Who cried when Anakin burst into flames?

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by anibad, Nov 12, 2005.

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  1. RebelScum77 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2003
    star 6
    This just isn't true. Lucas has definitely said you're supposed to feel pity for Anakin at the end. It's the reason we see him crying on Mustafar. There was actually a line where Anakin asks Obi-Wan for help while lying on the lava bank, but it was cut because it was a little too much. But the fact that it was originally there helps to show that Lucas wanted us to feel both pity and horror at what he'd become. Hell, even Padme still believes in him, that definitely is important. If we felt nothing but hate for him, why on Earth would we want Luke to redeem him later on? That just makes no dramatic sense. I feel like I post these quotes all the time because no one remembers them.


    "There's always this good in you. And the good part is saying 'what am I doing?'. Then the bad part kicks in and says 'I'm doing this for Padme, I'm doing this for the galaxy and so we can have a better life'. But the good part is always saying 'WHAT AM I DOING?!"
    --George Lucas to Hayden Christensen, Hyperspace Webdoc.

    "The problem is that Anakin more or less sells his soul to the devil, and in doing so is FED A BUNCH OF PROPAGANDA, which HE IS FORCED TO BELIEVE BECAUSE OF THE POSITION HE'S IN. But it's all actually A CON, so you can be very sympathetic if you allow yourself to be DECIEVED BY THE CON as well."
    --Hayden Christensen, SW INSIDER 82

    ?Anakin/Darth does what he does because he believes he?s doing it for the good of the universe.?
    --Hayden Christensen, GQ Magazine

    "If you start with Star Wars, then Vader's just the villain, and that's it. But you don't realize that he's a human being, that he's got problems you don't realize that he could have been saved, that he was tricked and can be resurrected."
    --George Lucas

    "The part I am working on now is mostly about Darth Vader, who he is, where he came from, how he became Luke and Leia?s father, what his relationship to Ben is. In Jedi the film is really about the redemption of this fallen angel. Ben is the fitting good angel, and Vader is the bad angel who started off good. All these years Ben has been waiting for Luke to come of age so that he can become a Jedi and redeem his father. That?s what Ben has been doing, but you don?t know this in the first film."
    --George Lucas, quoted in L. Bouzereau, Star Wars: The Annotated Screenplays

    "You learn that Darth Vader isn?t this monster. He?s a pathetic individual who made a pact with the Devil and lost. And he?s trapped. He?s a sad, pathetic character, not a big evil monster. I mean, he?s a monster in that he?s turned to the Dark Side and he?s serving a bad master and he?s into power and he?s lost a lot of his humanity. In that way, he?s a monster, but beneath that, as Luke says in Return of the Jedi, early on, ?I know there?s still good in you, I can sense it.? Only through the love of his children and the compassion of his children, who believe in him, even though he?s a monster, does he redeem himself."
    --George Lucas, quoted in J. Windolf, ?Star Wars: The Last Battle,? Vanity Fair, 2005
  2. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    even with all those quotes i agree with C76 and think that lucas failed to make people feel sorry for him, all the fans i ve spoken too were sorry for obi wan and padme and mace.etcetc etc but not for anakin
  3. Sidious_T Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 2, 2004
    star 4
    I personally felt sorry for Obi the most. Not Padme, as she wasn't too bright to see what he was all about. And Anakin, not at all.
  4. sithrules70 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2005
    star 4
    obi wan wasnt too bright either to see what he was about, no one knew until the truth was evident
  5. AnnLouise Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 10, 2005
    star 3
    Maybe because Tarkin and the Emperor are not presented as the main character of the Saga by GL. They are the Evil Flunky(Tarkin) and the cackling Evil Ruler(Palpatine). We don't know anything about their inner lives, their personal relationships, we aren't asked to sympathize with them as they grow up. With Anakin, we as the audience are asked to do all those things, then watch that same character commit genocide.
  6. arbed Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 24, 2004
    star 5
    I shed a tear or two, but not for Vaderkin, for Obi-Wan. The guy's whole life was just turned upside down. His face during the "Chosen One" speech says it all. That gets my sympathy, not "I hate you!"
  7. RolandofGilead Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2001
    star 7
    I didn't cry then. As I said before, I felt more emotions for the lost Jedi and especially for Obi-wan. But I will say that after the initial days of RotS release, when I was watching AFI's tribute to George Lucas they had a montage of scenes from all the SW films before showing Obi-wan's final lament. There was a shot of little innocent Jake Lloyd among all the others and it just broke my heart. To think that he went from such goodness to a fate literally worse than death really touched me.
  8. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    Watch "A Life Redeemed" on the "Star Wars: A Musical Journey". It really does it well with Anakin.
  9. RolandofGilead Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2001
    star 7
    If I could only find my disc. I pulled it out of the DVD player when the complaining got too loud and stuffed it into another DVD case. I just can't remember which one. :(
  10. Adm_Thrawn Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 2004
    star 4
    One time, I put my Attack of the Clones DVD into a Blockbuster case and dropped it in the drop-off slot. Worst day a my life....
  11. RolandofGilead Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2001
    star 7
    [image=http://members.tripod.com/young_obiwan/scream.jpg]
    Nooo!!!
  12. raymond Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 30, 2003
    star 1
    i almost cried.

    i was very moved in the last hour.

    i still get chills when i watch ROTS.
  13. Philip023 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 30, 2002
    star 3
    rebelscum77....I think what a couple of us are trying to say is that if the scene or scenes in ROTS were supposed to cause a certain degree of pity or sadness for Anakin, I'm not sure the scenes convey it.

    Towards the end of ROTS - after the Jedi are killed; the younglings murdered; Padme strangled - I was absolutely ready for Anakin to be slayed.

    Like I said before, if there was any pity for him, it was towards the manner in which he was crippled. Being burned alive. An awful fate for anyone good or bad.

    At least for me, I can see where you're going with this - that we are being showed that there is conflict in Anakin. While I think I can appreciate this, I don't start to feel pity or empathy for Anakin until ROTJ - when Vader is on Endor. We see that Luke has ignited something in Vader.

    But, in ROTS - no tears, pity or sympathy for Anakin on my part. I'm not sure the movie conveys such either.
  14. RebelScum77 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 2003
    star 6
    I understand your point of view here Philip. One of my main points was that being de-limbed and burned alive is too terrible a fate for anyone, even Palpatine didn't have such a fate and he's far more deserving. The amount of pity one feels toward Anakin himself is absolutely subjective. Some feel none, while others are more compassionate, it just depends on your like and understanding of the character. Lucas did intend for us to feel sorry for him, but the level of which is up to the individual person, as it is with anything we discuss here.
  15. R2_Did_Who Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 2005
    Lucas failed in this regard I believe.
  16. SEPARATESICKLEROOK2 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 1, 2003
    star 2
    I did. the whole last half from the purge to the death star is an emotional train wreck. yes he turned to evil, and yes he got what was coming to him, but to see a person that was good fall so fast is a tragedy, and lucas did do his job well with this movie. seeing him burn was nightmarish, and knowing what he was to become after is only more scary. that scene is forever etched in my mind now. i have waited my whole life to see that.
  17. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    haven't spoken with me then, i take it.
  18. TheCRZA Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 29, 2005
    star 4
    I agree that it's not presented as a sympathetic moment for Anakin.
    If anything, it is just deserts. It is not as though Anakin
    does not have it coming.

    To think that Anakin some deserved some universal forgiveness
    at that moment is to disregard the hour leading up to that moment.
    There's no contrition in him, no regret. His only words
    are words of hate to the one person how actually would have
    forgiven him without an act contrition.

    I think Anakin is great. Vader, as well.
    But my sympathy and empathy lie completely with
    the bearded one on Mustafar.

    You don't get to stick a knife in the Jedi Order's back,
    slaughter innocent children, incidentally the future,
    and use the force to choke your pregnant spouse
    and get to be the good guy at the end of the film.

    His attack on Padme is even worse because he does
    the force to do so... he won't even lower himself
    to physically assault her. It's about power and ego.

    Nah, it was carthetic to watch him burn.
    Even more so to see the pain he endured
    getting that suit put on.

    In the end, Anakin pays less than any of his loved ones
    for his sins.
  19. the_unknowable_jedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2005
    star 4
    i did tear up a little when Anakin was being burned alive while yelling in pain. i guess i really appreciate moments like that even though they are sad to watch. But i have no sympathy what so ever for anakin. it just rattles me alittle to see somthing like that.
  20. darth_frared Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 2005
    star 5
    why of course. :rolleyes:
  21. MasterP Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2003
    star 7
    I really didn't care that much for Anakin in episode II or episode III, so I didn't cry.
  22. lovelucas Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 2004
    star 4
    some of the best visual acting in all 6 films. anakin/hayden's face as he is suffering the pain of being burned alive... looked real to me. and i agree with those who opine that no one deserves this kind of punishment. for those who say he got what he deserves due to the everything that happened at the temple, i just can't agree at all. anakin has abandoned the jedi and embraced sithhood but let's remember how he became so desperate to do this ~ that in his eyes and circumstance, there were no other options. any other choice was destroyed when mace was.



    so much is again conveyed silently - obi wan throughout the duel and the acknowledgement that he has indeed failed anakin - the regret and sadness all shown in that gesture as he is leaving mustafar with 3PO at the controls.
  23. TheSaberBlacksmith05 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Dec 25, 2005
    I cried because of the hurt in Obi_Wans face because he new he just ended a a brotherhood thing. I mean heck Obi was like a big brother too him he raised him since he was ten and taught him how to live and the ways of the force and also blamed himself for what Anakin had become.

    It also hit close to home for me cause i had friends who i thought of as brothers and sisters do bad things and our frienships ended in a violent argument cause they made a bad decision rather then taking my advice.
  24. SWJaggy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 9, 2003
    star 4
    I'll admit that I did cry. How could I not? My best friend who went also was laughing (but I got him back by laughing when Padme died.)

    And like I said, how could I not cry? It was the cutie of the century out there! But it's okay b/c he was still hot, literally! (I have to say that so I don't feel so bad and start breaking down.)
  25. THEFORCEROCKS Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 23, 2004
    star 4
    for those who say he got what he deserves due to the everything that happened at the temple, i just can't agree at all. anakin has abandoned the jedi and embraced sithhood but let's remember how he became so desperate to do this ~ that in his eyes and circumstance, there were no other options. any other choice was destroyed when mace was.


    There were always other options LoveLucas. Padme offered him her love on Mustafar and a chance to leave everything behind when they still could.Also what about him nearly hurting his wife some people were glad to see him get what he deserved. I didnt necessarily cry because its not that deep for me but it shocked the heck out of me. I remember reading about the duel in the novels but to see it come to life was interesting.

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