ST Who's The Baddie?

Qui-Gon can't manifest his body, only his voice. He failed to pass one of the Priestesses' tests. Watch S6 of TCW.

Maybe they'll let him retest? I don't know.

 

“Luminous beings are we…not this crude matter.” The Empire Strikes Back

Dave Filoni, supervising director of Star Wars: The Clone Wars and executive producer of Star Wars Rebels, spoke to StarWars.com about the Sith. He said, “There’s such a big fear of death because they try to hold onto life. And I think that’s why they’re willing to basically mutilate themselves and live these cybernetic half-human lives.” Yoda’s lesson with this quote reflects the exact opposite of this mentality, and it’s essential to the saga. It speaks to the underlying difference between Jedi and Sith: being completely selfless, and recognizing that the Force binds all life and creation together.

 

I was under the impression that he hadn't gotten a chance to take that test yet when Maul killed him.

Nope. It's manipulating the midichlorians that's evil.

 

He only encounters the Priestesses after death. I'd like to know which test he failed. Perhaps encountering his darkside like Yoda?

 

Once again Thank you COJ.

 

Those are, again, two DIFFERENT abilities. I hope Plagueis isn't in the ST, but would rather see that than some of the relative theories I've been reading...

 

diabolical ones. the main villainess from Body Heat would eat Sideous for breakfast lol

in Bodyguard was more a generic/blockbuster villain thought.

 

Because he didn't write the script for Star Trek.

 

I'd be willing to bet he failed the test on Moraband. I don't think he could come to terms with the fact that Anakin would all but destroy the Jedi before destroying the Sith.

It's the Yoda quote from TESB, Always in motion is the future. What Qui-Gon saw and what actually happened were two totally different things. This is why I think that if the rumors are true that Luke has gone into some kind of self-imposed exile, it's going to come back and bite him on the ass. What actually comes to pass is going to be far more painful then what he thought might happen.

 

On the other hand, JJ's are not. Both Nero and Khan could kick ass, and he even had Philip Seymour Hoffman get into a brawl with Tom Cruise.

 

I am really excited to see who is going to be the biggest baddie in the ST, and how it'll play out...

 

It's been a while since I watched the lost missions. Is the inference that Qui-Gon only learnt how to retain his identity after he was killed? I would have thought that, like Obi-Wan and Yoda, it's something he would have had do prior to death?

 

Anakin also learned it after death with the help of Yoda/Obi-Wan as you can see in ROTJ.

 

I swear Filoni said in a Q&A that Anakin learned it (or fragments of it) before his death and turn to the dark side. I'll have to go and rewatch it, but I'm pretty sure that's what he said.

 

So basically someone else has to try and pave over the holes in Lucas's writing yet again.

 

This isn't to do with Lucas' writing per se... but how it was explained in TCWC.

 

Maybe he just gets a Chosen One free pass

 

My understanding based on what we see in the movies, which I don't think was overwritten by what we see in TCW, was as follows:

Qui-Gon discovered the secret of "retaining your identity upon becoming one with the Force" after he died. The fact that it was after he died meant that it was too late for him to ever have an actual Force ghost, but he was able to achieve having a voice through the Force that others could hear. He then used that to commune with Yoda, and later Obi-Wan, and he taught them the secrets that he had learned. Because they hadn't died yet, they were able to use that knowledge to obtain a true Force ghost immediately upon dying and becoming one with the Force. Anakin, on the other hand, had already turned to the dark side by the time they learned that ability, so he was never privy to this knowledge. Thus, he was completely surprised when Obi-Wan's body disappeared after he struck him down in their duel on the Death Star; he had never seen anyone (including other Jedi who died) do this. But he himself was able to do it later because he was the Chosen One and because Obi-Wan and Yoda were there to "assist" him when he died.

 

How do you know?

The problem with this notion is that it creates a massive plot hole. What is so special about Qui-Gon that he discovers this after death while all the other dead Jedi do not? Or to put it another way, how does one retain their identity after already having lost it?

I think in Anakin's case he was kind of in a gray area where he had just physically died ( or was about to die ) but Yoda & Ben had a limited window of time ( to use the words of Ryder Windham, "before consciousness fades" ) during which they were able to help him.

 

I see what you're saying, but I'm not sure what other explanations the movies or TCW offer for this part.

 

Isn't it obvious? Qui Gon is the Chosen One.

 

It doesn't create a plot hole. The Priestesses seek Qui-Gon out upon his death, from what I recall from TCW. He's more in touch with the Living Force is the suggestion.

I recall Qui-Gon saying he didn't pass his trials.

However, all this is from my busy memory, so I'll try to rewatch soon to be sure.

Either way, one of the main points is that Qui-Gon isn't fully embodied. Before or after death, whatever. That makes it unlikely he's returning embodied in the ST. But not impossible.

 

I never really saw any of TCW episodes with Qui-Gon in it so this opinion is based strictly on what I gleaned from the movies. The way I always looked at it was, based on some of the lines and conversations that Qui-Gon had with Obi-Wan in TPM, Qui-Gon seemed to be at odds with Yoda and the Council on a lot of matters. It made me think that when he contacts Yoda from beyond in RotS that maybe Qui-Gon had a more "proper" or "old-school" connection to the Force than most of the other Jedi at that point in the Jedi's history. One of the big over-arching themes in the prequels was that the Jedi had become rigid and lost their way, so to speak, being somewhat blind to the fact that the dark-side was ascending etc. It seemed to me that Qui-Gon maybe wasn't as rigid or as lost as the rest, hence his disagreements and ultimately, his ability to retain his consciousness. Did any of that make sense?

 

I don't recall that from TCW, but I haven't watched Season 6 since it came out. Maybe Qui-Gon went to the midichlorian planet at some point?

That was certainly an assumption made by post-TPM EU, by perhaps blowing Qui-Gon's dialogue in the film a little out of proportion (IMO). But I thought that TCW, by contrast, emphasized that a connection with the Cosmic Force was important to ghosting. This was presumably why the Father of the Mortis arc ( who symbolized the Cosmic Force ) disappeared upon death.