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CT What would have happened if Yoda had joined the Rebels after his exile?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by Mace Windu's Cousin, Jul 29, 2017.

  1. Mace Windu's Cousin

    Mace Windu's Cousin Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 6, 2015
    Let's a do a what if scenario of what would have happened if Yoda had spent time training to become one with the force but also too a more aggressive approach like Obi-Wan and also involved himself in aiding the rebels.
    [​IMG]

    How do you think this would have affected the story?
     
  2. Martoto77

    Martoto77 Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 6, 2016
    It would have been consistent with the "gung ho" Yoda who immediately deemed the ill gotten clones fit for purpose and took them straight into battle. Seemingly without any further due diligence.
     
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  3. Bazinga'd

    Bazinga'd Saga / WNU Manager - Knights of LAJ star 7 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 1, 2012
    He would have been tracked down and killed by the Empire because his presene would have been force-sensed by Vadar and Palpatine
     
  4. Martoto77

    Martoto77 Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 6, 2016
    What's preventing them from sensing his presence anyway?

    The Empire are in the business of tracking down and killing the rebel Alliance. They don't need the involvement of a Jedi master they know to have escaped the purge to motivate them to do that.
     
  5. Erkan12

    Erkan12 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Nov 27, 2013
    The Rebellion would be more powerful and dangerous, however they couldn't take down the Emperor, so it wouldn't change anything.

    Yoda also explains that why that wouldn't work, their way was wrong so they had give up.

     
  6. ezekiel22x

    ezekiel22x Chosen One star 5

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    Aug 9, 2002
    Chewie would've asked him how he turned into a Muppet.
     
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  7. Bazinga'd

    Bazinga'd Saga / WNU Manager - Knights of LAJ star 7 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 1, 2012
    I am not sure where I am getting this, but I think I read that the tremendous amount of life forms on Degobah shroud his presence.
     
  8. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

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    Dec 19, 2016
    The movies would have been the same. Except the Yoda that trains Luke would have been a Force Ghost.
     
  9. DANNASUK

    DANNASUK Force Ghost star 7

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    Nov 1, 2012
    Impossible to say.

    Remember, the Yoda we see in the OT was written before the PT, Rebels and TCW were even thought up. It is really hard to say because, as finds have pointed out in teh past, Yoda in the OT is almost a complete different character to the one we meet in the PT.
     
  10. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001

    They have to a) be close enough to sense them and b) the Jedi have to make a presence to be found.

    Vader couldn't just find Luke where he was. He doesn't know that he's on Dagobah with Yoda, but he and Palpatine can both sense a disturbance in the Force that's caused by Luke meeting Yoda and in his own growing power. Just as Vader didn't know that Ahsoka was alive until he felt her presence at Lothal and felt her probing his mind. Vader suspected Obi-wan of being alive, but it wasn't until he was on the Death Star that he knew for certain as he could feel him once again. Yet prior to that, Palpatine dismissed Obi-wan as being alive. Same with Yoda.

    After discovering that the Temple's emergency beacon was altered, the Empire began the second phase of the purge. Vader, the Stormtroopers, the Inquisitors, bounty hunters and assassins were tasked with seeking out the stragglers. Those that could be found were and dealt with. Those that kept themselves hidden enough, they couldn't be found.
     
  11. Ithorians

    Ithorians Jedi Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2016
    It´s an interesting question. Obviously, in Yoda the Rebellion gains a powerful agent, but I think Yoda´s message to Ezra is that they can´t really fight fire with fire, as they would never outgun the Empire.

    Besides, from what I remember from Legends, Yoda chose Dagobah because it has a dark side energy that would mask his own Force "signature". Dave Filoni recently confirmed that the Emperor could feel specific individuals and their activities even from the other side of the galaxy, and that he used the Inquisitors to pinpoint and hunt them down later.

    With that in mind, Yoda actively participating with the Rebels could make things even harder for them, as he is like a beacon that would draw out the most dangerous enemies to them (especially Vader, and perhaps even Palpatine himself). And all of this, without considering the fact that the Sith could even choose to avoid direct confrontation and send saboteurs, infiltrators, etc, to the Alliance. Even if the Hands are no longer canon...
     
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  12. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Chosen One star 7

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    Jan 5, 2011
    He would have called down a **** storm on himself and anyone near him. He would have become public enemy #1. The Emperor and Vader would have stopped at nothing, spared no resources, to track him down and destroy him. They wouldn't play any games, no tricks, no little traps. Yoda would be too much of a threat for risky strategy. If they catch him on a planet, I can imagine them just laying the planet to waste with turbolaser fire (base delta zero), starting with his most probable location. I imagine the search for him would just as driven as the search for Luke, if not more, only Vader would not have been interested in trying to capture or turn Yoda, he'd simply want to destroy him by any means necessary. They'd go with overkill, is what I'm saying.

    Yoda had the ability to do quite a bit of damage to the Empire, but ultimately he would have died far short of his goal.
     
  13. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Force Ghost star 4

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    Feb 24, 2005
    ^ I agree. Yoda's presence with the Rebellion would've caused too much destruction -- he might as well carry around a giant green neon sign that read, "HERE, THE REBELS ARE!" everywhere he went with them.
     
  14. Martoto77

    Martoto77 Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 6, 2016
    I don't see anything in the films that suggest that the Empire are not as enthusiastic about fighting the rebels when a Jedi is not involved as they would be if Yoda was around. For why? Spite? "Oh you've got a Yoda? Well you rebels are really going to get it now." Clearly some tactical consideration would have been given to Vader or Palpatine's sensitivity. But to just write Yoda off as a liability in battle is absurd. When is Yoda any use then?

    There appeared to be nothing stopping Obi Wan from getting involved when asked.

    There is nothing in the movies that tells us that Sidious and Vader should be aware of their location unless at close proximity either.

    The real reason is that Yoda wasn't created until after Star Wars came out and only because the decision was taken to kill Obi Wan in that movie, and Luke could not continue his training in the planned sequels without a living Jedi master, apparently.
     
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  15. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    Yoda's use would be better served elsewhere. That's why he decided to go into exile before finding out about Padme's pregnancy. So long as there is a hint that he could be a threat, the Sith would double their efforts to find them and him.

    By that point it was pretty a desperate situation. Bail had been hesitant to involve him sooner, but the knowledge of the Death Star and the dissension in the Rebel Council was enough to force his hand.

    That is true. The same way that Kanan and Ezra's presence wasn't easily detectable with the fleet either. But it would result in making his capture a high priority, as it did for Luke.
     
  16. Martoto77

    Martoto77 Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 6, 2016
    You know this how? It's not referred to in the films. Speculation about his usefulness is nice, but we've no precedent of him serving better an or expressed aptitude for this "elsewhere".

    They decided to disappear "until the time is right." after the fate of Luke and Lei was decided.


    Leia feels the need to remind Obi-Wan of who her father is and why Obi-Wan should remember him. It's as if Obi Wan needs other people to tell him when he's needed, otherwise he'd just be sitting there forevefer.

    They aren't in the movies and netiher is what the Empire do about the,
     
  17. Erkan12

    Erkan12 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Nov 27, 2013
    I don't think that's true. Kenobi was a legendary Jedi Knight at the moment by portrayal and hype, but I always felt like he couldn't be the ''top'' of the order ; his direct failure in Anakin, his guarding duty over Luke on a desert planet, and his incompetency against the Emperor's powers, the mightiest of the Jedi wouldn't be like that, not that I am underestimating what Kenobi did and was doing, but these are not the job and the portrayal of the ''Grand Master of the Jedi Order'', these are the duties of a legendary and a heroic Jedi Knight. And Yoda was the perfect Zen master / Grand Master character for the Luke.
     
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  18. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    We know this because he stops fighting Palpatine. He could recover his Lightsaber and make his way back up to where he was. But he doesn't. He realizes that if he dies, any hope the Jedi have of returning will be lost. We know this because after he has decided to go into exile, Luke and Leia are born and he realizes that he and Obi-wan are better served elsewhere than just fighting the Sith.

    YODA: "Into exile I must go. Failed, I have."

    He decided that when he landed in Bail's speeder.

    Obi-wan doesn't know what Leia looks like. It's been twenty years. So in her message, she tells him who she is and why this message was sent to him. If she didn't do that, he would assume that it was an Imperial trap and not go for it. Bail and Yoda are the only ones who know that he's there, outside of the Lars.
     
  19. Darth Dnej

    Darth Dnej Jedi Master star 4

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    Apr 27, 2013
    He would get killed provided Vader or Palpatine got to him. If we are taking Legends into account, he could use battle mediation for the war effort.
     
  20. Kenneth Morgan

    Kenneth Morgan Chosen One star 5

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    May 27, 1999
    To see Yoda acting on behalf of the Rebels, check out the end of the "Star Wars: Infinities" version of ANH. Someday, somebody has to actually film that.
     
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  21. Martoto77

    Martoto77 Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 6, 2016
    We know this because he stops fighting Palpatine.[/quote]

    So you are just relying on whatever Yoda does being the only option. Yoda only fell due to circumstances and we don't know if his saber was retrievable without any difficulty.

    You're just imagining things again.



    Exile is not the same thing as determining that he should disappear until the time is right. If they were then we would have only gotten the first line.


    Good grief.

    Without saying his name Leia reminds Obi Wan that her father from Alderann used to fight alongside him in the clone wars to see if it convinces him of the Alliance's need for him. in other words there's never been any plans made for summoning Obi Wan. No secure communication channel. No preparation or anticipation for the time becoming right. It's a cold call. A shot in the dark that Obi Wan would even respond.
     
  22. Strongbow

    Strongbow Force Ghost star 5

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    Nov 6, 2014
    So you are just relying on whatever Yoda does being the only option. Yoda only fell due to circumstances and we don't know if his saber was retrievable without any difficulty.

    You're just imagining things again.



    Exile is not the same thing as determining that he should disappear until the time is right. If they were then we would have only gotten the first line.


    Good grief.

    Without saying his name Leia reminds Obi Wan that her father from Alderann used to fight alongside him in the clone wars to see if it convinces him of the Alliance's need for him. in other words there's never been any plans made for summoning Obi Wan. No secure communication channel. No preparation or anticipation for the time becoming right. It's a cold call. A shot in the dark that Obi Wan would even respond.[/quote]


    I MOSTLY agree. I think it was assumed that Obi-Wan would get back in the game at some point. And I think Obi-Wan believed he would train Luke when the time was right. In Rebels, at least, Obi-Wan seems to think that LUKE is a Chosen One, and that lines up with the idea that Obi-Wan was biding his time until the moment was right. He doesn't hesitate when he sees Leia's message. I think he's mainly trying to decide if it's time put his pieces back on the board. He seems to come to a decision and starts suggesting to Luke that he should come. I think there is room to disagree here, but I do not think either Obi-Wan or Yoda saw themselves as truly out of it for good.
     
  23. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    It was on the same floor as he was and a few feet away. Yoda realized that he doesn't have what it takes to beat Palpatine and with his knowledge of the Force, he cannot risk losing his life and endanger the future of the Jedi Order.

    Yoda is going into exile because he needs to live if the Jedi are to live. He can find new Jedi to train and keep the Order alive. It is when he finds out about the twins, that he now has two clear candidates.

    Leia was supposed to touch down in person and meet Obi-wan herself. But then her ship came under attack and she was forced to improvise by using the droids to deliver the plans and record a message. She didn't have time for anything else. And she does say his name.

    LEIA: "General Kenobi, years ago you served my father in the Clone Wars. Now he begs you to help him in his struggle against the Empire. I regret that I am unable to present my father's request to you in person, but my ship has fallen under attack and I'm afraid my mission to bring you to Alderaan has failed. I have placed information vital to the survival of the Rebellion into the memory systems of this R2 unit. My father will know how to retrieve it. You must see this droid safely delivered to him on Alderaan. This is our most desperate hour. Help me, Obi-wan Kenobi, you're my only hope."

    What kind of argument are you making here? Dignity.
     
  24. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

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    Sep 4, 2012
    Dagobah's massive amount of lifeforms shielded his presence. Not to mention that it was uninhabited by civilized sentients.
     
  25. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    The same thing that keeps him from sensing Obi-wan was alive and finding Luke. It's called distance.