Saga What real world dictator is Palpatine MOST like?

My podcast, Beltway Banthas, want to talk about Palpatine real world comparisons. What dictator or strong man from history is most like our Emperor?

Someone reclusive, rose to power through politics, relatively peaceful seizure of power, arrogant...evil?

Who comes to mind?

 

I see quite a bit of Palpatine in this guy even in looks:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximilien_Robespierre

 

The early Roman emperors spring to mind. It's tricky discounting all the modern tyrants who seized power through revolutions and coups... Interesting question.

 

The closest analog in my opinion is probably Augustus Caesar, who quietly transformed a corrupt, war-weary republic into an autocracy under his control by patiently amassing ever more extra-constitutional powers, all while maintaining a facade of humility and deference to the Republic to make the transition more palatable to the aristocracy and public. Of course, ultimately the Senate was granting him these powers in no small part because he had already had his loudest critics murdered years before in the proscriptions, and on top of that there was always the unspoken knowledge that he had the unswerving loyalty of the army. Personality-wise he was no great charismatic figure - he was sickly in his youth, and not known for fiery speeches like his adopted father. Nor was he much of a general either, delegating that task to trusted subordinates like Agrippa. But he was a talented politician almost from the beginning, using partnerships with first Cicero and then Antony to his advantage in the chaotic years after Julius Caesar's assassination, and then, when his republican rivals had been eliminated, slyly re-branding himself as a modest and virtuous defender of republican values.

So there's a lot in common there with Palpatine/Sidious - the way he gradually acquires power, the sickly look, plotting behind closed doors, emphasis on modesty in his public image, the fact that he solidifies his power fighting a civil war to ostensibly protect the Republic from a "separatist threat" as I suppose you could label Antony and Cleopatra.

Also, you could try checking out the "historical references in the prequels" topic in the prequels boards (it's a pinned topic there) - we've had some good discussions there on this question (try pages 6, 7 and 9 in particular).

 

Nero too,

Rome burning while blaming the Christians > Order 66 and all that.

Great thread by the way.

 

Taking control of the government in a time of turmoil and declaring himself emperor? Napoleon much?

 

Well, Palpatine's rise was written to be applicable to the major dictators of history in a rather universal way (as one sees the same patterns repeating throughout history). As some have said here, Caesar, Napoleon, and Nero all spring to mind, but I'm surprised no one has mentioned the obvious one: Adolf Hitler.

The PT itself is written as almost an abridged play-by-play of the multi-decade lead-up to World War II in Europe. The Palpatine/Hitler comparisons are simply everywhere, though Hitler as a personality was a bit different than Palpatine -- Hitler was more unstable, more passionate, more fundamentalist, and even a bit more (dare-I-say) sympathetic than Palpatine (at least Hitler's younger years, which seemed genuine, unlike Palpatine's, which seemed totally calculated).

Now, to personality: Overall, considering Palpatine as a person is almost completely corrosive, it would be hard to find a human being who is as consistently evil and plotting as Palpatine, but I'm sure one has existed. If I had more full grasp of all of world history, I could tell you, but no figures spring to mind at present. In a way Palpatine was also written to be the devil incarnate, so whether one is religious or not (I am not), that is something worth keeping in mind as well.

 

The Empire are definitely the Space Nazis but I dismissed Hitler because of the violent nature of his coming to power. Palp didn't have anything like the SA, the circumstances of his rise to power were so different... I think a lot of the Hitler comparisons stem from the EU side of things.

Re: Machiavellian plotting, how about Machiavelli himself? Or the Borgias.

 

GL has always maintained that he based Palpatine on Richard Nixon - although more what Nixon was attempting to become (including subverting the US Constitution to serve a third term as President), rather than what he was - prior to being thrown out in disgrace over a cheap, criminal act of paranoia.
GL wrote his original treatment for 'The Star Wars' complete with the backstory (which remains roughly consistent with what was revealed in the PT) at the height of the Vietnam War and the peace movement, so his ideas still reflect the thinking of that time.

Hitler's the most obvious next inspiration in line, but I think the rise of the Empire itself has more in common with the Roman Empire than Nazi Germany, and there's plenty of other dictators/dictatorships in which similarities can be found.

Such thugs aren't particularly original or even very smart - they rant and rave, appealing to the worst instincts of the lowest common denominator, then wreak havoc for a few years once endorsed. War, purges, massacres, you name it.
Humanity cleans up the mess for decades, while decrying such creatures in hindsight as 'monsters' - despite the fact that they achieved their power by the democratic process.

 

beat me to it.

 

Thanks Dandelo! Theres plenty of chatter like this on the Beltway Banthas podcast =)

 

THANK YOU FOR ALL THESE GREAT RESPONSES! The Beltway Banthas podcast is definitly going to dig into this topic and go over all these different opinions to search for the answer. This is super helpful!! =D

 

very very insightful! Thank you

 

I always just assumed he was a play on Hitler...

 

There are bits and pieces "borrowed" from various stories from our own infamous history.

Order 66 you can also see it in the Friday 13th and the pope ordering the murder of all the knights templar.

As pointed out already the raise to power of military and demagogic leaders through the use of democratic or republican (no pun intended) rules, from Greek and Roman emperors, to Napoleon, Htiler, etc.

What was really interesting is how Palps orchestrated a small conflict in a small system to escalate and grant himself power to become Chancellor and then get an army (though the republic only had the jedi to keep peace) to them being asked to take power by the same system.

To paraphrase the late Senator from Naboo: So this is how democracy ends, to roaring applause.

 

Peisistratos claimed to have been attacked by his enemies, and parleyed this into his rise to power:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peisistratos

 

I don't think Palpatine was inspired by this guy necessarily, but at the the time of the movies' releases, a lot people were comparing him to George W. Bush. Starting shady wars for shady reasons, and all that stuff (even though AotC came before the war in Iraq). Anakin's line, "If you're not with me, then you're my enemy" sounds eeriely lie Bush's infamous statement "You're either with us, or you are with the terrorists." Some people saw the plot of RotS as a sort of "take that" to the Bush administration. Hayden Christensen certainly thinks so.

According to Lucas, the PT storyline was written based of the political atmosphere in the 70s (Richard Nixon, Saddam Hussein, etc) but he thinks there are a lot of parallels that can be made between the past and the present.

 

Joseph Stalin hasn't been mentioned, yet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin

"Between 1934 and 1939 he organized and led a massive purge (known as "Great Purge") of the party, government, armed forces and intelligentsia, in which millions of so-called "enemies of the working class" were imprisoned, exiled or executed, often without due process."

 

GL is an avid student of history. Palpatine is based on multiple historic figures. GL did say Palpatine was based partly on President Nixon in the 1980's. In the Clone Wars, it had so much similarities to Caesar Civil War where he became the absolute ruler of the Republic after the war, like Darth Sidious did after the Clone Wars. For the Jedi Purge, you can draw many comparisons, but none as strong as Friday The 13th, when the French King declared the Knights Templars as outlaws (This story incorrectly says the Pope ordered a Decree on the Templars, when in fact it was the French King and only happened in French controlled areas) and 47 Ronin. With the 47 Ronin, you watch PT and OT and you see it with Anakin redeeming himself and bringing honor back the the Jedi with the help of Luke.

 

What about Otto Von Bismarck? He transformed the Kingdom of Prussia into the German Empire through a series of wars, lies, and populism.

 

darklordoftech

Sorry, but Otto von Bismarck would have been the last to come to my mind, essentially he did what many kings and emperors did before him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_von_Bismarck

"...By 1871 he skillfully used balance of power diplomacy to preserve German hegemony in a Europe which, despite many disputes and war scares, remained at peace. For historian Eric Hobsbawm, it was Bismarck who "remained undisputed world champion at the game of multilateral diplomatic chess for almost twenty years after 1871, [and] devoted himself exclusively, and successfully, to maintaining peace between the powers."[2]

"In 1862, King Wilhelm I appointed Bismarck as Minister President of Prussia, a position he would hold until 1890 (except for a short break in 1873). He provoked three short, decisive wars against Denmark, Austria, and France, aligning the smaller German states behind Prussia in defeating his arch-enemy France. In 1871 he formed the German Empire with himself as Chancellor, while retaining control of Prussia. His diplomacy of realpolitik and powerful rule at home gained him the nickname the "Iron Chancellor." German unification and its rapid economic growth was the foundation to his foreign policy. He disliked colonialism but reluctantly built an overseas empire when it was demanded by both elite and mass opinion. Juggling a very complex interlocking series of conferences, negotiations and alliances, he used his diplomatic skills to maintain Germany's position and used the balance of power to keep Europe at peace in the 1870s and 1880s."

 

I wonder who could be compared to Darth Plagueis. Von Hindenburg? Drexler?

 

I can't peg Palp as any one 'great man' tyrant (though Augustus Caesar might be a good choice), but his style of assuming control is pure 21st century US Rebpulican/TEA Party, summed up in one line in TPM:

"I will make it legal."

Using legislative and procedural ju-jitsu to cripple legitimate governance while quietly slipping in more and more laws to consolidate power.

 

Thanks everyone!!!!!!
We talked democracy to dictatorships in this weeks episode of Beltway Banthas! Check it out if you enjoyed the thread =)

https://soundcloud.com/beltway-banthas-podcast/episode-vii-i-love-democracy

 

Appreciate the thought! I would argue that both parties use all sorts of means to consolidate power stealthily, but your example sounds much more like Democratic expansion of the bureaucratic state..which uses unelected bodies to create law and regulation with zero accountability.