Why did Obi-wan die?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by WhiskeyGold, Nov 18, 2012.

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  1. WhiskeyGold Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 13, 2001
    star 4
    I have read online that Alec wanted his part as Obi-wan cut down and demanded to be killed off. However on the commentary for ANH Lucas says Obi-wan wasnt to die but then came up with the idea cause Obi-wan had nothing to do after the Death Star escape. He said Alec was upset and worried this meant he couldn't return for any sequels.

    Whats the truth?
  2. CaptainHamYoyo Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 18, 2011
    star 2
    As far as I understood it, it was like you said, at the climax he had nothing to do, but I also heard because there had to be a consequence for our heroes sneaking around the Death Star and escaping. If everyone escaped the DS alive, the DS loses any credibility as being dangerous...or something to that effect.
  3. Darth_Nub Saga, Classic Trilogy and Film Music Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Apr 26, 2009
    star 4
    That's pretty much it. As to whether or not Alec Guinness was upset at the sudden change (it happened mid-shoot) or not, I'm not sure - I do recall reading something to that effect, but not in any official sources. Sounds like one of those things that could have been made up or exaggerated. Alec Guinness was a consummate professional who'd been acting for decades, I can't see him throwing a hissy fit over something like that, particularly not in a film which was basically just light entertainment at the time.

    It was GL's idea to kill off Obi-Wan, though, not Guinness'.
    Last edited by Darth_Nub, Nov 18, 2012
  4. TOSCHESTATION Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2003
    star 4
    What Darth_Nub said.

    The problem I've had with the "DS has consequences!!" argument is that the DS is 'dangerous' to undefended planets . Obi-Wan was killed by Vader, NOT by "the Death Star". Vader would have been dangerous in any situation, space-station or no space-station*. Note: I am NOT saying that this wasn't the thought process that convinced Lucas to kill-off Ben. What I am saying is that - while the argument may very well 'work', superficially speaking - it doesn't quite hold up to scrutiny, in my opinion. I can still understand Lucas' 'dilemma' to a point, when he decided to put the majority of the Empire-related scenes aboard the space-station, rather than in two or three different locales, like in earlier drafts.

    *think of the original scenario where the rescue would have taken place on a "floating, Imperial Cloud-City."
    Last edited by TOSCHESTATION, Nov 18, 2012
  5. JoeyArnold Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2012
    star 3
    Did Kenobi disappear before Vader sliced him in half with Vader's lightsaber?
  6. BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2012
    star 5
    I think it does have consequences, if not making that the Death Star is dangerous, but it makes Vader / The empire more dangerous for Our Heroes. Basically, Ben Kenobi has been leading the whole crusade up to that point, at least he's pointing them in the right direction, and he's offering helpful advice to Luke and Co. along the way and then, bigity bam!, he gets chopped in half and things look bleak for our intrepid heroes right before the third act. Throw in Obi-Wan ghost to add the mystical aspect to the climax of the movie and the fact that even Lucas has said that in earlier drafts Obi-Wan was just hanging around once they got to Yavin, it's actually the best choice for the narrative that Obi-Wan buys it at that point.
  7. Trebor Sabreon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 15, 2010
    star 4
    Yes, that is my understanding.

    edit: I'm trying to recall the source. I went back and looked at the novelization, thinking that may have been it, but alas, no. Anyway, I'm 99% certain that there is an official source out there somewhere which can back me up on this.
    Last edited by TreborSabreon, Nov 21, 2012
  8. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    @Darth_Nub posted it before, but basically Obi-Wan ran the battle of yavin orginally.

    It's almost a shame Obi-Wan died; presumably he would have been commanding the Battle Of Endor a few years later. Which would have been completely epic. :D
    TreborSabreon likes this.
  9. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    Ah, this oldie remembers when it was said that due to the limitations of filming then, it only appeared that Obi-Wan disappeared before his bisection, but he was supposedly bisected before disappearing.
  10. JoeyArnold Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2012
    star 3
    Obi Won Kenobi was only 51 years old when he died?
  11. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    Don't know about Obi Won but Obi-Wan was 57, I believe - he was born 57 BBY.
  12. Darth_Kiryan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 13, 2009
    star 4
    57 dude.
  13. Trebor Sabreon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 15, 2010
    star 4
    Absolutely correct. Though there has been speculation that as the seasons of TCW coninue to pile up, perhaps there is the chance we will see the official timeline for The Clone War extended out past the three-year point. This would, of course, require a dating retcon, resulting in an earlier birthdate and making Obi-Wan older than 38 in ROTS or 57 at the time of his transformation into the Force.
  14. Trebor Sabreon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 15, 2010
    star 4
    That's a cool thought, to be sure, but there's no denying the impact of hearing Ben's voice calling out "Run Luke, run!" and realizing that the 'old fossil' had powers we could not have possibly imagined and had survived even the grave.
    Valairy Scot likes this.
  15. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
  16. oierem Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2009
    star 3
    According to canon. For those who don't care about that (like myself), he looks a bit older than that... Mid sixties, I'd say.
  17. ireactions Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2012
    My question regarding this is -- why did Obi-Wan allow himself to be cut down? Because while he says he'll become "more powerful than you can possibly imagine," that power doesn't seem to have much practical purpose. He couldn't have had more conversations with Luke while he was alive?
  18. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    Because "the script" (and GL) had it that way.
  19. tsunami1138 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 15, 2012
    star 1
    Because, had Ben continued the battle, Luke would have gone to save him, and would have been gunned down by a couple dozen stormtroopers. If Ben had tried to run to the Falcon, Vader would have cut him down from behind. And Ben knew that he could serve Luke better as an ethereal presence, rather than Luke jeopardising his own safety by trying to save Ben however-many-times they might have got into difficulty in the future.
    Last edited by tsunami1138, Nov 22, 2012
  20. ireactions Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 22, 2012
    Sounds good to me, mate! Thanks! :D
    tsunami1138 likes this.
  21. JoeyArnold Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 2012
    star 3
    Ben died because "I'm getting too old for this?" Ben thought he would become a liability? I guess so. And Ben was able to talk to Luke as Luke goes to blow up the Death Star. Unless if you could fit Ben into that one-pilot ships or stick Ben in where R2 sat.... wait, Ben could of had a walky talky and could of had a private conversation with Luke that way. Ben could have tried harder to kill Vader first, too.

    The Clone Wars are on their fifth season, but that doesn't have to make Ben older. because the SImpsons are on their 20th or so season and Bart is still in third age.... they are both cartoons.... so they are ageless, timeless, priceless....

    So Ben was 57 when he went into the force? Ok. I only guessed 51 because I thought Ben would have been 19 years old in the Phantom Menace. 29 in the second one. 31 in the third. And then the fourth one, 50..... so Ben was 26 in the Phantom Menace?
  22. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Should have been at least a little blood.

    It is also possible that Obi-Wan's alleged TPM age, which is not discussed in the films, could be revised.
    Last edited by Arawn_Fenn, Nov 22, 2012
  23. TOSCHESTATION Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 17, 2003
    star 4
    Question: Will they 'revise' his age to be that of 62 in SW - as in Alec Guiness' age during shooting circa '76 - or 70 years old (as per Lucas during the making of the OT)???

    - TOSCHESTATION aka "COL. BASHER"
    Last edited by TOSCHESTATION, Nov 22, 2012
  24. mattman8907 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2012
    star 3
    where did they get the "Three year war" thing anyway?
  25. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
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