PT Why did Sidious want the treaty signed in TPM?

It's been a while since I've watched the Phantom Menace, but the whole plot point of Palpatine wanting Amidala to sign the treaty with the Trade Federation? I forgot exactly how that accelerates his scheme.

 

It would legally hand over Naboo to the Trade Federation, which is their motivation to helping Sidious in the first place.

Edit: Once Palpatine gets the Queen to call for a vote of no confidence, and Palpatine is elected chancellor, he has no need for the TF to own Naboo, so it no longer matters to him that the treaty wasn't signed.

 

I think it could also weaken faith in the republic if Naboo was forced to sign such a treaty.

 

Like all good politicians, Palpatine covers all the options to secure the Chancellorship.

He initially assumes Amidala to be naive and easily manipulated, getting the treaty signed, therefore, seems like the best option. Sign the treaty, throw the Naboo into chaos, and get the sympathy vote in the senate as a result. Mission Accomplished.

However, he soon realizes that Amidala is more cunning, especially with the support of the Jedi. When she arrives at Coruscant in person, he merely adapts, and uses her to secure the sympathy vote. As has been said, the treaty then becomes irrelevant. Even if it is later signed, the vote of no-confidence in Valorum has already passed. He maintains the pretense of the treaty only to placate the Trade Federation, who want control of Naboo to be legalised by it.

 

I don't see how a naive teenage head of state signing a treaty would have undermined faith in the Republic or the Chancellor at the time.

 

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/why-did-sidious-want-amidala-to-sign-the-treaty.31656692/

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/why-does-sidious-want-queen-padme-to-sign-treaty.16738332/

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/the-treaty-in-tpm.21783468/

http://boards.theforce.net/threads/signing-the-treaty.50045840/

And there are plenty more. It does seem to be a big question mark.

 

The surface-level purpose of the treaty is totally obvious: It legalizes the invasion and shields the Trade Federation from consequences. So, on a basic level, the plot of the film holds up perfectly fine. The only mystery is why Sidious, apart from the Federation, wants the treaty signed, but that's tied up with the larger mystery of who Sidious is, and why he's working with the Trade Federation in the first place. This is left up to the audience to figure out.

Astute viewers will recognize that Darth Sidious and Senator Palpatine are one and the same, and the entire blockade crisis was engineered specifically to propel him into the chancellorship. They will recognize that, by the time Amidala has arrived on Coruscant, Sidious/Palpatine has tried and failed to get Amidala to "sign the treaty." They will then witness Palpatine maneuvering Amidala into place in order to call for a vote of no confidence in Chancellor Valorum. So, obviously, Palpatine must have used Amidala to accomplish the task for which he had previously planned to use the "treaty." The reason I'm using quotation marks when referring to the treaty and its signing is because there's an added wrinkle, which can be gleaned from some quite prominent dialogue early in the film:

QUI-GON : They will kill you if you stay.
BIBBLE : They wouldn't dare.
CAPT. PANAKA : They need her to sign a treaty to make this invasion of
theirs legal. They can't afford to kill her.
QUI-GON : The situation here is not what it seems. There is something else
behind all this, Your Highness. There is no logic in the Federation's move
here. My feelings tell me they will destroy you.

Clearly, the ultimate plan, regardless of whether or not she signs the treaty, is to kill the Queen. This is not remotely in the Federation's interests, as it willy only inflame the opinion of the Senate against them, and inspire strong sympathy for the plight of the Naboo. But Sidious's plan was to make it happen, and then pin it on Gunray and his cronies. So we can see that Sidious's seemingly ardent desire for the Queen to be recaptured and brought back to Naboo to "sign the treaty" is a deception played on the Neimoidians. The Neimoidians think Sidious wants Amidala captured because he's on their side and wants her to sign a treaty to indemnify them against prosecution. In reality, he merely wants to betray his so-called allies by staging the murder of the Queen and blaming it on them. It's a deliciously devious plot.

Sure, it's never stated explicitly in the film, but it's not exactly rocket science. After all, I understood it.

 

As I outlined in one of the threads linked up there, signing the treaty would make the republic legally powerless to do anything to stop it. Had the republic discovered the invasion without a treaty signed they would have ample evidence to eliminate their trade franchise and they would be finished.

Signing the treaty makes the invasion finale and complete with the senate literally unable to do anything making Valorum look weak. Palpatine was gonna use this climate to oust Valorum and get himself nominated and elected Chancellor. Of course Padme escapes Naboo so he has to tweak his plans a bit.

 

Thanks everyone, I guess that makes sense. But a better question might be... What the hell was in it for the Trade Federation? They were already breaking the law big time by collaborating with Sith. Rune or Nute (I forget who exactly.) Even says later on upon seeing Maul for the first time. "Now there are two of them? This is getting out of hand!" Or something along those lines.

 

They get a very rich planet out of the deal (see their shiny silver spaceships and extravagant fashion for a clear indication of Naboo's wealth). They also show their protests against the new taxes in the senate, essentially showing that they have the power to ignore them and get away with it scot free.

That is, if they's got the treaty signed.

 

When is it ever suggested, except by Qui Gon, that the TF are intent on killing the Queen?

 

I think Palpatine would eventually have had the TF kill her (after signing the treaty) to make their actions even more horrifying to the senate and making himself more sympathetic. Two characters Palpatine repeatedly tries to have killed in the prequels are Padme and Obi Wan. He desperately wants them gone.

 

Yes. Essentially, it's a conflict about trade routes. On the simplest level, controlling an important node along the outlying trade routes in question gives the Federation a lot of leverage when it comes to influencing trade policy.

 

So Sidious's grand plan was for the Federation to gain leverage in negotiations on trade route taxation?

 

No, that was the TF's motivation for joining with Sidious, who's real plan to artificially create a conflict with Naboo to get him sympathy in the Senate, showing the flaws in Valorum's rule, and getting himself elected chancellor.

 

The flaw wasn't in Valorum. The senate was in uproar and divided about Padme's allegations and wouldn't give Valorum support to take action. so Padme motions to vote Valorum out which the senate does support.

Then we later see Palpatine as chancellor surrounded by the same aides that he said compromised Valorum in the first place.

 

The flaw wasn't in Valorum but in the bureaucracy and red tape which surrounded him, which Valorum was unwilling to use (or abuse) his executive authority to circumvent--making him appear weak and ineffectual, when in reality he was a virtuous man in an impossible situation created by a corrupted democracy. Palpatine promises Padme that ousting Valorum will pave the way for a "strong" chancellor with the will to do what must be done to obtain peace and justice, regardless of the thorny rules and regulations of the Senate--a devil's bargain to which Padme, unable to sit idly by while her people suffer and die, reluctantly acquiesces. Ultimately, darkspine10 isn't wrong--it's just a matter of perspective.

It's a great story, and a cautionary tale for our own democracy.

 

I think also the treaty was a way for Sids to keep the TF busy, as he was playing them too.

 

I just figured it was cos he wanted the TF to have more power. They were already frowned upon as an organization, due to their corruption. It may not have been truly necessary, but it would've helped him more as a backup plan to promote chaos and corruption if he did not become chancellor. But it would work even better in his favor WITH him as Chancellor, as it would simply create more turmoil and separation in the senate-which was his ultimate goal, leading to war.

 

I assumed he didn't really care if the treaty was signed or not. He just wanted to create unrest in the republic and use the event as a chance to seize the Chancellorship.

In the end, he got what he wanted out of it.

 

Like I said, there's no evidence he actually cared about the treaty at all. That's just something he told the Federation to get them to go along with his plans. When he tells the Neimoidians "I want that treaty signed!" he doesn't really mean it. He just wants them to get Amidala back so he can have her killed, but he can't tell the Neimoidians that because it's blatantly against their interests and they'd be too cowardly to go along with it.

 

There's no indication that Sidious actually wants Amidala dead.

It makes no sense whatsoever that Palpatine, the senator for Naboo, should be a popular or sympathetic choice for Chancellor when the senate doesn't even have enough sympathy for Naboo to take their plight seriously. Instead, the shout at her. And If Padme had signed the treaty, then Palpatine would not even be in a position to run for Chancellor, having lost his constituency to the TF.

In AOTC the Neimoidians are desperate to have Padme's head because she defied them. So the idea that they would not have killed her if she refused to sign is at odds with their expressed attitude at her non compliance.

If Sidious's aim was for Amidala to be killed, and have the TF blamed for it in the Senate , then his plan to do this was astonishingly convoluted and risk prone.

 

Did you even watch the movie? The sympathy vote for the Naboo in the Senate is so strong that it propels Palpatine into the chancellorship. The reason the sympathetic faction in the Senate couldn't act to directly help the Naboo is because the bureaucracy literally prevented them from being able to do so. Amidala's Vote of No Confidence and call for a new election is the one thing the bureaucracy can't stop.

The second part of your post makes no sense because Sidious never had any intention of the Queen signing the treaty, and even if she had, her immediate murder afterwards likely would have spurred action against the Federation. Sidious never had any intention of doing anything other than betraying the Federation and throwing them to the wolves.

The evidence that Sidious wants Amidala dead is right in the movie. Qui-Gon senses that the Queen will be killed if she stays. Panaka responds that that's impossible because the Federation needs her to sign the treaty. Qui-Gon replies that he senses something else at work here as there's no logic to the Federation's moves so far. This is all obviously referring to Sidious and the fact that the treaty is a red herring.

 

^This. It was actual dialog from the movie. Anyway, the treaty doesn't matter. I contend that even if the treaty were signed, Palpatine still planned to have the TF's trade franchise revoked, as this would lead to the Confederacy of Independent Systems. Although, it's possible that wasn't in his plans that far ahead.

 

Palpatine was smart enough to see multiple strategies miles ahead.

The treaty was just a ploy to make the Trade Federation believe that they could get control over Naboo and their protest of the taxation would be legitimized

If Padme had signed the treaty, Palpatine would go in front of the senate and state that the Trade Federation had oppressed and starved his people and basically blackmailed her to sign an illegitimate treaty that means nothing

If she didn't sign the treaty and was killed by the Trade Federation he would generate huge sympathy in the Senate

If she didn't sign the treaty and beat the Trade Federation he could point out that the Senate sat on their hands and it created a war on a peaceful planet.

The only thing that would have stopped Palpatine temporarily is if the Republic had sent a force that they didn't have to Naboo to drive the Trade Federation off of the planet, but Palpatine had enough influence in the background to make sure that didn't happen.