Lit Which fallen Jedi disappointed you the most ?

Other than Count Dooku and Anakin Skywalker, three additional Jedi Knights has fallen to the Dark Side in the new canon.



Which Jedi dissapointed you most in that regard ?

 

Absolutely Krell, though his role/story arc more than the person himself. I thought he was at his most interesting when he was exactly what he appeared to be: a terrible general who was getting people killed and losing battles because he should never have been put in that job. The story has all kinds of wider implications, like the fact that not every clone legion was lucky enough to have Anakin or Obi-Wan leading it and maybe Jedi really aren't suited for this kind of thing. Or the fact that Republic society by and large views the clones as disposable subhumans, and the fact that Krell considers them too far beneath them to listen to or care how many of them he gets killed, is just a nastier-than-usual symptom of the bigger problem. Or it's simply an homage to the huge number of soldiers in history who have died because their commanding officer was a moron. All of which, by the way, would've made a much more powerful statement about how dysfunctional and out of touch the Republic and Jedi were becoming at the end than what we eventually got.

But, no. He's just another snarling dark side traitor who's working for Count Dooku. This is what makes me hate "twists."

 

Krell was based on me.

So, naturally, I find him terribly disappointing, and so does everyone else.

If you think about that way, it's a very realistic, true to life depiction.

I'll see you in Chaos, Krell, so you won't be lonely.

 

Quinlan. Not necessarily at Quin himself but at the predictable, sad way that story went and because ultimately it ended in Ventress' death.

Krell, I felt, was a great villain TBH and what was really cool was that it set up for Order 66 in a unique way, with some nice foreshadowing: Rex, who really wanted to kill Krell, couldn't bring himself to pull the trigger even when he had seen Krell's treason with his own eyes...whereas Dogma, who was blindly loyal to Krell, and didn't even see the treason with his own eyes (he was in a prison cell) stole Fives' blaster and shot Krell without a second thought.

What's so interesting about that is that Dogma is one of the "newer" batches of clones, along with Tup. Tup, of course, was the clone whose Order 66 microchip malfunctioned. So it seems that the newer clones were more inclined to kill the Jedi than those like Rex who'd been serving alongside the Jedi for years already. That sets up for Rex deserting the Empire in Rebels, too.

 

I voted for Pong Krell, because their was absolutely zero reason for him to turn to the dark side. Bariss thought she was stopping the Jedi from committing violence and Vos was trying to get deep undercover.

 

Quinlan Vos because I preferred him in legends. Also him falling in love with ventress was totally unnecessary

I followed the Jedi code all my life....what's that I'm being paired with a dark side warrior whose attractive ONLY in a BDSM kind of way. Jedi code never heard of it!

 

Are you familiar with Quinlan Vos in Legends?

 

I may be a hypocrite but Vos in legends fell to the dark side, fell in love and got redeemed at it felt right!

In canon it felt wrong! Maybe because when they introduced him in NU-canon he was so carefree....

 

Disappointed in the fact there lame? Or that they were once great Jedi?

 

SilentGuy66

Well, in Legends it happened over the course of an entire comic series, basically. In the NEU it's been confined to a single, constricted book that was intended to be eight episodes of a TV series. Yeah, it definitely doesn't feel right.

 

Quinlan Vos is a huge disappointment in the new canon. He basically turned to the dark side because he was physically attracted to a woman and he blindly followed her teachings because apparently, a Jedi MASTER who supposedly knows nothing else but the Jedi way his entire life takes 1 minute and 27 seconds of convincing that the dark side is what he needs to finish his mission. In Legends, as Revanfan1 said, his story took over 60 issues to tell, and still, his reasoning to go to the dark side was much more intriguing and original.

Krell, I can understand why he turned evil. He had the intuition to foresee where things were heading, so he thought he may as well join the "winning" team. Barris is a mixed bag for me since it came out of nowhere and there was no character build up for what she did, but it's still not hard to see why she changed her opinion for the Jedi. She just reacted in a pretty extreme way, however, it is not something far fetched.

Quinlan, in short, did it to get laid.

 

Barriss annoys me because she's always been a "paragon of light" type character. It's the same logic as making Captain America a HYDRA Agent. It's dumb. Sometimes a hero can just be a hero and not need to go bad.

 

Understand the(?) now after reading a few posts. I voted Vos since it wasn't animated.

 

Pong Krell

 

Agree about Barris, they should have either revealed once that Geonosian worm took her over its influence didn't fade after it was removed so we have a Goa'uld in play or reveal what led her there with a flashback or two but no they couldn't be bothered to cover their obvious mistake!

 

Bariss is definitely the fall I dislike the most. Not just for ruining a decent character (though old EU had already mostly been thrown out by then, or at least the signs were there), but also for how stupid those episodes were. With plenty of plotholes.

I don't like Krell, and as someone else mentioned above, I wouldn't have minded him as just an ax-crazy, bloodthirsty maniac with no regard for clones, instead of a straight-up mwa-ha-ha wannabe Sith apprentice. The first backstory would have some nuance, the second, he just wants to join Dooku's side and that was his audition. I haven't read the Vos book (didn't like him in Legends, doubt I care for the nu-canon version either), so can't really comment on that.

With Barriss, we only saw her once in the show before, during the Geonosis episodes, and she and Ahsoka were good friends. Then that's the last we hear of her for years, until she is just suddenly added back to the show as the obvious traitor. With no explanation for how she did everything (the resources for the bombing, the power and skill to Force choke someone from some distance away while Ahsoka can just stare on, to plant the evidence framing Ahsoka, etc.).

Not to mention keeping Ventress' red lightsabers in her room, how stupid can she be, to keep that kind of evidence around? Only long-time fans would remember Bariss (season 2, then season 5), yet there's no build-up for her fall, and not much remorse for her framing Ahsoka either, she's just suddenly very vicious. Maybe her mind was warped by the worm, or something, but it just comes off as very sudden, when a brand new character would have worked too. A new character would have been an even more obvious culprit, but its not like TCW ever cared much about subtlety (or logic or quality that much). And mostly it was just to make Ahsoka look all the more pitiful, abandoned by the Jedi, and betrayed by her friend, boo-hoo. Whatever.

I still wonder if Bariss ever could show up again in Rebels, or something like that, but probably not.

 

I thought Pong Krell by the end of part 3 of umbara had to be evil considering it was starting to get ridiculous with how much of an ******* he was to his clones.

In short for Krell to have ultimately been a "good guy" would be too complex for what was basically a show aimed at kids

 

Yeah, it seemed pretty obvious that they were using Barriss because they wanted an already established good guy Jedi to make the betrayal even more shocking. Except that, as you say, Barris had only shown up in a couple episodes years before, half the audience probably didn't even remember her at all. Yes, a new character would have been an even more obvious culprit, but only barely more obvious. And it wouldn't have required sacrificing an established character to the needs of the plot.

For all that, I wouldn't mind Barriss showing up in Rebels. It'd be interesting if she'd managed to channel her rebellious feelings into a better and more productive cause.

Also, note that somebody on this blog has already put a stupendous amount of effort into turning the Barriss/traitor plotline into something that makes sense and is genuinely interesting - http://boards.theforce.net/threads/in-which-kablob-goes-on-about-barriss-offee.50023339/. The Barriss plotline is easier to appreciate on that level, or at least it was for me, after having read that. But I don't believe for a moment that the writers had thought all those things through when they put the script together.

 

Pre-OT Vader. What a let down (sans Rebels Vader...that scene with half his face showing and talking to Ahsoka...one of the most interesting/cool Star Wars moments).

 

This trend started with Nahdar Vebb and only got worse as the show went on.

 

Krell. Vos was never anything more than a subject of fanboyism to me, and Bariss was a generic Jedi before she fell, while Krell was an interesting character for both sides of The Force.

 

Nahdar didn't fall, per se, he was just incredibly impulsive and it got him killed.

 

Oh, I'm aware. I just stated that he was just the first addition of a long list of characters who had potential that only ended up getting ruined down the line. Nahdar was looking like he would be an interesting character and he dies. Pong Krell seemed to be a different kind of Jedi in the series who treats the clones as nothing more than a biological weapon to be used and disposed of once they are no longer useful. It turns out that instead of that he was a generic Sith wannabe THE WHOLE TIME! Vos is just terrible in this series. Barriss is possibly the worst due to not appearing in the series until WAAAAY later and is a Sith agent out of nowhere. Why? Just why?

 

Agreed. Well, calling Barriss a Sith agent is a bit inaccurate, but other than that, yeah.