What should be the last scene in Episode III?

Hey, Patrick Russell, how about THIS for a last scene?

Obi-Wan: But Master, how will I know when the boy is ready?
Yoda: You will know....

Also, PR, as you may have read, we're having quite an exchange over whether Vader knew about Luke. What are your thoughts on this and do you think Tatooine itself provides some sort of "cover" for Obi-Wan and Luke as you eluded to?

 

DM, since ANH basically begins over and on Tatooine, I think the most dramatic way to end Episode III would be the one I mentioned earlier with Ben sadly walking off into the twin Tatooine sunset with the Force theme playing mournfully in the background. Ben and Luke are both living on Tatooine when we pick up 20 years later in Episode IV, so it makes sense that they should both end up there at the end of Episode III.

(Not that I'm expecting Lucas to actually do this, mind you...)

As for the issue of whether Vader knew about Luke... I don't believe he did. Obviously this all depends greatly on how Lucas sets the details of Anakin's fall to the Dark Side, but my feeling is that a key to Vader's identity is his (nearly) impenetrable mental block against his life as Anakin. The Emperor appears to be supporting this mental block by referring to Luke as "the son of Skywalker" in ESB. He talks about "Skywalker" as a completely separate entity from Vader, which leads me to believe that there is some significance to that separation of the Skywalker/Vader personae beyond a mere expression of Palpatine's own conceited affectations.

Hence, the "conflict" Luke refers to in ROTJ. It's not merely a conflict between the good and the bad in Vader... it's a conflict between his true self and his Vader persona.

So, I don't believe he does know of Luke's existence until after ANH, and I believe he kept his understanding that HE was Luke's father secret from the Emperor until sometime after ESB... perhaps even until the moment in ROTJ when he reports to the Emperor about the Rebel troops landing on Endor, adding haltingly and with some hesitation "My... son... is with them."

Why, then, hide Luke? Well, obviously Force-sensitive people can be sensed by other Force sensitive people, but it seems to require either relatively close physical proximity or that one person be actively reaching out with the Force to another (as we saw with the Jedi sensing Maul as he searched for them on Tatooine, and with Leia as Luke called out to her on Bespin, for example). So... assuming that there is a reason why Tatooine does not actively register on Vader's Force senses, Ben and Luke would be relatively safe if they kept to themselves on Tatooine. In fact, Vader never sensed Luke until he was beginning to open himself up naturally to the Force in ANH as he flew the Death Star raid.

 

I think Darth Vader Knew about the Twins but he kept it a secret from the Emperor. Like Yoda said "hard to see the Dark Side is". If that is true then Vader could of easily hid
Luke & Leia from Palaptine.

 

Vader, keep his twins a secret from the Emperor, no way, Vader is pure evil basically up until TESB their is no sympathy or remorse he is totally over to the Dark Side, he is more or less a different persona, Anakin Skywalker is no more. Thats why i dont believe he knew of Luke or Leia, because the conflict within him began soon after he knew of Lukes exsistence, his son stirred up memories of his once long forgotten past as Anakin Skywalker.

 

I don't see how Vader would've known about his children's existence. I figure about the closest he could've come would've been knowing Padme was pregnant; I suppose then he'd be tricked into believing that they were dead.

(Incidentally, several issues of the Marvel comic book were devoted to Vader's search for the unknown pilot who destroyed Death Star, culminating in a great three-issue series just before they adapted TESB. Also, Dark Horse did a good four-issue series called "Vader's Quest" on the same subject.)

 

I definately dont think Vader knew he had children of any sort. He probably wouldnt have found out at all hadnt it been for Luke blowing up the Death Star and becoming galactically known. In my opinion, Vader found out he had a son only when he heard some kid named "Skywalker" had been the one who destroyed the Death Star.

I totally agree that the last scene in Episode III should have some sort of allusion to "A New Hope." I really liked Kenneth-Morgan's idea.

Why did Obi-Wan, or Yoda for that matter, not take Luke to be trained as a Jedi from birth instead of just leaving Luke with Owen and Beru? I guess we will find out as we go along. I cant wait!

 

I already said this on the Beatles thread, but I think SW3 should end with Obi-Wan singing "Across The Universe".

 

Maybe Vader licking Palpy's boots while saying "He will be turned, master. He will be turned."

Or on the bridge of an SD..."I will hunt you down. I will hunt you down and turn you. Then, you will call the Emporer 'master'.

Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh...

 

In the OT the last shoots were
ANH: The Throne room w/everybody
ESB: Space Sceen
RotJ: Ewok Victory sceen with everybody

Now in TPM we have Naboo Victory Sceen with everybody.
If we go on the assumption that Anakin and Amidala are married in the last shoots (this is just an assumpsion I don't have a clue if it will be that way or not) then we'd have a final shot with Everybody.

So OT had two shoots with everybody in joyful modes and one space sceen with a sourful mode.
If PT is like it then EIII would have to end with a space shoot after Anakin has fully become Darth Vader.

 

I'd like to see it like this;

Kenobi brings Luke to Uncle Owen riding a dewback in a blinding sandstorm. He stands at Owen's door. Owen sees the child and is horrified, refusing to take him. Kenobi tells him that he must, for the child is our new hope. Owen reluctantly takes young Luke.
He looks at the child and then at Kenobi. Kenobi the same. Very dramatic music plays.

-camera pulls away from the farm, then the dustorm, to an exterior view of Tattoine. Then a Star Destroyer comes into the screen i.e. the opening scene of ANH.

You see Vader looking through window at Tattoine. Camera from behind.

camera moves to frontal shot. Vader with hands on waist. Camera slowly zooms to Vaders face. Imperial march playing slowly.
Camera continues zooming, Imperial march fades out, Vaders breathing increases in volume. Camera fully zoomed into Vaders lenses/"eyes".

Fade to black

Vaders Breathing continues, and then slowly fades out.

-End credits.

 

an apology from George Lucas for Jar Jar Binks and alienating his fanbase by saying "he makes this for kids"

 

Folks, it's most likely going to end very doom and gloom. At the start of Star Wars <<err A New Hope>> we're going to know that that Corellian Corvette is on the run. I imagine in the last half hour of Episode 3, the planning of where the babies will be hidden will take place. Vader will have started his hunt of the Jedi. Vader will be attacking Jedi, with his stormtroopers, while the Emperor looks on. Maybe the Emperor will be in the senate proposing to disband and outlaw the Jedi, while we see Vaders ship chasing another. Who knows...I cant wait though.

Isurus

 

Well, I don't think it'll be ALL doom and gloom. There will be at least some small glimmer of hope. Even TESB ended with that.

 

It should be similar to the final shot of ESB. Show Obi-Wan or Owen on Tatooine with baby Luke, all of them looking off towards some distant vista. I don't think Padme should be in the end of the movie at all. It would be much more tragic to have her character quietly fade away than it would be to imply that Vader kills her.

BTW, it would be possible for Lucas to show Padme giving birth and Obi-Wan arriving on Tatty with Luke and all without ever giving away the fact that there was a second child.

 

I agree, there should be some kind of hope / almost celebratory (I said ALMOST) aspect. But I have a feeling it'll end with Vader. Not that THAT's so bad, either.

If Episode III doesn't reveal Vader's identity--and I pray that it'll pull that off somehow--an ending on Alderaan might be interesting. Show Leia being delivered, not Luke. Add a little misdirection.

 

I like the idea of Obiwan dropping off the baby, then goes walking off into the distance with the twin suns in view. Then cut to Owen and Beru zooming into baby Luke in their arms, then cut back to Obiwan with his back facing the camera walking into the distance, with the sound of the force theme.

Also it would be nice having the credits roll on as Obiwan slowly dissapears into the distance, instead of having to go to a black screen all the time.

 

The final scene maybe should be Dark?

(after Luke is delivered)

FINAL SETTING SWITCHS TO: undisclosed Dark Training Chamber well below the ground (as the emperor watches)

We see perhaps the first stages of Darth Vader during is rehabilitation, we see him in training, gaining back his incredible abilities with his red light saber as he makes adjustments getting use to his new exo-skeleton frame. We see perhaps growing confidence in him as he realizes that he now will be even more powerfull than he was before.

 

They HAVE to show Vader in my mind, and they HAVE to have his breathing. I'd like that as a second to last shot. The last part would be Obi-Wan/Owen in one of the forms already described.

I think Obi-Wan and Luke aren't found becasue they were hiding on Tatooine. When Anakin becomes Vader, something inside of him scares him from ever going back to Tatooine, most likely just because so much of his past was there. Also, if the Naboo=Dagobah theory is correct, it would also explain why Yoda was never found since Vader wouldn't want to go back there either.

As to why Luke wasn't trained from the beginning, I also think Obi-Wan knew (maybe from Yoda) that the time would come eventually, and all he had to wait some. That's why he lives nearby the Lars'.

 

Last shot.


Dark backround (Undecipherable location)

Vader's breathing fills the scene.

Vader's mask rises from below the frame. His shoulder's rise and fall strongly AS THE BREATHING GETS LOUDER.

Cut to credits.


It will be the first time (chronologically) the audience sees the mask. It leads us straight into A New Hope when you see him taking over the Rebel ship.

 

Theres a chance that George wouldnt reveal Anakins duality in Episode 3. Heres why:

How did everyone feel when they heard the shocking "father" revelation in ESB? Do you think George Lucas Would destroy that for future generations that see the movies in order? ABSOLUTELY NOT!

He'd somehow make it look like Anakins dead and Vaders someone else.

However, a guy by the name of PC-2 Kenobi was quoted saying this on another forum:
"I assume you're talking about future audiences watching the movies in I-VI order. In which case, they'll see:

PT: Obi-Wan's apprentice, Anakin Skywalker, falls to the Dark Side. Some unknown (to the unspoiled!) ending is shown of his story.

ANH: Obi-Wan tells Luke how his apprentice, Darth Vader (who if he is anyone BUT Anakin we will have NEVER SEEN in the prequels!) fell to the Dark Side and betrayed/murdered Anakin.

I can't see how the mystery of that plot twist can really be sustained."

George wouldnt enull ANY shocking piece of his saga. But, that line about Vader being a former pupil will downright confirm Vader is Anakin. This will be interesting to see how he handles this.

 

Well, there are very few people who don't know that Vader is Luke's father. When I first saw ESB, the profoundness of the scene to me wasn't the revealation that Vader was Luke's father (since I already knew), it was Luke's reaction.

 

The drama of the ESB scene will change after the PT is added to the mix... instead of the revelation that Vader is Luke's father being the big dramatic shocker in and of itself, the shocker will now be that Vader REMEMBERS WHO HE IS.

We already have a possible clue to this in ESB itself when the Emperor refers to Luke as "the son of Skywalker" when talking with Vader. There's also the entire "That name no longer has any meaning for me..." scene in ROTJ. What I think this points to is that Anakin will turn to the dark side in such a mentally and emotionally imbalanced state that by the end of Episode III he will seem to have forgotten his Anakin self altogether. Then when he reveals himself to Luke as Luke's father... suddenly we realize that he's NOT completely gone and that he CAN remember who he was.

Just a theory, of course.

 

>>>>I'm not really sure that it was Obi-Wan's plan to necessarily pluck Luke from Tatooine and start training him hardcore. It seems to me that Obi-Wan himself would have raised Luke from day one if that was truly the plan. And the only reason Obi-Wan DID try to start training Luke (20 years after the fact) is because his foster parents were murdered.

Not really- I think that rather than take him away to train (like Qui Gon did), he was waiting for Luke to come to him. When he did, he offered to train Luke and gave him his fathers lightsaber and everything, Luke had responsibilites to his uncle which he felt he ought to fulfil, then his foster parents were killed.

>>>>but certainly it would make sense that Ben and Yoda would choose to wait for events to transpire which would undeniably indicate that it was Luke's undeniable destiny to be trained rather than making the choice on their own.

Especially after the results of Qui Gon's cheating with the Force to get Anakin trained!


Anyway, I'm going to go against the grain here- I don't want the last scene of Episode 3 to tie with the start of Episode IV [face_shocked]

I'd rather see the twins dealt with about an hour/hour and a half max into the film and then forgotten about until Episode IV (like the "there is another" line in ESB, which is ignored for the rest of the film.)

I think III should finish with Vader in action, the last of the Jedi getting wiped out and the Empire celebrating (because I think Palpatine will turn the general population of the Republic/Empire against the Jedi.) That way we get a celebration like the end of TPM, where the bad guys have won, only a bit more obvious.

I don't know what the big event should be though. Something that really puts the nail in the coffin of the Republic, so that Tarkins line in ANH about the "last remenants of the Old republic have been swept away" when the Emperor dissolves the Senate has a bit more meaning.

The only thing I can think of that fits the bill is the Jedi getting wiped out in a big battle.

 

Quote:
Anyway, I'm going to go against the grain here- I don't want the last scene of Episode 3 to tie with the start of Episode IV

I'm with you! In my case, however, I think I'd like a slight discontinuity because of the 20 year gap between Episodes III and IV. I'd like to see Episode III kind of "wrap up" the storyline, albeit with a tragic ending. Then, 20 years later, we'll be spared from thinking the universe is doomed by "A New Hope"...

 

Palpy and Suit-Vader in the Imperial Palace at Coruscant. With the Voice.