Lit Where the **** did the Noghri go?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by THE EVIL CLIFFIE, Oct 4, 2013.

  1. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 5
    Is that a personal opinion or something Denning actually have said? If it is the latter, can you point me to were I can find the quote? Bitte
  2. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    "All the Denningverse's a plot, and all the characters merely tools to advance it. They have their voices and motivations, but Denning could care less."
  3. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    The Noghri were a great plotline in TTT but making them follow Leia around everywhere she went wasn't smart. SW is character heavy as it is, and every new story should be able to have its own set added to the regulars. That's why the Noghri's been coming and going ever since DE and JAT.
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  4. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    The weren't in the movies, so no one cared.

    Though given the rate Leia went through them I can understand if they got low on volunteers eventually.
    AusStig likes this.
  5. Shadow Trooper Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2013
    star 4
    While he never flat out says that all non force users are doofuses his work definitely reflects it. Look at any Dramatis Personae of his books and count how many non force users show up. Than try and count how many of those are evil and/or incompetent in the story. By the end of it you usually have only Han as a result.It is also well documented as in the 3 interviews I posted links too that he was resistant to Jaina-Jag marriage as it would "remove Jaina from his story" if she is not at the temple, which suggests that if you are not a Jedi or don't hang out at the temple you have no place in the Denning verse. This is further evidenced by his forcing Jag to quit the Empire before he could finally allow him to marry Jaina in Apocalypse and become the resident temple do nothing in Crucible.
    http://star-wars.suvudu.com/2012/03...nning-author-fate-of-the-jedi-apocalypse.html
    http://fangirlblog.com/interviews/troy-denning-part-two/
    http://roqoodepot.com/2012/03/13/fotj-apocalypse-interview-with-troy-denning/
    I can't find the interview but I believe it was Denning who was also the guy who said that Star Wars is all about the Jedi.
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  6. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    http://lightsaberrattling.blogspot.com/2013/07/exclusive-interview-troy-denning-on.html

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  7. Cynical_Ben Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2013
    star 4
    Oh Denning. You had a whole stable of characters in Tatooine Ghost and Star By Star who weren't connected to the Jedi Temple or the Order. What happened to you? What did you see? What did you see?!?
  8. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    He started plotting stories driven entirely by the Jedi.

    The Jedi order has replaced the Rebel Alliance or the New Republic as the faction which the protagonists represent, to the extent that the infighting previously exemplified by Borsk Fey'lya and Fyor Rodan has now been replaced by Corran Horn and Kyp Durron having Force slap fights or Saba Sebatyne killing Kenth Hamner.

    A story like the Hand of Thrawn in which there's no dark side threat and only one Jedi character is impossible in the contemporary Expanded Universe.
  9. Shadow Trooper Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2013
    star 4
    This is exactly why I have loathed most of the recent EU. Before the Sith obsession in the Post Prequel era, Star Wars had plenty of stories that didn't even feature force users and yet managed to feel more like Star Wars than TOR or Post NJO
  10. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    That seems to be more of the perception about what fans want for their stories - more Jedi/Sith material and the main OT characters. And the former doesn't seem far off, considering what happened with Galaxies.

    As much as the Rogue Squadron series is beloved, it snuck in as a video game tie-in. We're just lucky it didn't end up like Ruins of Dantooine did.
  11. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    Overall, I don't have a problem with TOR. If there is a time period for Sith stories, it is TOR. It's the Big 3 timeline becoming dominated by Sith which is the problem for me. I thought that problem was dealt with:
    [IMG]

    Alternatively:
    [IMG]

    The novels from 1991-1998 had a pretty good balance of Jedi issues, underworld issues, and political issues. Now the political issues involve the Jedi dealing with the government, and the underworld issues are the Jedi using the Errant Venture when necessary because Booster Terrik doesn't actually do anything else in the galaxy because he's not a living, breathing character but a cardboard cut-out that sits in a closet until the Jedi need him in the plot because the stories don't actually make an effort at making the world feel realistic or making the characters behave the way they would; they're chess pieces maneuvered through the plot as required.

    The Sith are only a symptom of the true problem, which is a rigid adherence to the film saga's tropes in storytelling, without any effort at deconstruction or reconfiguration, and formulaic and boring storytelling that is wholly plot driven from recycled plots.
    Last edited by DigitalMessiah, Oct 5, 2013
  12. Jedifirefly5 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 5, 2012
    star 2
    Leia is surrounded by Jedi and is one herself, she doesn't need them.
  13. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    They got given uniforms, you know...

    [IMG]

    THEN QUIT!
  14. TheJediBrah Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 2013
    star 1
    Interesting discussion in here it seems.

    I agree that the post New Jedi Order books have been getting a bit out of hand, and though I think Troy Denning is a good author, the path he has taken the Expanded Universe is the Dark Side!

    Personally I'm really sick of the whole "Jedi not trusted by the government" plotline. Every single series. If the new movies revolve around that I might just scream.
    Last edited by TheJediBrah, Oct 6, 2013
  15. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 5
    Gracias
  16. TheJediBrah Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 2013
    star 1
    ^ wow how could he think that Jaina and Zekk would be more suited than Jaina and Jag?

    Clouded, his judgement is.
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  17. Grey1 Host: 181st Imperial Discussion Group

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2000
    star 4
    This could be read as Han seeing the temple as 'my Jedi Temple', maybe that was another pointer showing that Denning thinks Han is a Jedi.
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  18. Gamiel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2012
    star 5
    Personally I hate that only time writers remember to use the noghri is to show how badass the new threat is:mad:
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  19. Vialco Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2007
    star 4
    Much like Zahn's other creations, the Noghri have disappeared, never to be seen again. Just like Mara Jade, Gilad Pelleaon, Thrawn, Talon Karrde and all of the others. The galaxy belongs to the new generation of characters now. Like the Barabels and the Squibs and the Jedi. :p
  20. TheJediBrah Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 6, 2013
    star 1
    And the Killiks. Don't forget the Killiks.
  21. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    What's un-Star Wars-like about TOR?
  22. Shadow Trooper Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 18, 2013
    star 4
    I'm not the best authority on TOR as I only played the Jedi Knight before I quit, but the force user heavy EU where only Jedi and Sith really matter, IMHO doesn't capture the feel of Star Wars to me. The OT didn't have the entire galaxy hinging on Force Users and while Luke, Vader and the Emperor all played crucial roles, It was the ordinary Rebels who took the Shield generator and destroyed Death Star 2. The Bantam books also heavily featured Imperial Warlords of the week, which although it got repetitive after a while, I much preferred over the proliferation of Sith as many of the Imperials managed to be capable villains while not having to be force users.Heck even the OT had Tarkin, who despite having no force sensitivity always struck me as being far more villainous than Vader, especially the callous way he orderd the Destruction of Alderaan. Of course the PT changed this by making only Force Users seem to matter and afterwards the EU followed suit and I have found much of my old enjoyment missing as a result.
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  23. DigitalMessiah Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 17, 2004
    star 5
    Maybe play Bounty Hunter, Trooper, Smuggler, or Agent storylines?
    Jedi Merkurian likes this.
  24. Charlemagne19 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2000
    star 7
    Eh, I think you'd have a different on TOR if you played Smuggler or Imperial Agent.

    It's very balanced. It's just the Jedi and Sith stories deal with Jedi or Sith.
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  25. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    And everyone wants to play Force-users. That was the lesson learned by Galaxies. People have already been complaining that the new FFG Star Wars RPG barely has any Force-users or powers, despite that there's a version coming out that deals specifically with Force users, not to mention that they are supposed to be rare in the Rebellion Era anyways.
    Frankly, the non-Force user paths seem the most interesting in TOR anyways.
    Shadow Trooper likes this.