Why are the mods black with a line through?

Discussion in 'Communications' started by Stackpole_The_Hobbit, Feb 26, 2004.

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Moderators: JoinTheSchwarz, LAJ_FETT, Ramza
  1. jedi_master_ousley Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 14, 2002
    star 8
    If this is as serious as the mods seem to imply, then we'll probably end up finding out withing the next couple days anyway (in relation to what Raven posted).

    As of right now, I don't see how it matters much to the rest of us. :confused:
  2. DarthBreezy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 6
    What, you think a Comms thread started by a non-mod, and some synchronised colours is the extent of the effort we're making to resolve the situation? Please.

    Please don't bite my head off for making a suggestion.

    Simply put, you have chosen to make a public protest by showing unity in your title, therefore atracting interest in your cause. You have our attention, now do you care to enlighten us and perhaps garner some support?
  3. dehrian Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 1999
    star 6
    I believe the intent is to show support for one another, not to invite questions.
  4. Darth_AYBABTU Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2001
    star 6

    "jp's right in a sense. This really has nothing to do with any of us that don't have colors. Well, not directly at least."

    Well, if the only people who posted in Comms were the ones that were directly affected by whatever the commstroversy du jour is, then the Afghanistan Fan Force forum would have more traffic than Comms.

    "The question to you is this: WHY support this course of action?"

    I think it's a silly request. And it is made sillier by the clear alternatives by which the end may be achieved.

    But I asupport the owners' right to do what they want. I have seen a ton of carrying on about it by mods and non-mods, and they all strike me as people who are missing the point. The premise that they are being "wronged" is flawed. One may not be wronged because he or she is kicked out for not performing a requested duty. That isn't wrong. It is, in fact, an appropriate response to insubordination. Is the request, in and of itself, even wrong? I don't believe so. I believe that the preferred means through which the mods are instructed to do it is absurd, but even that doesn't make it "wrong." It is right based simply on the fact that it is the owners' wish. If that is a requirement for being a mod, then it is proper for mods to do it.

    AYBABTU?

  5. BobTheGoon Moderator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2000
    star 6
    I believe the intent is to show support for one another, not to invite questions.

    No offense intended, but you have Mod Squad for that. You must've known questions would be raised if mods suddenly started showing up in "black armbands". I'm not saying it was the wrong thing to do, I'm just saying you can't be upset or surprised that people took notice and investigated.

    Is the request, in and of itself, even wrong? I don't believe so. I believe that the preferred means through which the mods are instructed to do it is absurd, but even that doesn't make it "wrong." It is right based simply on the fact that it is the owners' wish. If that is a requirement for being a mod, then it is proper for mods to do it.

    No one is questioning the right of the owners to make the request. Of course they have that right. People are protesting the absurdity of the request and the way in which it was presented.

    You are essentially taking a defeatist and cynical view. You admit that the demand is absurd, yet you deny the mods' right to protest against it. What if, by their show of solidarity, they can change the owner's views? Or what if a show of support in the community achieves the same thing? Is it not worth it, then, as YodaJeff said much better than I have?
  6. DarthBreezy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 6
    Thank you BobTheGoon, you're exactly right. :)
  7. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    Let me just say this. What is occuring in private will have an affect in some way on all users across the forums. When I logged back in this evening, I didn't expect the color changes, though it warms the heart to see it. It's therefore an obvious question as to what's going on. We owe it to tell you, but out of respect for all parties involved, we can't provide the complete story at this time. The story is awaiting its final chapter.

    In times past when mods do a sweeping color change like this, we get teased for being a melodramatic group for a silly Star Wars messageboard. Without going into too much detail at this time, every single mod is showing incredible restraint and maturity by keeping up their chin and showing grace in the face of feeling basically worthless. What is going on now is, without doubt, the single most important time in the life of the boards and whether the boards will continue to be given life remains in doubt.
  8. jadesaber2 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 17, 2000
    star 5
    Geez, that post is almost worse than just saying "we're not telling!" :p
  9. jedi_master_ousley Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 14, 2002
    star 8
    No offense intended, but you have Mod Squad for that. You must've known questions would be raised if mods suddenly started showing up in "black armbands". I'm not saying it was the wrong thing to do, I'm just saying you can't be upset or surprised that people took notice and investigated.

    That doesn't mean they have to tell you.
  10. Qui Gon Jim23 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 11, 2002
    star 5
    I'd tell you, but then I'd have to bait you.
  11. BobTheGoon Moderator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2000
    star 6
    I never said they had to tell me. I already know. Soon everyone else will, too, if this all goes down the way it looks it will...
  12. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    Sometimes I think it's better to say how it's going to be rather than give oyu a bunch of nothing posts.

    We are not going to tell you what is going on at this time. Please respect that. Just know that I'm hoping that within a day or so we'll know better what's going on.
  13. DarthBreezy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 6
    the single most important time in the life of the boards and whether the boards will continue to be given life remains in doubt.

    Now you have me concerned here Sapes. For all the jokes about JC'ers having 'no life' outside the boards, this community means a lot to me... I have met some of my nearest and dearest freinds here (first online, then in person...). I enjoy the levels of discussion (from the inane to the really intersting) and the vast diversity of the fandom and community. For all of it's warts, there is no other place like the JC and to see it gone would saddnen me greatly, especially without any real warning.
  14. dehrian Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 1999
    star 6
    Who said I was upset, Bob? He asked a question, I supplied an answer. I'm sure the mods who have chosen to do this realized such would be a result, but it was not an intention.
  15. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    I'm sorry that I'm rather slow to reply to some things here, but that's because I've typed up an explanation of what's happening, one that I've tried to keep mostly neutral. Given that this could lead to a lot of moderator demotions, and hence a bit of forum chaos, I think that everyone should be aware of what?s going on.



    We don't have a rogue admin, do we?

    I have roguish charms and roguish good looks and I like playing a Rogue when I play Dungeons and Dragons ? do I count? :D ;)



    In all honesty, I think it would help your cause if you took your 'protest' to the people it effects, (I assume that this disagreement with the PTB in in regards to something that affects the entire site?)

    In this case, the people that it affects are we moderators ourselves, not the site directly. This doesn?t directly affect anyone without colors in their names at all. It?ll probably expand to cover City Reps in short order, but we?ll see. The only way that this is going to affect the rest of the site directly in the short term is that unless one side or the other backs down, in a day or two we?re going to be short a number of moderators.


    What, you think a Comms thread started by a non-mod, and some synchronised colours is the extent of the effort we're making to resolve the situation? Please.

    No need to be rude, jp. [face_plain] She was offering sympathy?




  16. anakin_girl Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 8, 2000
    star 6
    As usual I agree with Breezy. I've made jokes about this place being my "crack" but in reality it is a whole lot more than that. It is one of the most diverse Star Wars message boards out there and I would hate to see it gone. :(

    *now wishing she could change her colors to black with a strike-through, even without knowing the story*
  17. BobTheGoon Moderator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2000
    star 6
    Who said I was upset, Bob? He asked a question, I supplied an answer. I'm sure the mods who have chosen to do this realized such would be a result, but it was not an intention.

    Alright, we're cool :p I think I just read your response I little differently than intended.
  18. DarthSapient Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 26, 2001
    star 10
    Since this is such an emotional issue, let me revise what I said above to say I will not say what's going on and what happens happens.
  19. jp-30 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 14, 2000
    star 9
    > and to see it gone would saddnen me greatly, especially without any real warning.

    Don't worry. The chances of that are ridiculously slim. The boards will continue regardless of the way this situation pans out, have no fear about that. They'll be run slightly differently in all likelihood because there will probably be a lot of different mods on the scene and existing mods in new positions, but even that won't effect the great percentage of users who just come here to post stuff about Star Wars.

  20. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    And with that, to follow Sapes post...




    I?m going to come right out and say what the problem is between the Mod Squad, the Old Folks Home, and an element of site ownership. An element of site ownership has told the entire Mod Squad that we must provide him with our real names and addresses and such by registering at another message board and then passing on our user names there to him through G-S. If we do not, we get demoted. All future moderators will have to provide this information. This may be expanded to cover City Representatives as well.

    The Mod Squad and Old Folks Home have two major issues.
    1) The security of the information and the purpose behind the information gathering. As everyone is probably well aware, the Mod Squad is about as leaky as the Titanic. This has fostered worries about how secure this information would be, even though it?s being stored elsewhere. No system is perfect, and there is the worry that that information might come out and what might be done with that information. And we?ve yet to be told why we need to give it (though the guess that it is something along the lines of ?if LFL sues, it?s on the shoulders of the moderators?).
    2) The way that this has been handled by site ownership. More than anything else, I think that?s what?s at the heart of this. The feeling in the Mod Squad and Old Folks Home is that an element of the site ownership does not care about the message boards and the users and moderators here in any way at all. We as a group have not been provided with reasons why the information is needed; we feel that we?ve been threatened; we feel that we?ve been insulted; and finally we feel that we?ve been ignored.

    As for myself, I freely admit that I?ve provided the information, and did almost as soon as I got the e-mail. I am personally not overly concerned about what might be done to me with it. I can see why others would be, from the viewpoints of personal safety and also from a legal viewpoint.
  21. jp-30 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 14, 2000
    star 9
    > Please don't bite my head off for making a suggestion.

    Sorry Breezy. It appears I have misunderstood what you were trying to say.

    My reply wasn't intended to be rude or 'biting your head off' either, for what it's worth. Apologies all round.
  22. DarthBreezy Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 6
    Yes Raven, I honestly am concerned as this is evidently more serious than the usual dissention between TPTB and the membership if there is the possibilty of the boards being 'dissolved' as was implied by Sapes, or the JC loosing some of it's better 'admins' of any stripe... that would be a terrible loss.

    It was once said that if the community wanted to allow a major change in policy, they would have to garner support from a good percentage of the population. I think the same could potentially be applied here... I don't know the details but the more I see, the more concerend I become....

    Edit

    Apology accepted jp-30, and I'm sorry if I was misconstrued...

    Having now been enlightened, I understand the reason for the protest and fully support it. If TPTB want my personal info, I would be willing to supply it privately through some securish method, but I am loathed to give out such information to a place that can and has been accessed by the 'public'. If it means going from being DarthBreezy, Everett City rep, to DarthBreezy, regular user, then so be it...
  23. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    Things like this warm my bitter exmod heart, knowing the mods actually care about something.

    On the other hand I'm cynical enough to say they're almost certainly wrong. :p


    Although gee it's the mods vs the owners, who am I least bitter towards...?
  24. Jedi Greg Maddux Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 1999
    star 6
    Gee, I always thought the beauty of the internet was the ability to remain anonymous. I know this doesn't apply to me, but I've personally had no problem with giving away 'personal information' - I'm sure those who have been around the forums long enough know me as Jason, I've freely given out my phone number, and given out my mailing address. I don't have a problem, and I probably never will. But that's just me, and I respect those who choose not to release such information.
  25. Smuggler-of-Mos-Espa Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jan 23, 2002
    star 6
    I think everything has been covered here. From what i can assume from what has been said, something is going on in the Mod Squad forums that is being debated. One group believes in one thing and the other in something else. If it effects us, i think we're finding out enough gradually to figure out what this is. That is enough for me and it should be enough for every other member here.

    To me, this is a sign of something big. I'm fine with that. Just don't jump all over the mods here, from what i can tell, they've done nothing wrong, they're just expressing their views. Give them a break.
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