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Why did Obi-wan die?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by WhiskeyGold, Nov 18, 2012.

  1. WhiskeyGold

    WhiskeyGold Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 13, 2001
    I have read online that Alec wanted his part as Obi-wan cut down and demanded to be killed off. However on the commentary for ANH Lucas says Obi-wan wasnt to die but then came up with the idea cause Obi-wan had nothing to do after the Death Star escape. He said Alec was upset and worried this meant he couldn't return for any sequels.

    Whats the truth?
     
  2. CaptainHamYoyo

    CaptainHamYoyo Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Aug 18, 2011
    As far as I understood it, it was like you said, at the climax he had nothing to do, but I also heard because there had to be a consequence for our heroes sneaking around the Death Star and escaping. If everyone escaped the DS alive, the DS loses any credibility as being dangerous...or something to that effect.
     
  3. Darth_Nub

    Darth_Nub Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Apr 26, 2009
    That's pretty much it. As to whether or not Alec Guinness was upset at the sudden change (it happened mid-shoot) or not, I'm not sure - I do recall reading something to that effect, but not in any official sources. Sounds like one of those things that could have been made up or exaggerated. Alec Guinness was a consummate professional who'd been acting for decades, I can't see him throwing a hissy fit over something like that, particularly not in a film which was basically just light entertainment at the time.

    It was GL's idea to kill off Obi-Wan, though, not Guinness'.
     
  4. TOSCHESTATION

    TOSCHESTATION Jedi Master star 4

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    Jan 17, 2003
    What Darth_Nub said.

    The problem I've had with the "DS has consequences!!" argument is that the DS is 'dangerous' to undefended planets . Obi-Wan was killed by Vader, NOT by "the Death Star". Vader would have been dangerous in any situation, space-station or no space-station*. Note: I am NOT saying that this wasn't the thought process that convinced Lucas to kill-off Ben. What I am saying is that - while the argument may very well 'work', superficially speaking - it doesn't quite hold up to scrutiny, in my opinion. I can still understand Lucas' 'dilemma' to a point, when he decided to put the majority of the Empire-related scenes aboard the space-station, rather than in two or three different locales, like in earlier drafts.

    *think of the original scenario where the rescue would have taken place on a "floating, Imperial Cloud-City."
     
  5. JoeyArnold

    JoeyArnold Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    Did Kenobi disappear before Vader sliced him in half with Vader's lightsaber?
     
  6. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 12, 2012
    I think it does have consequences, if not making that the Death Star is dangerous, but it makes Vader / The empire more dangerous for Our Heroes. Basically, Ben Kenobi has been leading the whole crusade up to that point, at least he's pointing them in the right direction, and he's offering helpful advice to Luke and Co. along the way and then, bigity bam!, he gets chopped in half and things look bleak for our intrepid heroes right before the third act. Throw in Obi-Wan ghost to add the mystical aspect to the climax of the movie and the fact that even Lucas has said that in earlier drafts Obi-Wan was just hanging around once they got to Yavin, it's actually the best choice for the narrative that Obi-Wan buys it at that point.
     
  7. Trebor Sabreon

    Trebor Sabreon LACWAC-y Mod of SWTV & New Films Force projection star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 15, 2010
    Yes, that is my understanding.

    edit: I'm trying to recall the source. I went back and looked at the novelization, thinking that may have been it, but alas, no. Anyway, I'm 99% certain that there is an official source out there somewhere which can back me up on this.
     
  8. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 29, 2000
    Darth_Nub posted it before, but basically Obi-Wan ran the battle of yavin orginally.

    It's almost a shame Obi-Wan died; presumably he would have been commanding the Battle Of Endor a few years later. Which would have been completely epic. :D
     
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  9. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

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    Sep 16, 2005
    Ah, this oldie remembers when it was said that due to the limitations of filming then, it only appeared that Obi-Wan disappeared before his bisection, but he was supposedly bisected before disappearing.
     
  10. JoeyArnold

    JoeyArnold Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    Obi Won Kenobi was only 51 years old when he died?
     
  11. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

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    Sep 16, 2005
    Don't know about Obi Won but Obi-Wan was 57, I believe - he was born 57 BBY.
     
  12. Darth_Kiryan

    Darth_Kiryan Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 13, 2009
    57 dude.
     
  13. Trebor Sabreon

    Trebor Sabreon LACWAC-y Mod of SWTV & New Films Force projection star 4 Staff Member Manager

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    Sep 15, 2010
    Absolutely correct. Though there has been speculation that as the seasons of TCW coninue to pile up, perhaps there is the chance we will see the official timeline for The Clone War extended out past the three-year point. This would, of course, require a dating retcon, resulting in an earlier birthdate and making Obi-Wan older than 38 in ROTS or 57 at the time of his transformation into the Force.
     
  14. Trebor Sabreon

    Trebor Sabreon LACWAC-y Mod of SWTV & New Films Force projection star 4 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Sep 15, 2010
    That's a cool thought, to be sure, but there's no denying the impact of hearing Ben's voice calling out "Run Luke, run!" and realizing that the 'old fossil' had powers we could not have possibly imagined and had survived even the grave.
     
    Valairy Scot likes this.
  15. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 29, 2000
  16. oierem

    oierem Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 18, 2009
    According to canon. For those who don't care about that (like myself), he looks a bit older than that... Mid sixties, I'd say.
     
  17. ireactions

    ireactions Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Nov 22, 2012
    My question regarding this is -- why did Obi-Wan allow himself to be cut down? Because while he says he'll become "more powerful than you can possibly imagine," that power doesn't seem to have much practical purpose. He couldn't have had more conversations with Luke while he was alive?
     
  18. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

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    Sep 16, 2005
    Because "the script" (and GL) had it that way.
     
  19. tsunami1138

    tsunami1138 Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Nov 15, 2012
    Because, had Ben continued the battle, Luke would have gone to save him, and would have been gunned down by a couple dozen stormtroopers. If Ben had tried to run to the Falcon, Vader would have cut him down from behind. And Ben knew that he could serve Luke better as an ethereal presence, rather than Luke jeopardising his own safety by trying to save Ben however-many-times they might have got into difficulty in the future.
     
  20. ireactions

    ireactions Jedi Youngling

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    Nov 22, 2012
    Sounds good to me, mate! Thanks! :D
     
    tsunami1138 likes this.
  21. JoeyArnold

    JoeyArnold Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Nov 7, 2012
    Ben died because "I'm getting too old for this?" Ben thought he would become a liability? I guess so. And Ben was able to talk to Luke as Luke goes to blow up the Death Star. Unless if you could fit Ben into that one-pilot ships or stick Ben in where R2 sat.... wait, Ben could of had a walky talky and could of had a private conversation with Luke that way. Ben could have tried harder to kill Vader first, too.

    The Clone Wars are on their fifth season, but that doesn't have to make Ben older. because the SImpsons are on their 20th or so season and Bart is still in third age.... they are both cartoons.... so they are ageless, timeless, priceless....

    So Ben was 57 when he went into the force? Ok. I only guessed 51 because I thought Ben would have been 19 years old in the Phantom Menace. 29 in the second one. 31 in the third. And then the fourth one, 50..... so Ben was 26 in the Phantom Menace?
     
  22. Arawn_Fenn

    Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost star 7

    Registered:
    Jul 2, 2004
    Should have been at least a little blood.

    It is also possible that Obi-Wan's alleged TPM age, which is not discussed in the films, could be revised.
     
  23. TOSCHESTATION

    TOSCHESTATION Jedi Master star 4

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    Jan 17, 2003
    Question: Will they 'revise' his age to be that of 62 in SW - as in Alec Guiness' age during shooting circa '76 - or 70 years old (as per Lucas during the making of the OT)???

    - TOSCHESTATION aka "COL. BASHER"
     
  24. mattman8907

    mattman8907 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 17, 2012
    where did they get the "Three year war" thing anyway?
     
  25. Arawn_Fenn

    Arawn_Fenn Force Ghost star 7

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    Jul 2, 2004