Speculation What things from the PT do you want the ST to keep?

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by InterestingLurker, Nov 8, 2012.

  1. bstnsx704 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 11, 2013
    star 2
    Maul was Sidious' puppet, plain and simple. Sidious needed a face for the Sith to let the Jedi know they were back (while he remained the titular 'phantom'), and Maul played that role to a T. Any personal motivation that he had was irrelevant to the story of The Phantom Menace; he was trained by Sidious and did what he was told in order to help put Palpatine's plan into action.
  2. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Yes, and that's how you make an antagonist interesting. Turn him into a blank slate. :rolleyes:
    Darth Claire, Ryus and Rawne like this.
  3. Rawne Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2008
    star 2
    Yeah, I'd prefer to avoid the visually stunning villain and go back to a villain with a backstory and distinct personality, like Vader or Dooku. Who's this cold as ice Darth Vader guy? Oh he used to be a Jedi, killed Luke's father? Person of high importance in this Galactic Empire? Tricksy think-outside-the-box strategist? Rather unforgiving when his subordinates screw up? Happily fights on the frontlines? Would likely overthrow the Emperor if Luke joined him? Happily ignores the Emperor's commands? Used to be the champion of the Jedi Order before betraying them and helping the Empire rise?

    Maul? Oh you mean that guy who's holding a double bladed lightsaber who really doesn't like Jedi? His most distinct characteristic is that he looks like a Western depiction of a demon.
  4. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    Also isnt he the guy who lost even though he had the high ground? I mean Vader lost since he had the low ground, but Maul has no such excuses... :p;)
    Last edited by Ryus, Apr 15, 2013
  5. Darth Chiznuk E7 Casting Contest Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Oct 31, 2012
    star 5
    Haha, that's funny! Yeah good 'ol GL definitely jumped the shark with this idea. I'm just glad that if it had to happen that it happened in the Clone Wars and not something more important like Episode II or God forbid Episode VII.

    My son loves bugs and he was crazy for Maul's spider legs. He was so upset when he got new legs.
    Pro Scoundrel likes this.
  6. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Maul episodes were some of the best in the entire series. How is that shark jumping?

    Jumping the shark: the youngling and droid arcs, proving that the makers are not ashamed to fill almost half a season with filler.
  7. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    Or they remembered that their target audience were meant to be... well... 7.
  8. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    What kid wants to watch "a sunny day in the void"? None of those I know.
  9. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    I do not know any Straw Man children so I do not have statistical feedback such as you were able to provide.
    Last edited by A Chorus of Disapproval, Apr 15, 2013
    FRAGWAGON, Vthuil and Random Comments like this.
  10. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    The youngling arc was very good, in my opinion.
    And a sunny day in the void wasn't as bad as everyone seems to make out. I enjoyed it.
    Lawless was great, though.


    Edit: but I know a number of children. All enjoyed the episodes. Some were too young for the Maul ones, though.
    Last edited by Random Comments, Apr 15, 2013
  11. Ryus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 25, 2013
    star 4
    Pretty much fully agree...

    I too enjoyed the yougling arc quite a bit actually (though I watched it on DVD not week to week, so my opinion might be different than others here if they saw it week to week), but admit it was filler

    Sunny day in the void wasnt as bad as some other filler from previous seasons, but it was the weak arc in the over all greatest season the show had

    Lawless might be the crown jewel of the series, it was pushing it for some kids but was a huge reward for anyone 8+ watching the show (especially the adults)
    Last edited by Ryus, Apr 15, 2013
  12. DARTH_BELO Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2003
    star 4
    I don't have any specific things I'd like to see, (other than a couple locations, perhaps.)

    I do at least hope they acknowledge the PT in elements visually, or in general plot points, like brief references to things that happened-sort of how the Clone Wars was referenced in ANH-that sort of thing....Nothing specific, but I just hope they don't act like the OT was all there ever was, and go out of their way to completely IGNORE that the PT even existed.

    Whether fanboys liked it or not, it is STILL part of the story!
  13. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I can't prove the episodes aren't suited for 7 year olds just like you can't prove the opposite. Lets call it a draw.
  14. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    Yes, it is much more likely that it was intended for adults, so I will concede.
  15. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    It actually doesn't matter who it was targeted for, filler is still filler. Or do you think just because they are kids they should be fed bad quality?
  16. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    I think that the actual target audience (my 38 year old self tuning in is bonus to them) enjoy goofy robots and stories about little kids far more than us amazingly intellectual types who spends all day long debating the validity of EU material on a website. Those stories aren't aimed at us. The balance of heavier episodes per season leans in the little kids' favor. We get a few such as Lawless tossed in for us along the way. Hence why we aren't on here confused about who they aim Ben10 and Perry the Platypus toward. We watched it because it said "Star Wars". Not everything with that name attached is for us uppity nerds to be satisfied with. I certainly did not collect:
    [IMG]
    Last edited by A Chorus of Disapproval, Apr 15, 2013
  17. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I still say the episodes were of low quality when it comes to characterization, pacing, and dramaturgy.
  18. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    Oh, I agree. I just tend to look at it as my POV is filtered through a bitter, jaded decades long Star Wars fan who expects certain things. I would be willing to bet there are kids somewhere who think WAC is the best thing ever.
    Darth_Pevra likes this.
  19. Random Comments Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 25, 2012
    star 5
    My little sister loves the young Jedi....
  20. Rawne Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2008
    star 2
    I agree but they can't go overboard. The Clone Wars were already myth and legend by the OT. The ST is going to be even further 'in the future'. Nothing 'major' that happened should have that much bearing/relevancy on the story, that's already happened you want fall out from the PT go watch the OT, just character background (i.e. Luke/Leia/Ghost Anakin could talk about Padme) and neat easter eggs. Like if they go to Coruscant or Naboo there has to be continuity in terms of architecture, landmarks etc

    There shouldn't be people walking around talking about Anakin's victory in the podrace or the Battle of Geonosis as if they were there. It'd look and sound weird. Just like there shouldn't be random characters talking about the Battle of Yavin or the day they saw Leia choking Jabba. The worst offender would be if there's people intimately discussing the final moments in the Throne Room or on Mustafar.
    Last edited by Rawne, Apr 15, 2013
    kubricklynch and Darth Chiznuk like this.
  21. gregvader123 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 16, 2012
    star 2
    As much as I come off as a purist at times...I've always wished they could've done the 'ol Chris Lee cut and face paste to Alec in ANH.
    Last edited by gregvader123, Apr 15, 2013
  22. janstett Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2004
    star 3
    Speaking of wrong on every account...

    Maul and Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan were strangers with absolutely no interpersonal conflict. Not only was Maul himself a paper-thin moustache-twirling cardboard standee, there was absolutely no conflict between Mault and Qui-Wan aside from "Hey look, I'm the mute bad guy with face paint and horns randomly sent to fight you and I'm a bad ass and I'm gonna kill you. Boo! I'm a bad guy, I'm gonna get you guys!". What great conflict between characters, it's quite riveting! Storytelling and characterization at its finest!

    Let's imagine that this conflict had to play out through dramatic dialogue instead of a hyperchoreographed glow stick ballet. You will find deeper character development in Looney Tunes shorts from the 1940s. That is meant to be sarcasm but it is actually true. Elmer Fudd gets deeper characterizations.
    Last edited by janstett, Apr 17, 2013
    Ryus, kubricklynch and Darth_Pevra like this.
  23. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 7
    So, all good villains talk incessantly and monologue their entire plan to the heroes so that they can simply listen to the details and undermine the scheme? Good to know you were hoping for Dick Dastardly.
  24. Han Burgundy Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2013
    star 2
    No but a good villian must have a good motivation for why they do what they do, good enough to get the audience invested.

    Believe it or not, but people actually like 3-Dimensional characters! That's just basic storytelling 101.

    There's only a few times where not having a clear personal motivation actually works in favor of the Villian, such as Joker in the Dark Knight, where it worked into his whole aura of anarchy and chaos. But Maul was never played as unpredictable and terrifyingly insane. He was played as a straight, assassin-type villian.

    And there's a lot if things you could have done to make that character more compelling. Maybe his sole goal was to please his master and eradicate the Jedi, but perhaps he personally struggled with his own conviction about the Sith Way? That could have even gone into a great subtheme about the pointlessness of religious war, a theme i could see fitting in with the rest of the PT.

    Now I'm getting ahead of myself. Cutting it off before i descend into full on geek-mode.

    EDIT: On this topic, I would like a villian who, similar to Count Dooku (but in a more fleshed out way), questions the morality of the hero's. Especially with this trilogy taking place 30-ish years after the one-two punch of civilization failure that was the clone wars and the galactic empire, I think it would be interesting to have a villian who recognizes the mistakes made by those in the past, and uses that knowledge against the hero's, but perhaps has his own twisted ideas about how society should move forward.
    Last edited by starmin76, Apr 17, 2013
  25. EHT Manager: New Films

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Sep 13, 2007
    star 5
    Or a Bond villain.
    Last edited by eht13, Apr 17, 2013
    Sitara likes this.