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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST Who's The Baddie?

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by fishtailsam, Oct 31, 2012.

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  1. Darth Chiznuk

    Darth Chiznuk Superninja of Future Films star 8 Staff Member Manager

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    Oct 31, 2012
    Maybe we can have the best of both worlds and have a Plagueis apprentice who is completely unknown. I'd say if they do include him that's probably the route they'll go. One character to tie the series together and another for all the fans to speculate about. I hope the villain has a great backstory and they don't reveal too much about him/her in Episode VII. Oh and definitely a well written villain. One of the best written villains of the last decade that I can think of was The Operative from Serenity and Chiwetel Ejiofor was so chilling in a quiet and restrained way.
     
  2. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    Yeah the villain is THE most important thing. A lotta movies suffer from having weak villains.
     
  3. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    THIS THIS THIS! My dream would be a unknown Main but with Plagueis as a emperor role. Maybe have the unknown villain tease fans about who his "master" is. Like maybe mention that his master taught him to not fear death and how pointless it is, or maybe teases the new hero about Plagueis' connection to Luke and Anakin. Would also make you wonder *regarding the new guys origin* if Plagueis made it so he can't die because what would make this guy soo special that Plagueis would decide to prevent him dying *or whatever* OH the possibilities!
     
  4. Bullhead CIty

    Bullhead CIty Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 1, 2012
    [​IMG]

    "Just walk away and I spare ye lives."
     
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  5. Bullhead CIty

    Bullhead CIty Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 1, 2012
    You are correct on both counts. However, George not wanting to do more movies after the PT was an issue more due to his age (as he himself has publically stated), and how long he would have to work (at least another decade) to see his vision realized. The TV avenue allowed George to just write scripts and share ideas w/o the commitment to "CREATE" for a job. I would assume most artists feel similarly about the spontaneity of art as opposed to meeting corporate deadlines. The general public has been clamoring for sequels since 1977. If Lucas specifically outlined to the public his treatments for episodes post-ROTJ, the man would never have peace. He would never be allowed to create anything new and promote it because all interviews would devolve into Star Wars questions; on a much worse level then post-ROTS. Do you honestly think the guy ran out of ideas making ROTJ? Or perhaps his vision was significantly narrowed in some way? If you knew about the man, not the CEO, George found out his wife had been cheating on him during the ESB creation process. She was one of George's main creative partners up to that point. So, one could deduce that the SW franchise for Lucas, at the time, was inherently tied to his wife and their many levels of relationship. Against his well publicized plans to make the series for the next 20 years, it was during ESB when George decided to "end" the series with ROTJ. He wanted to be done with it. The man was heart broken.This same sourness in Lucas life following a very messy divorce from his wife spilled over into The Temple of Doom. Lucas did not feel like being cute and instead focused on demonism, child slaves, master / servant oppression, etc. If anyone or anything is to blame for the delay and false hopes of a full SW anthology, I would place that squarely on the shoulders of George's unfaithful mate. Then one could wonder what could have been...?

    The PT allowed Lucas to make more SW films in a relative safe way. All he had to do was fill in the blanks, and leave his end point intact. Rather a genius move from both a business and artistic POV. If one were to harshly criticize Lucas' career the past 15 years or so, the continuing argument that you make concerning a personal distaste for "retreaded storylines" is the definition of the PT. I'm not asking in a sarcastic way, but what were your thoughts on the PT?

    Duality, circle of life, synchronicity, life parallels are all part of the basic SW mythology.

    I can understand your desire of a new villain. I do too. (By new i mean no Vader). But the novel, from it's inception to it's spectacular debut, is different from anything yet conceived for the EU. There is something about this work that seems more important than general professional fan fiction.
     
  6. Bullhead CIty

    Bullhead CIty Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 1, 2012
    We need to consider Sith names as well:

    Darth Sidious: Insidious. One who wore two faces. Who played the game of divide and conquer from the inside.

    Darth Maul: Maul. Self explanitory.

    Darth Tyrannus: Tyrannical leader of the violent Seperatist movement.

    Darth Vader: Invader. Invaded the Jedi Temple with clones as Anakin, not as a Sith Lord.

    Darth Plagueis: A Plague. As a true plague he would be one that was genuinely hard to kill, difficult to completely eliminate.
     
  7. StoneRiver

    StoneRiver Force Ghost star 4

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    Oct 6, 2004
    If he/she was Plagueis' apprentice does that mean he can be killed off then come back in EPVIII, thus keeping the villain for the entire trilogy?

    Oh no! That means Maul could be in with a shot! [face_shame_on_you] :p
     
  8. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    Or maybe we can wonder if Plagueis is actually telling him the truth. Maybe Plagueis lied to him/her in order to make it so the guy wont feel fear *why feel fear if you can't die?*. SEE these are the questions that could be beautiful if we get a Unknown/Plagueis team up.
     
  9. Revenge of the Dak

    Revenge of the Dak Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 27, 2012
    There's no reason Plagueis would have to use this power of "life giving" to an apprentice. It could be set up like "you have failed me for the last time" kinda thing. Or, he knows that what ever he brings back to life would be "unnatural". Not, saying SW zombies but something to unruly to control.

    Just a thought...
     
  10. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    I'm just guessing WHAT IF. I dont know anything about plagueis TBH but if they went that direction *plus he said he could keep the people he cared about from dying so he if he cared about...ah whatever* it would just be a question that we'd all speculate on. Not saying he would but I have a feeling we might speculate on if Plagueis has made it so people other than him can't die. Plus it could make the Apprentice/Plagueis relationship a bit more interesting if its not jsut another Vader/Palpatine situation.
     
  11. Bullhead CIty

    Bullhead CIty Jedi Master star 3

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    Dec 1, 2012
    I like the opposite: Plagueis could have evolved his abilities to kill the midi-chlorians in other Force users. Thus, worse than death, his victims whose lives have grown accustomed to force use could no longer do so. Powerless. Similar to Assyrians of ancient times cutting off big toes and thumbs of prisioners so they were unable to run or handle weapons in defiance.
     
  12. Count Yubnub

    Count Yubnub Force Ghost star 5

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    Oct 1, 2012
    He's a Muun, he'll need to be CG.
     
  13. Darth_Pevra

    Darth_Pevra Chosen One star 6

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    May 21, 2008
    A secret Vader or Palpatine apprentice would be far more interesting imo. That villain would have a far more tangible connection to the Skywalkers than a Plagueis apprentice ever could (well, unless we find out said apprentice is Lando Calrissian, but that's kind of crazy) and you could still go the mystery angle.
     
  14. Revenge of the Dak

    Revenge of the Dak Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 27, 2012
    Sorry bout that. I wasn't responding to your post. I was posting at the same time you were. I actually read your post as similar to mine. :)

    I think it could be a great to have a super baddie if he could control who lives and who dies.
     
  15. Fleab88

    Fleab88 Jedi Master star 4

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    Sep 12, 2012
    Can't see how it would have any more of a connection. A secret apprentice honestly doesn't sound all that intimidating to me. I think have it done in other Star Wars materials and a very regular basis would also hurt them a bit.
     
  16. Revenge of the Dak

    Revenge of the Dak Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 27, 2012
    That is very interesting as well!

    If this baddie could wipe you of all your power that would be something terrible and scary. Just what I want in a baddie!
     
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  17. StoneRiver

    StoneRiver Force Ghost star 4

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    Oct 6, 2004
    This is what happens after Sidious kills Plagueis:
    But he also experienced a sensation of sadness and loss in the Force. Sidious initially feared that the cause of this unease was a sign that his master's experiments had succeeded after all, that Plagueis' spirit had somehow survived earthly destruction, and would return at any moment to exact vengence on his treacherous apprentice. However, after learning of Darth Maul's apparent death at the hands of Obi-Wan Kenobi on Naboo, Palpatine dismissed his concerns, deciding that this was the true cause of the feeling of loss he experienced. - taken from http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis

    Also:
    Plagueis was a master of esoteric and unnatural aspects of the Force.[9] With it, he was able to manipulate the essence of life,[20] a power Palpatine believed was directly tied to his inward sight.[7] Plagueis could save others from death and, when his power was applied to the extreme, create new life from the midi-chlorians found in all lifeforms.[17] Plagueis even discovered the ability to retain one's identity in the Force while becoming one with it, but this manner of surviving death did not appeal to him, as he was not concerned with the nonmaterial world. - taken from http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis

    Plagueis and apprentice is certainly a contender.


    EDIT:
    TCW SPOILER AHEAD

    The Jedi High Council then expelled Tano from the Jedi Order and turned her over to the Republic for trial. Tano came very close to a conviction and death sentence, but she was acquitted at the last minute by the forced confession of a captured Offee. While the Council pardoned Tano and offered to bring her back into the Order, Tano refused and left the Jedi Temple. - taken from http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ahsoka_Tano

    Plagueis and Ahsoka Tano is certainly a contender.
     
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  18. Darth_Pevra

    Darth_Pevra Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    May 21, 2008
    Fleab88
    The connection would stem from Vader basically having two sons, one light and one dark. Such an apprentice would certainly share some traits with his master. There, connection. Intimidation factor relies on the shown powerlevel of the villain and his personality.

    And yes, it is not very original, but honestly, Star Wars plots were never very original...

    Another option is the whole "child of Sidious" idea. That's my favorite at the moment.
     
  19. Darth_Pevra

    Darth_Pevra Chosen One star 6

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    May 21, 2008
    Maybe a Jedi would be scared but as a normal being I find this terribly unimpressive.

    How about a basilisk stare ability instead? Sucking the power of someone renders him immobile, in a zombie like state. Neither really alive nor dead. Soulless.
     
  20. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    That reminds me of this
    [​IMG]
    Haha....I kinda want to see a Plagueis version of this.
     
  21. Revenge of the Dak

    Revenge of the Dak Jedi Knight star 1

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    Nov 27, 2012
    That would be cool. According to SW everyone has midi clorines (sp, who cares@!). If Plaguesis had the ability to control reqular people and just throw them at the heros, that would be something.
     
  22. The Umpire Strokes Bach

    The Umpire Strokes Bach Jedi Padawan

    Registered:
    Dec 21, 2012
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    I think he's pretty cool looking myself.
    Seems his design is probably already locked down if this is anything to go by.
    I assume that once it's a toy it's pretty much a done deal.
    This figure/miniature is pretty hard to find already as well.
    Does anybody have this Jedi Academy set or know why he's even included within it?
    Like why is he even in a set called "Jedi Academy" specifically? More fuel for speculation I guess.
    Don't get mad Plagueis-Haters, I'm not saying I think it will absolutely happen.
    But it IS fun to wonder about.

    I imagine if he appears in the ST he'd probably be done sorta like Davy Jones in POTC.
    And if any of the various rumors swirling around this film all bear out, I really think
    John Noble's booming voice would be a perfect fit for this character IMO. ;)

    One last thing: the PT had Battle Droids/Clones, the OT had Stormtroopers...
    what could the ST possibly have to fill that void?
    It just wouldn't be STAR WARS without some kind of enemy troops, ya know?
    If Plagueis has all these certain skills we've heard about,
    could he maybe raise some kind of army of dead?
    I haven't read the book, so please feel free to correct me if I'm way off base with this one.
    Zombie Troopers too weird for STAR WARS?
     
  23. Darth Claire

    Darth Claire Force Ghost star 5

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    Dec 21, 2012
    One thing to consider: Most audiences have no idea what Plagueis looks like so in a way they *lucasfilm* can make him look like whatever they want. Its not like superheroes where everybody knows what they look like. They can do what Marvel does with their "cinematic versions" *translation: Have the EU version of what he looks like then a cinematic version*. It could avoid having to use a CGI villain * I'm not a fan of CGI villains TBH. After Green lantern and The Hobbit, I'd much rather have a living-breathing actor in prosthetics or makeup with CGI enhancing it than just 100% pure CGI*
     
  24. Placeholder

    Placeholder Jedi Master star 4

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    Jan 30, 2013
    I'm not really on board for a CGI villain either. I don't like the idea of Plaguies at all, but if they did go that route I would prefer that they change his race to either human, or something close to human that they can do with minimal makeup, and cast a great actor to play said villain. Plaguies or no Plaguies that would be my preference.

    Given what I know of JJ Abrams, I also think he wouldn't go for a CGI villain. I think he would want a flesh and blood actor.
     
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  25. Darth kRud

    Darth kRud Jedi Knight star 3

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    Nov 1, 2012
    Not really. Make up special effects and prosthetics have come a long way. Lucas was just lazy to CG everything in the prequels.
     
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