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PT What would have happened if Anakin told Palpatine he was falling to the Dark Side?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Sith_Kingpin, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. Sith_Kingpin

    Sith_Kingpin Jedi Padawan

    Feb 4, 2013
    We know Palpatine's goal was to mould the perfect Sith, and Dooku and Maul were expendable pawns. Reading ROTS novel, you see Palpatine actually cared for Anakin, too, and he never cared for his other apprentices.

    Anyway, let's say hypothetically, Anakin lost the plot a little bit earlier (sometime during the Clone Wars) and stormed into the Chancellor's office complaining about the Jedi (like he always did) and said he was falling to the Dark Side. Would Palpatine have sped up his Galactic Empire ploy and formed it quicker by ending the Clone Wars?

    Would Palpatine have revealed his true identity to Anakin in this scenario and have him kill Dooku so he can become his Sith apprentice? What would have been the likely outcome.
  2. Jabba_The_Hutt_123

    Jabba_The_Hutt_123 Jedi Master star 3

    Oct 29, 2003
    In such a scenario I don't think Palpatine would yet make a move, he needs the Jedi to be able to be portrayed as villains, and if Anakin messed up it could all get very messy. I could see him saying how the dark side is natural, in a war it proves useful, motivations of revenge etc to keep Anakin on that border but keep him loyal to the Jedi for now.
  3. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Mar 4, 2011
    I didn't get the impression from the ROTS novel that Palpatine gave a **** about Anakin or anyone else other than himself. He put on a hell of a show of caring about Anakin but I think his true caring about Anakin only involved caring about turning him to the Dark Side.

    I agree with the PP that Palpatine would tell Anakin that it's natural to feel that way in war time, it's natural to feel that way due to the "mistreatment" he had gotten from the Jedi, and Dark and Light are just two different ways of looking at the Force. He'd probably add in another line similar to what he said in the Squid Lake scene about Anakin only believing the Dark Side was evil because the Jedi had told him as much, and were they always right?
    ILNP likes this.
  4. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

    Sep 2, 2012
    There is that line in the "This is how it feels to be Anakin Skywalker, forever" about how "the dark" forgives- still, that's not the same as Palpatine.
  5. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Sep 4, 2012
    That's the first time I've ever seen the opinion that Palpatine genuinely cared about Anakin. Though it's hard to beleive I like the new trail of thought.
  6. Sith_Kingpin

    Sith_Kingpin Jedi Padawan

    Feb 4, 2013
    Look, I'm not saying Palpatine cared about anyone too much, as in this world he'd be known as a narcissistic sociopath. But, do you think Palpatine would have invested so much time with Darth Maul or Dooku if they failed as much as Vader? He went to rescue Anakin from Mustafar after sensing he was in danger. Also, his mind was conflicted with leaving him to die there, or aiding him. Sidious used the Dark Side to stabilize Anakin before the medical droids fixed him up with cybernetic limbs. I'm not saying Palpatine was a father figure, but Vader failed a lot (I.E. not killing/turning Luke Skywalker, failing to defeat Starkiller, and I know some people say it's only game mechanics to make it look cool, but Vader was defeated yet again... not so good for the 'Chosen One'.)

    Palpatine envisioned Vader becoming more powerful than him, and a minute portion of him cared for Anakin otherwise he'd have left him to die on Mustafar or would have finished him like a true Sith Lord for flopping so many times. Read ROTS, it explains Palpatine's feelings, and you get the feeling he sort of liked Anakin whereas it explains he never felt that way about his other apprentices.
  7. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Force Ghost star 8

    Nov 20, 2012
    Ani was a tool for Palps. Nuff said. When Palps saw how groovy Luke's moves were he was all like "Holla!"
    Ambervikings91 likes this.
  8. Sith_Kingpin

    Sith_Kingpin Jedi Padawan

    Feb 4, 2013
    Yep, Anakin was a disposable pawn in a game of chess. But, trust me, Palpatine had more time and more feelings for him than any other apprentice. He gave Vader numerous chances because he thought he was the future of the Sith. Palpatine is selfish and is evil, but he wanted Vader to maintain the greatness of the Sith, and with the Jedi all but purged, that's why he rescued him from Mustafar and invested the necessary time with the Chosen One.
  9. Grievousdude

    Grievousdude Jedi Master star 4

    Jan 27, 2013
    I think he might of cared for him a bit in Revenge of the Sith but in the Ultimate Sith Editon of the Force Unleashed he says to Starkiller this "Lord Vader was a broken shadow of his former self. I knew that one day, you would replace him." so I don't think he did by that time but who knows?
  10. SkywalkerSquadron

    SkywalkerSquadron Jedi Knight star 4

    Feb 2, 2013
    I think Palpatine would have sped up his plan and done it right there.
  11. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Jul 24, 2010
    just to let it be known

    after careful observation (I actually watch the films for this relationship at times) I do think Palpatine somewhat cared for Anakin,

    might not be in a father son way

    but I have made a thesis on why I think this.

    However my view is so in the minority that a thread on this very issue will be met with contempt

    so it's not worth me typing it out :p
  12. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

    Sep 2, 2012
    I could see him caring in an "owner-pet" way.
    windu4 likes this.
  13. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Jul 24, 2010
    that's rather ambiguous :p

    you can deeply care and love your pet you know :p

    unless that is what you meant
  14. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

    Sep 2, 2012
    Flagg in Stephen King's The Eyes of the Dragon has a similar attitude to the puppet king he's installed.
  15. OnesionRa

    OnesionRa Jedi Youngling

    Sep 2, 2012
    I DO think he cared a bit about him genuinely. All those years, all those talks and activity's they must have done together (Opera's, Dinner's and lord knows what else.)
    After being a large part of someones life for about 13 years, you have to develop SOME affection for them. Sith Lord although he may have been, he WAS still human, and lets face it, when you look a Sidious life, Anikan was just about the only person who had any actual affection for HIM as well (As far as I know, his dad hated him, his mom MIGHT have been good for a while but he describes her later as "Too Weak to fight back" against his father. His siblings wanted little to do with him and his master, while perhaps a bit kinder then most sith, was not the best of people.
    Sidious never really KNEW what kindness and affection WAS as far as I can tell (Ive never read Darth Plagueis)

    Just my thoughts.
  16. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Jan 1, 2011
    I do think that Palpatine had some affection and care for Anakin. But I don't think he loved him in any real sense.

    Palpatine cared about Anakin the way that a child might care for a favorite toy -- you take good care of it, you keep it in a "special" spot, and you play with it the most because it's your favorite. But it's still a toy and it has to do what you say or you'll break it. That's largely how I think Palpatine viewed the world.

    Anakin was the Jedi Order's newest, shiniest toy -- with all that power waiting to be developed -- and Palpatine couldn't wait to snatch him up. Like a kid that is jealous of his friend's top-of-the-line toy.

    I don't think, though, that that means that Palpatine in any way cared about what Anakin himself wanted or what was best for him. He viewed him simply as a tool, to be used and disposed of when a newer, better model came along (Luke).
    CT-867-5309 likes this.
  17. Ambervikings91

    Ambervikings91 Jedi Knight star 3

    Dec 1, 2012
  18. Lord Chazza

    Lord Chazza Jedi Master star 4

    Jan 4, 2013
    Speed up the plan? The plan that was 1000 years in the making? No. Don't forget that Anakin was mainly seeking assurance and sympathy from Palpatine. He would want to be told it's only natural to be angry etc. After all Anakin when asked if he was going to kill Palpatine said that he "would certainly like to." Make no mistake Palpatine still needed an excuse (the Jedi are taking over) and leverage (Anakin's wife dying) which I think is hardly leverage at all but that's a completely different story.
  19. Chainmail_Jedi

    Chainmail_Jedi Jedi Padawan star 2

    Jan 26, 2013
    I think it depends on whether or not Anakin was willing to forsake the Jedi or not. In RotS, he isn't really willing to completely forsake the Jedi until Mace attacks and tries to kill monster mash. If he told the chancellor that he was "fed up" with the Jedi, and was genuinely considering leaving the order and pursuing the Dark Side, Palpatine might have revealed himself, and just instructed Anakin to pretend to be a Jedi, while secretly training him in the ways of the Sith, until he was ready to implement his grand plan, which likely would have been able to be sprung sooner.

    If Anakin wasn't quite ready to forsake the Jedi entirely, he would probably just egg him on more, stroke his ego a bit, and wait for the big revelation.