  4. halfwits-r-us Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 27, 2005
    star 4
    I think they are skeptical of the prophecy, in that they sort of believe it but are not entirely convinced. They know it's a prophecy yet, aren't sure who is the chosen one. However to overgeneralize the Jedi as believing or not believing the prophecy as a whole, is fallacious. It depends on the individual Jedi. However the feel of the order as a whole to me is skepticism as to whether Anakin is the chosen one. They do believe in the prophecy.
  5. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    This is an interesting question. I have said quite a bit about the prophecy, so I won't get to far into it...but, having said that, it's quite natural for the characters within a story to doubt a prophecy. It makes things more interesting in fiction. For example, in Julius Caesar, when the soothsayer tells Caesar to "Beware the ides of March," he basically says that the soothsayer is crazy..."He's a dreamer," Caesar says.

    I think it's a smart move on Lucas' part to have the Jedi doubt the prophecy...thus, someone watching the films in order (1-6) would have more reason to believe that Vader is not really the chosen one. This increases the drama greatly.
  6. jvberggren Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 4
    perhaps the chosen one isn't matching up to their image of what the chosen one should be like?
    anakin sure is powerful, and i believe that's why they have some faith in him.

    but he's not exactly equally wise...
    perhaps that's why they are starting to doubt that he's the chosen one?

    i dunno really. just speculating, but there seems to be two distinct qualities about anakin -each pulling in opposite directions.

    in the end, the prophecy is just another vision, and visions can be misleading...
    they can even be altered in time.

    you shouldn't build a future based entirely on visions.
    anakin taught us that.

    "careful you must be when sensing the future anakin".
    i would say yoda practices what he preaches in this case.

    __________________________________________________

    i just posted this in your other thread duggy.
    interesting topic btw:)


  7. Jedi_Hoppin_Bun Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 31, 2005
    perhaps the chosen one isn't matching up to their image of what the chosen one should be like?
    anakin sure is powerful, and i believe that's why they have some faith in him.


    That is it exactly. I posted the following in a similar thread:

    I believe that although the council could tell that Anakin was displaying exceptional skills and promise during AOTC and beyond, I believe that he wasn't the kind of "chosen one" they were looking for or that they expected from the prophecy. He didn't exactly live the perfect Jedi lifestyle and was too reckless and angry. He may have been gifted in the force, but he didn't exhibit strict adherence to the Jedi Code. Because of this, Mace probably changed his mind from "He is the chosen one" to "Is he the chosen one?"

  8. Force-Keeper Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 16, 2004
    star 5
    The Jedi believed in Anakin and the Prophecy throughout TPM and into AotC, yet they became skeptical about it around the time RotS rolled around. Reason being that if Anakin was the Chosen One, then how come he hasn?t fulfilled his purpose yet? What was taking him so long? The Jedi know that they and the Republic are in danger, but they?re ?savior? isn?t living up to the hype as a true Jedi let alone the Chosen One. To the Jedi, something?s not right about that ? hence the reason they?re skeptical and think the Prophecy?s been misread and Anakin might not be the Chosen One after all.

    They're skepticism becomes reality after the events on Mustafar, when Anakin is truly lost to the Dark Side and believed to be dead by Obi-Wan and Yoda. When in all actuality the Prophecy was correct the whole time. IMO, the Jedi think there is a certain time that the Force will decide when the Chosen One is to fulfill his destiny when really; it's up to the Chosen One to decide.
  9. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    I don't think i understand. So you are saying that the Jedi became impatient in Anakin?. that he should have singlehandedly defeated the Sith Lord . the Sith Lord that nobody knew where he was?. as for not living up to his Hype, Anakin was a Hero of the War. he Rescued the Kidnapped Chancellor. Killed The Separatist Leader Dooku, and even saved ObiWan while at it. sounds like a True Jedi to me. and by the Way right up untill the Outburst in the Council chamber it seems like Anakin is doing just fine among the Jedi. As soon as Anakin finds out that Palps is the Sith Lord he tells Mace. that should have given them some faith. I can't believe that they expect him to do great things while doubting him at the same time.
  10. Tachikoma-Kun Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 30, 2005
    star 3
    Things just kept getting worse for the republic and for the Jedi. All the time. I suppose that may have affected their view. Maybe they started asking themselves :" What is this prophecy really about? Should all this be happening? Why are the sith still hiding?" That sort of thing. It maybe that their doubts had nothing to do with Anakin himself but just that they couldn't see light at the end of the tunnel...War wearing them down and still no clue as to who the Sith lord really is. Well maybe.
  11. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    you keep opening these controversies! :D

    I can't believe that they expect him to do great things while doubting him at the same time.

    but this is how they are with him. they sense fear but assume that keeping him is the safer option. not the safer option for anakin, mind you, but for the order. keeping their threat close to them kind of. 'the boy is dangerous...'

    they might not even mean it as such, they might not even notice as such, but to me it's there.
  12. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    Who me? :D I am a Crusader to find truth. I love that this Trilogy is not Black and white like the OT . To see things only from one POV is not to see at all.
  13. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    good thread DUGGY.i think that they are skeptical because maybe anakin is not what they thought the chosen one was gonna be.they certainly werent expecting an arrogant and moody jedi like anakin when it comes to talk about the chosen one.


    would a little more faith in anakin have stoped the destruction of the order ??

    nah,as long as palpatine is alive and as long as he has his eyes fixed on anakin the order was doomed to fall
  14. THEFORCEROCKS Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2004
    star 4
    As soon as Anakin finds out that Palps is the Sith Lord he tells Mace. that should have given them some faith. I can't believe that they expect him to do great things while doubting him at the same time.

    Well look what happens after Anakin discovers Sidious. He goes right back to rescue him and for what a secret, a lie that destroyed everything and everybody. Also who doubted him Mace? I wonder why? maybe that is what people should figure out and guess what was he right or wrong when it came to Anakin and Palpatine.
  15. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    What ACTUALLY sent him back , at that time was that Anakin was afraid that Palps was going to be destroyed " he will not give up his power.." and that he would not be able to save Padme. Anakin truly still believes this at this point. he say's " I will do whatever you as of me, just help me save Padme, I can't live without her "
    he only wanted to prevent his death. after Anakin becomes a Sith that's when his Focus changes and his Desire for Power takes over, but not before. it was about Padme at that time.
  16. THEFORCEROCKS Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2004
    star 4
    he only wanted to prevent his death. after Anakin becomes a Sith that's when his Focus changes and his Desire for Power takes over, but not before. it was about Padme at that time.


    Yeah but why does he want to prevent his death.. Padme correct. So is he concerned with getting Sidious out of office or is he concerned with losing his prized possession ... Padme. Also his desire for power started whey before lopping of Mace's arm. He made that promise back in AOtc."I will become the most powerful Jedi." In fact he even laments his powers in ROTS when speaking to Padme. what does he say "With my new powers I am finding more ways to save you." Is that correct if not then correct me.
  17. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    I can't correct you :) . cause i think we are both right. Anakin always had the tendency and desire for greater Power " your not all powerful Ani " " well i should be , someday i will be " but i believe his initial focus was to save Padme but by learning this exclusive power he can satisfy both needs. saving her and gaining this new power.
  18. THEFORCEROCKS Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2004
    star 4
    but i believe his initial focus was to save Padme but by learning this exclusive power he can satisfy both needs. saving her and gaining this new power.


    Exactly but we all know one of them would be eliminated and i think you know which one.
  19. DUGGY Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2005
    star 4
    Oh of course he would choose Padme over Power. [face_liarliar] ;)
  20. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    i say 95% he choses power and 5% he choses padme
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