PT Why did the Jedi Council push Anakin to watch Palpatine?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Slowpokeking, Mar 16, 2013.

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  1. Sistros Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2010
    star 6
    but to some it is a big deal,

    it's an invasion of privacy.

    And as I said, having a high midichlorian count is hardly illegal or proof enough he's up to no good.

    What Anakinfan said.
    Last edited by Sistros, Mar 23, 2013
  2. Lord Chazza Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2013
    star 4
    I never said Palpatine would refuse Midi-Chlorian screening. Your confusing what I'm saying with what someone else is saying.
  3. lbr789 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2013
    star 1
    [face_hypnotized]
    Well, this thread is spinning out of control.
  4. Lord Chazza Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2013
    star 4
    Chewie, take the professor into the back and plug him into the hyperdrive. ;)
  5. Slowpokeking Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 21, 2012
    star 4
    I don't think you really understand well.

    The Jedi aren't going to just take a midichlorian screening, they are clearly going to do something after the result come out. And many senators and military officials don't trust the Jedi would give the true answer. The Senators aren't stupid, the biggest possibility they could think of, is "The Jedi are going to make us potential enemies base on our midi count" or even "They are going to frame us!" So Palpatine and his allies could easily let this become a huge mess.

    It's just like if someone comes in, ask about your personal and family information. It does not mean that's all he is going to do, he clearly will do something base on the info you give him.
    Last edited by Slowpokeking, Mar 23, 2013
  6. lbr789 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2013
    star 1
    Sometimes I just don't understand human behavior! ;)
    Last edited by lbr789, Mar 23, 2013
  7. Jcuk Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2013
    star 4
    Let's just agree to diagree
  8. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    SOME would deny the request for "invasion of privacy" reasons and probably without a "search warrant" the Jedi could not force the issue.

    I also assume some parents did not allow for midi-screening of their newborns - I'm not sure it's been established one way or the other if such is mandatory in Republic worlds.
  9. Darth Venator Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 1, 2013
    star 1
    Some interesting points in this thread for sure.

    The Midichlorians are always going to be a source of argument as long as Star Wars shall exist, but hey - a good debate isn't so bad!

    I'm intrigued by the talk about Midi-testing Palpatine, and I'm sure my post will mirror a lot of what has been said anyway but here's my thoughts...

    Blood testing Palpatine would NEVER have been an option. Defenders of The Republic or not, the Jedi aren't the most favourable of types at times... Imagine the political ramifications of them trying to test Palpatine's blood?

    Palpatine has most of the senate in the palm of his hand, he could turn them against the Jedi in seconds. Something which the Jedi would've likely been aware of - instantly deterring them from making such an obvious accusation.

    Plus - suspicious of Palps or or not, there is still an air of surprise throughout the council when Sidious is revealed... This suggests to me that there simply wasn't enough distrust to warrant a DNA test in the first place.

    But, what if they had tested his blood? Well, this could pan out in several different ways...

    1) Assuming he'd learnt something from Plagueis - he could potentially alter his midichlorian count, or at least give the illusion of a low count to slip by undetected.

    2) They test his blood, the count is huge. Then what? So they're looking for a Sith Lord and Palpy's blood fits the profile... It's still not proof!

    E.g... If you knew a murderer had ginger hair, you couldn't simply accuse the first redhead you come across.

    So they'd still need to catch him in the act/spy on him.

    3) The man is a master of deception and manipulation. He could quite easily feign ignorance to the whole thing, and could likely convince a lot of people of his innocence.



    Next... Why choose Anakin to spy on him? Simple, logical... He was the closest Jedi to Palpatine so he already had a foot in the door.

    Yes, at first look it seems wrong to send Skywalker - but don't forget that Anakin wasn't a master at this point. Sending him to spy on his 'friend' seems like something of a test of his will... Had he succeeded, a seat on the council would've been his. But he failed, and things got very messy indeed.

    I put no blame on the Jedi for this at all though... Every move they made was down to Sidious/Palpatine's manipulation of events. He is after all, a true master of the Dark Side, with insurmountable power and control.Their vision was clouded and they acted in response to all the traps he'd set them... He used Anakin to control their decisions to great effect - and they rose to the bait. They were played perfectly, as was Anakin as were the Senate and generally everyone else that came into contact with him. His long game started the moment he killed Plagueis - everything else was just progress for him, necessary steps towards his goal.

    ...Simply put - the answer to every question regarding the PTs is that 'Palpatine was behind it' :p
  10. ILNP Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 12, 2011
    star 1
    Tatooine is outside of the Republic's law therefore the Jedi (or any Republic agency) has no jurisdiction there.
    Darth Venator likes this.
  11. The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    Actually the Senators ARE pretty stupid. As seen when they voted to become an Empire run by a tyrant.
  12. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    In addition, the crawl text from TPM doesn't say the Jedi send Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon in. Quite the opposite, it's the Chancellor who sends them in -- to mediate and settle the dispute, at the Chancellor's request. The Jedi seem to be an order that's semi-detached from the Republic, they're not under the Chancellor's direct authority. They're more or less neutral, or meant to stay neutral anyway - "Peacekeepers, not soldiers".
    Last edited by Saintheart, Mar 26, 2013
  13. Lord Chazza Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 4, 2013
    star 4
    Source?
  14. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    We have Shmi saying "The Republic doesn't exist out here" though that might be "practical" rather than "in law". We also have Qui-Gon and Panaka's conversation on the way to Tatooine in TPM, in which one says "It's controlled by the Hutts".

    Add in Watto's "Republic credits are no good out here. I need something of value!"
    ILNP and Darth Venator like this.
  15. Saintheart Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Dec 16, 2000
    star 6
    And indeed Qui-Gon's indication to Shmi that "Had he been born in the Republic, we [the Jedi] would have identified him early." The implication being that Tatooine is not within the Republic. The Republic also had anti-slavery laws; Tatooine didn't abide by them.
    ILNP and Darth Venator like this.
  16. Master Elaine Nega Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2013
    star 1
    I guess the reason was that the Order was waay too focused on the Unifying Force, and always lived in the future, being blind towards the present. Had they been more focused in the moment, they might' ve seen that Anakin was being brainwashed, and hadn' t made that fatal mistake.
    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR likes this.
  17. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Thing is- in RoTS (especially in the novel) Anakin's "visions of the future" are portrayed as something rare, that only a few Jedi have- as well as something not to be relied on.
  18. AkshayTheJedi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 12, 2013
    star 1
    Agreed!
  19. Darth Dominikkus Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 5, 2013
    star 3
    Do vaguely answer your question, Anakin was close to Palpatine. They had many doubts about him becoming power hungry and not stepping down, and they wanted to know what his future motives were. So, they assigned Anakin the role of playing the spy. Though Obi Wan may not have thought he was the wisest decision, he did admit that this was an act that needed to be done, seeing as they were at war.

    Anakin: "Spy on the chancellor? That's treason."
    Obi Wan: "We are at war Anakin..."
    ILNP likes this.
  20. MRCynical Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2008
    star 1
    One source (I can't remember which) suggested that they suspected Mas Amedda might be Sidious, especially when Palpatine was kidnapped which would have made Mas Amedda (if Palpatine died or could not be rescued) Supreme Chancellor.
  21. Valairy Scot Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    That was LOE that suggested that (some on the) Council wondered if the Sith was Amedda.
  22. I Are The Internets Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 20, 2012
    star 7
    The Jedi Council were a bunch of meanies.
  23. kubricklynch Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 3
  24. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2002
    star 4
    At that point, and not in the whole PT?
  25. Son of a Bith Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 28, 2013
    star 4
    Whole PT - that's the point I'm referring to :)
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