ST Who's The Baddie?

True, but it would make me lol even harder if he someohow survives

 

Maybe it was put out there as a ruse so someone else dying will be a surprise, like Chewy.

 

Seems to be, yes.

 

Jar jar is the baddie. He is a sith lord and im not joking

 

We know.

 

The worst kept secret is Darth Plagueis
Seriously, if "Snoke" was a new character, like people shout from the rooftops whenever Plagueis is mentioned, why the secrecy?
I don't see any reason for it.
If it's Plagueis, that's why it's a secret and a reveal for the audience.
Serkis said "it's a new character" then he said "it's a newly introduced character".
That's the ONE thing the Plagueis naysayers have. That's the only ammunition and they think it's as good as 100% proof. It's not
Forget everything else in the article that fits with Plagueis, what about the decisions that were made on what is and isn't canon.
Plagueis is talked about in RotS, then there is a book written about him. That book is no longer canon, but Plagueis is made canon in a very specific way in Tarkin novel. That IS canon.
Also that was MADE CANON after The Force Awakens was set in motion. There is a reason Tarkin is canon and Plagueis isn't canon.
There is a reason for all the secrecy surrounding Snoke. There is a reason for everything.
If Abrams ever said Snoke is not Plagueis, that means ZERO, we all know why.
The main villain for this new trilogy is going to be Palpatine's master. That's how you continue the saga. Just like you continue the Skywalker story, you continue the story of the first 6 movies too.
Who is most likely to want to continue Vader's legacy, a completely new villain, totally unrelated to the story, or the guy who created him?
That "leaked fan art" of the snake. That's to create further crazy speculation on Snoke being a snake and try and throw people off the scent of the big reveal we will see in the movie.

 

Exactly. If he was Plagueis, then they should have announced it and avoided the mistake that has plagued ¨Star Trek Into Darkness¨. We ALL knew it was Khan, so the big reveal of the villains true identity had no effect.

 

That's right.....just like we all know it's Plagueis or Plagueis related. Only the hardcores will get it at first, that represents about 10% - 15% of the audience. It won't make a difference to the casual movie goer....aka more than 50% of the audience, but it'll make sense to the narrative and connect everything. It's Plagueis...and good, i'm glad, it should be Plagueis.

 

Off the wall theories seem so much more interesting. I'm not that familiar with the canon outside of the movies and from what I have heard, the EU that follow the OT in the timeline will not apply to these new movies. So I am wondering, is there anything in the canon that would make it impossible for Leia to emerge as a hidden dark lord?

 

I think this is possible and my thread might be low down or on page 2. Reason most don't want is because it's "Princess Leia". I LIKE darkside force power using Leia more than General forget she's a Skywalker Leia

 

The idea that Leia could have gone over to the darkside was brought up as far back as 2013. I don't see it in her character to do so. I could see her trip dark slightly in a political or military sense, but to go full-blown darkside....no way...it's not her. There are better ways to go with the story imo, not to mention it would just seem off and weird.

 

She is Force sensitive, a Skywalker and has no Jedi training. She lost her kid/s, one turned into another Darth Vader and then she split with hubby Han.
Really don't think it's possible, ignoring the title, which she has long since given up?

 

I don't know. No one is "immune to the light" unless they're dead, literally. One can be figuratively dead and see the light.

Do we know if Kylo knows that Han is his father. I could see Han telling the kid the truth and Kylo not accepting it and killing his father.

It seems like folks around here take hard and fast positions without having all the knowledge and considering any nuance new info might provide.

 

What we have against the Plagueis theory:
- He is dead.
- It is explicitly said that his powers can't save him.
- Snoke is supposed to be inhumanly tall and with a facial structure that is impossible to do without mocap. (sooo not a Muun)
- Snoke is explicitly said to be a new character.
- It is heavily implied if not outright stated that Snoke is not a Sith.

 

Welllllllllll............. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Nix_Card/Canon

 

If Plagueis was the villain, it wouldn't be kept as a massive secret and denied because that would make no sense, be confusing when revealed, and alienate casual viewers.

If Plagueis was the villain, it would be more likely that the marketing/interviews would urge people to rewatch prequels to gain context. Plagueis is so little known that him being in the film is not/would not be a shock/surprise. It's time to accept that Snoke is Snoke, and the lack of info about hi, is because he is mysterious and because the focus is on Kylo, not because he is Plagueis

 

While I'm not 100% convinced with regard to Plagueis (even though I am a Plagueis theorist), however I do think Snoke is an alter ego (and Plagueis is my front runner), and I do think Snoke is the main baddie. Not the most active baddie, but the head honcho baddie.
clinteastwoodbradfield I would say that keeping all details regarding Snoke secret is condusive to him having a true identity yet to be revealed, whether that identity be Plagueis or not.
IMO as Plagueis is so little known, it would work well in the marketing to keep the details secret... once the surprise is given, then the viewer can go back, rewatch, penny drops, etc.
Funny thing is, I'd say that both our views on the Snoke marketing strategy can be seen as perfectly plausible.

It may be that he is some other unknown Sith lord, but there will be a connection to Sidious (and more than the fact he is using Sidious' old army). Of that I am convinced.

 

I'll come here and eat plates of crow if Snoke=Plagueis, but I have to tell you I think it would be a terrible idea.

It was pretty obvious from SIdious conversation with Anakin in ROTS, that SIdious killed him. The whole notion of ROTJ is that the Sith has been destroyed. I'd probably be okay if NEW Sith come back eventually if the movies keep going, but I love the idea that Kylo Ren and Snoke AREN'T Siths. BTW: JJ Abrams confirmed that Kylo Ren is not a Sith and he works for Snoke. Snoke is not a SIth. And he's not Darth Plagueis.

 

I'll eat crow if Snoke is not a Sith. Hell, I'll eat crow, raven and rook.
It has been confirmed Kylo is not a Sith.
It has been confirmed Kylo is a Knight of Ren.
It has been confirmed Snoke is a powerful darkside user. (Deliberately vague IMO).
It has NOT been confirmed Snoke is a KoR.
Snoke is confirmed as being affiliated with the First Order.
Snoke is confirmed as being affiliated with KoR.
It's been confirmed that Snoke is at home with a lightsabre.
It has been confirmed that not all KoR use lightsabres.

Snoke not being a Sith is all well and good if they're all KoR, and all friends, and no one is using anyone else. But I have a sneaking suspicion Kylo is being used by Snoke.

 

Plagueis was nothing more than exposition. It would bewilder me if Snoke turned out to be Plagueis. There are so many things they can do with a brand new character... why use one who was nothing more then a namedrop in ROTS? It would be odd.

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Chewbacca/Canon Chewbacca is barely shorter and he needs no mocap or CGI. In fact Chewie is a midget by Wookie standards. So what's your point?

 

This is what I'm talking about by flawed arguments; if this was the argument against Plagueis, it could and can be argued against.

I agree, Plagueis was nothing more than a namedrop. But if the thematic direction the ST went in had called for continuity of Sith, the namedrop could have been cleverly appropriated as a way of presenting the ST as being entwined with the entire saga in an interesting way - the fact that it was just a namedrop means that there would be freedom to build on it on a multitude of ways, making it a new character for all intents and purposes, but one which allows for a new reading of old scenes; there's nothing wrong with that idea, in principle.

The problem is that no evidence or leaks support the hypothesis, and the more we learn about the lore of this film, the less there seems a need for Plagueis in order for the roles of the villains to make sense

 

Andy Serkis isn't over 2.5 m tall and looking like he got squashed in a trash compactor. That's my point. Yo.

 

The baddie is Snoke, a brand new villain, and that's what I'll believe unless the movie tells me otherwise.

 

No Serkis isn't very tall, but he is hired for roles that require a bit more magic than a tall guy in a suit.