Where was the whip?

Discussion in 'Lucasfilm Ltd. In-Depth Discussion' started by RareSaturn, Jun 6, 2008.

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  1. RareSaturn Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 20, 2008
    I only saw him use it once, it the warehouse. And I don't think he used his revolver at all!
  2. Princess_Tina Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2001
    star 6
    Maybe this is in part due to the fact that he was a captive through much of the movie, and kept disarmed by the Soviets? [face_thinking]
  3. Obi-Wan2001 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Sep 6, 2001
    star 4
    Admittedly disappointing, the lack of whip use and gun by Indy. After the first trailer premiered, people on the IMDB were going nuts about Indy seemed to be going the Spider-Man route with whip useage, just from the trailer. Well, it turns out, he really only used it that one time, outside of that awkward first useage, where he disarms a guy, if I remember corectly. By awkward, I mean, it didn't seem like Ford knew how to use it anymore. The shot of him going for the guy with the whip is pretty bad. It's really lethargic, with no real snap. And then, there's the gun thing.

    May not be a big deal to some, but those are major Indy trademarks, to be underutilized.

    I forgot about, I think he uses the whip to launch that guy through the window in the wharehouse scene, which was cool. That was pretty much the last we saw of it, though.
  4. JohnWesleyDowney Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5


    Honestly, I enjoyed the movie so much (several times now, too) I never even noticed the minimal use of the whip. The movie was entertaining and held my interest to the point I never once questioned, "gee, how come he's not using his whip more?" Didn't care.
  5. Vortigern99 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2000
    star 5
    He uses it to try to save Mac at the climax.
  6. Kwenn Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2001
    star 5
    Yeah, it was a shame it wasn't used more -- and the revolver was only used to scare off one of the Doomtown zombies. Certainly wasn't Chekov's gun... :(

    Also, he didn't even use the whip to knock Russian Roach through the window in the silo; it was a chain hanging from the ceiling.
  7. HanSolo29 Manager Emeritus + Official Star Wars Artist

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2001
    star 6
    Ehh...the whip usage didn't really bother me too much. They were either going to overdo it(which many people had feared) or find the right balance. I think they did the latter. We had a nice, action-packed opening with the whip flying and then things settled down a bit. The whip does make another appearance at the end in the collapsing temple, like Vort said, so I think it balances out. If I remember correctly, Last Crusade didn't have many whip scenes either, the most prominent being at the castle swinging from the window ledges and saving Henry Sr. from falling off the tank in the chase.

    In terms of the revolver, I didn't expect him to just whip it out and start shooting people. That's not the type of person Indy is. He kills only when he has to and shoots only when he's the one being shot at or threatened first. Threatening the graveyard warrior with it seemed to fall right into place with the character. I have no problems with its lack of use in the film.
  8. Vortigern99 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2000
    star 5
    So he used it three times in the new movie: Once to disarm the Russians in the warehouse; once to swing from the light fixture after Spalko's truck; and once to try to save Mac at the end. This compares to I think four times in Raiders, so I for one don't find it disappointing at all.
  9. JohnWesleyDowney Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    He kills only when he has to and shoots only when he's the one being shot at or threatened first.

    Kind of like Han Solo. ;)
  10. Captain_Typho Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2003
    star 5
    Doesn't he technically use it 4 times. Once to disarm the Russian. Once to swing from the beams where he crashes into the front of the truck, once to swing out of the vehicle onto the upper beams, and once to try to save mac at the end.
  11. -Phoenix- Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    He grabbed a light fixture to swing up to the beams.
  12. Vortigern99 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2000
    star 5
    ^ ^ ^ Yes, he grabbed onto a lamp and climbed it. I noticed that the second time around. ;)

    But I also remembered another one from Raiders, which makes five uses in that movie. So we are seeing somewhat of a deficit in CS. The Raiders uses are:

    1. once against the gunman, Satipo's partner;
    2. once over the pit (swung twice, but only whipped the beam once);
    3. once against the oncoming thugs in Cairo;
    4. once in the Well of Souls, up the statue of Anubis;
    5. and once to climb back up the back of the truck.

    Can someone with a photographic memory of Temple and Crusade give us a whip-count for those films? [face_batting]
  13. jedibri Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2000
    star 4
    There wasn't really room in the film for the whip.

    I think there's some images that back that up. Indy walking through the test sight houses and how colorful they were but, he looked out of place. I think this film was like that it was about sort of moving ahead.

    Like Indy had had his day and now this was Mutt's world. Not the same as it was in the 30's.
  14. NeoBaggins Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2003
    star 5
    Never ever thought about it until I saw this thread.
  15. LordSilvertouch Jedi Master

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    Apr 19, 2003
    star 4
  16. qui-gon-kim Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2001
    star 4
    Have you forgotten that Indy hardly uses his gun in Temple of Doom either? Willie throws it out of the car in the beginning of the film. Besides, Indy mostly uses his fists in all the films rather than the whip or gun.

    Like Indy had had his day and now this was Mutt's world. Not the same as it was in the 30's.

    So does that mean that Mutt's switchblade is the new whip?

  17. JohnWesleyDowney Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5

    All the Jones boys have a "male" symbol, appropriate to their age and style:

    Henry Jones Jr. - whip
    Henry Jones Sr. - umbrella
    Mutt Jones - switchblade

    Lucas always makes sure his main male characters have a phallic symbol of some sort.
    Such as a light saber.
  18. Princess_Tina Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2001
    star 6
    You're looking a little too hard for some "phallic symbol", I think. All weapons used throughout history could conceivably be interpreted as some sort of "phallic symbol" -- swords, cannons, rifles, carbines, guns, bazookas, knives, blowguns, bats, machetes, etc.

    Why single Lucas out, when all characters in all movies who carry weapons are basically in the same situation? [face_thinking]
  19. Hammurabi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 14, 2007
    star 4
    I don't think JWD is 'singling anybody out'. He's merely pointing something out. And (for the record), the three symbols in the Indiana Jones series take on more importance than weapons usually do.
  20. JohnWesleyDowney Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5
    Exactly right, Hammurabi. That's along the lines of what I meant. I'm not singling Lucas out, I'm praising him for thinking in more detail.

    Because within the Indy series of films, you can connect those symbols very specifically to those characters. Princess Tina, I don't think I was looking at it too hard, those are obvious connections. It's a part of the design of the characters. When Sean Connery tries to shoo away the birds on the beach, he doesn't say, "hey junior, throw me your whip I want to crack it and scare away the birds", Sean uses his umbrella. It's a more elegant device for an older and more conservative character. This stuff is well thought out.

  21. Princess_Tina Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2001
    star 6
    So why point out some assumed connection with "phallic symbols"? :confused:
  22. JohnWesleyDowney Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2004
    star 5
    Uh, because this is a discussion thread about THE WHIP?

    Is it okay with you if I make an ASSUMPTION or contemplate possible psychological connections? You seem to be under the mistaken impression I'm "accusing" Lucas of something or something negative. He's well-known for his interest in psychology/sociology and so forth, so it's certainly not beyond the pale. I'm sorry you're "confused." I'm merely admiring the craftsmanship of the writing and the way things have been thought out for the characters.

    GOD ALMIGHTY, TINA I'M SORRY I EVER EVEN BROUGHT THIS UP. I'm out of here.
  23. Princess_Tina Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2001
    star 6
    You still haven't answered my question. When, in the history of humanity, have people used anything for combat that couldn't be taken as a "phallic symbol"? To point this out in the context of one single fictional series seems a bit bizarre, to say the least.

    It's not that it isn't OK to make an "assumption", it's just that I can't see how any storyteller or filmmaker could have people engaging in combat without using such weapons - whether it be a knife or a bat or a knife or an umbrella or a gun or rifle. You might as well conclude that practically all weapons may be construed as a sort of "phallic symbol"

    No need to get defensive, I just asked a question. It's not an accusation or anything. :)

  24. -Phoenix- Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    You know, I'm pretty sure that part was a joke.
  25. Jedi Gunny Yahtzee Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    May 20, 2008
    star 9
    Not using the revolver and the whip was pretty disappointing, but then again hariiso Ford couldn't do as much; he's aged a whole lot since the last film.
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