Clone Wars What was Palpatine doing after Maul's return?

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Slowpokeking, Jan 16, 2013.

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  1. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    According to the comic he didn't sense it right away, and until now he still hadn't try to contact his former apprentice and use him, but let the Death Watch found them and made ally. That's not smart. From the preview he wasn't using Maul but went there by himself to kill Maul, that's not like his style. Let Dooku kill Maul would be more like Palpatine's style and Dooku hates Maul a lot for Qui Gon's death.
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Jan 16, 2013
  2. Legolas Skywalker Force Ghost

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    Where is it depicted that Dooku hates Maul?
  3. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    Maul killed his padawan.
  4. Seerow SWTV★Mod

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    More likely, just like the Jedi seemed to think of Maul as being little more than just a criminal, that's how Palpatine saw him when he reappeared. Maul is probably the moron since he'd be better to just lay low and retire. Going and getting yourself an army and deciding to step it up to invading planets and bullzoning them like screwing around in God mode in SimCity is a good way to move yourself up the priority rung. I think this is what "Revival" was getting as toward the end there are well.
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  5. Billy_Dee_Binks Force Ghost

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    I never thought of it this way. Now I actually want to see the two meet up for a chat.
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  6. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I don't think that would mean anything. Sidious trained Maul and Dooku either doesn't care, or he suppresses his anger because he sees more worth in becoming a Sith than holding a grudge. He's also willing to kill his apprentice's apprentice and Anakin joins the Sith too, despite Sith having attempted to kill Padme, killed Qui-Gon, and attempting to kill Anakin on multiple occasions. Anakin himself goes from seeing Obi-Wan like a father to hating him over the span of a couple minutes after he assists in killing Mace and pledges himself to Sidious to save Padme. It might have been just as abrupt for Dooku.
  7. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    Obi Wan is not Qui Gon, Dooku totally lost the hope of the republic and the jedi because of Qui Gon's death.

    Also he was planning to overthrow Sidious, that's why he trained Savage.
  8. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Why would Dooku care about Qui-Gon any more than he would care about Yoda (who was his teacher and that he was ready to kill). And Obi-Wan matters because he's Qui-Gon's legacy, which Dooku is ready to snuff out. Why would Dooku so readily JOIN the Sith, if he was so angry that a Sith killed his apprentice? Dooku plotting to kill Sidious was tied to the slight Sidious made against Dooku in demanding that he kill Asajj, and there was no indication that it had anything to do with Qui-Gon.

    Dooku may have been pushed to the Dark Side in part because of Qui-Gon's death, but that doesn't mean that once he fell that he cared any more. Anakin is ready to kill Obi-Wan - the guy that he regarded as a father - at the drop of a hat once he gave into his negative emotions. And he choked his wife in a barely controlled rage. I don't think Dooku is still holding a soft spot in his heart for Qui-Gon, or would harbor any more hate toward Maul than he should be harboring toward Sidious, who trained Maul and had him kill Qui-Gon.

    If a terrorist kills my family, I do not go join that terrorist group out of dissatisfaction with my government for failing to protect my family. It would be one thing if he were trying to infiltrate the Sith to take them down from the inside, but then had that plan backfire and got corrupted (e.g. Matriarch Benezia of Mass Effect). But there is no logical reason for Dooku to go join the Sith if he is incredibly upset that the Sith killed Qui-Gon.

    Like with Anakin, there could have been stepping stones:

    Qui-Gon's death shakes Qui-Gon's faith in the Jedi and he begins to lead toward the Dark Side --> Dooku seeks to use the Sith to achieve some noble goal while simultaneously plotting their downfall --> Fully corrupted, loss of morality, more concerned with power than holding onto petty attachments. And in that regard, the biggest reason I would see Dooku having for wanting Maul dead, is simply because Maul is a threat, not out of revenge for some apprentice, whose memory Dooku already betrayed in joining the group that was responsible for Qui-Gon's death.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Jan 17, 2013
  9. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    No Yoda is not Dooku's master, Yoda just trained him when he was youngling, that's a lot different than master and padawan. He joined the Sith because he thought they share the same goal, to bring order to the galaxy, not it totally changed him.

    No, Anakin didn't take Obi Wan, but Qui Gon as his father, Obi Wan is more like a brother to him and he thought Padme betrayed him. After Padme's death he deeply regret for it. If you read the EU, he still kept respect of Qui Gon and dreamed if he didn't join the Dark Side, he would name his child "Jinn".
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Jan 17, 2013
  10. K'Kruhk Jedi Grand Master

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    He was his master, in AOTC he says 'my old Padawan'.
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  11. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    No, Yoda just trained him like all the younglings when he was little, Dooku's master is this guy.

    http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Thame_Cerulian
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Jan 17, 2013
  12. K'Kruhk Jedi Grand Master

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    Well then at some point at least Dooku was Yoda's Padawan, hence Yoda using the word 'Padawan'. This is another annoying retcon.
  13. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Anakin explicitly says that Obi-Wan is like a father to him (twice).

    ANAKIN: Don't say that Master... You're the closest thing I
    have to a father...

    [...]

    ANAKIN: He's like my father, but you heard Master Windu. He
    gave me strict orders to stay here.

    Yoda explicitly says that Dooku was his "Padawan," not youngling.

    Since G canon trumps C-canon, the only way I can see to resolve it is that Yoda was Dooku's master at some point.

    It is nonsensical that Dooku would join Sidious and think they had the same goals but then hate Maul - Sidious' apprentice - for killing his padawan. If Dooku truly believed that the Sith had the same goals as him, then Qui-Gon's death would be just an unfortunate casualty in the pursuit of that goal. The EU and TCW do not always jive and in TCW Dooku says he wants the destruction of the Jedi Order, and there's no indication that he's open to the idea of having the Jedi Order serve him (as in the EU) or that he's recruiting Dark Siders.

    With the Rule of Two, there would have been no place for Qui-Gon. And the Jedi as a whole would in some way be like a family to him, and he'd have close friends (like Sifo-Dyas). All of which he was willing to sacrifice for power. Why he'd still cling to Qui-Gon is beyond me.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Jan 17, 2013
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  14. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    Later he didn't say it anymore, he wanted a father figure and hoped Obi Wan could be that but it's not the case. Obi Wan was more like a brother to him and don't forget in EP I he supported the council's decision and talked that right before the little Anakin, that surely left gap between the two. It was Qui Gon who helped Anakin to get free and it was his last wish that made Obi Wan and the council to accept Anakin as a jedi, and he's more like a father to Anakin, that's why he is so special in Anakin's heart.

    That's just his word, and it was just used to taunt Dooku, that's not a hard evidence at all. He trained him as the Grand Master when he was little, that's all.

    Yes, they share the same goal but at the same time were using each other, just like all the Sith masters and apprentices, especially the ones after Darth Bane. It's hard to understand as Jedi but it's very common among Sith. In AotC he said Qui Gon would join him if he was alive.
  15. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    It's ok to call him a padawan, but Yoda didn't train him for long.

    Qui Gon is a different thing, he was the first padawan of Dooku and his death let Dooku lost the last bit of hope of the Order. So it's fair to say he was important to Dooku.
  16. rumsmuggler Chosen One

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  17. Legolas Skywalker Force Ghost

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    You wanna know what Palps was doing when Maul returned? i'll tell you the answer

    HE WAS EATING COOKIES :p :p
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  18. BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost

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    He was cackling evil-like. Then he cackled more.
  19. General Immodet Jedi Grand Master

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    Hmm, what was he doing?
    Maybe he was on the toilet...
    Maybe he was having dinner with Mother Talzin...
    Maybe he was using death sticks...
  20. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

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    Palpatine probably didn't give a rat's ass. He saw Maul as nothing but a top-grade assassin anyway, and only trained him as a Sith in secret to piss off Plagueis. At the time of TCW, he was using Dooku as a placeholder until Anakin was ready to be fully converted.
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  21. KenobiSkywalker Force Ghost

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    I thought Maul was originally going to be Sidious' sith apprentice, not a placeholder or assassin. He couldn't have been a placeholder for Anakin - Sidious didn't know about him yet.
  22. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

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    Maul wasn't intended to be a placeholder, but Sidious didn't think of him as a quality Sith apprentice either. Had Sidious not been so intent on defying the Rule of Two behind Plagueis' back and becoming a Master himself, he probably would not have trained Maul as a Sith.
  23. Sitara Force Ghost

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    Uhm...where are you getting this from? It is obvious from TPM that Maul was Sidious's heir. TCW shows that Maul knew about the Clone Wars at least TEN YEARS before they happened...
  24. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

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  25. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

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    Then he should not go by himself to deal with the brothers, it's a dumb move.
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