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Why didn't Qui-Gon just TAKE Shmi?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Darth Valkyrus, Jun 10, 2013.

  1. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    The OP asked "why didn't Qui Gon just take Shmi".... by brute force?

    That answer was discussed at the Skywalker's dinner table.
     
    JoshieHewls likes this.
  2. Master Jedi Macen Arren

    Master Jedi Macen Arren Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Why would he need to? I mean it wouldn't have changed anything, Anakin still would have had those visions, Palps would have still seduced him to the darkside with his knowledge of how to save a persons life. I really don't think it would have made a difference. Plus I'm sure she said to Anakin that it was his choice, and something that only he could do. People forget that yes Qui-Gon did take Anakin, but it was a decision that Anakin made.

    Jedi are supposed to have no attachments which is why they normally get taken so young. The Jedi probably just assumed that Anakin still being young would get over the thought and emotional connection to his mother.
     
    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR likes this.
  3. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 9

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    True- but given that it was Shmi that gave Anakin permission to help them (after a lot of pleading from him) they kind of owe her.

    Which was why I liked the EU books that clarified that Qui-Gon was aware of this- and managed to subtly repay her.
     
  4. DRush76

    DRush76 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2008

    I agree with you. However, I doubt that many would to consider this argument. ​
     
  5. Placeholder

    Placeholder Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 30, 2013
    That just means he is in a weakened position, which would have made it all that much easier for the Jedi, or Padme, to make a deal with him. We did consider it.
     
  6. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Plus, this ignores the fact that Qui-Gon flat out says "I tried to free your mother, but Watto wouldn't have it" so...
    ------------

    LOL

    yeah

    Qui-Gon: ...say the boy and his mother

    Watto: no pod is worth 2 slaves not by a long shot

    Qui-Gon: the boy then.


    Qui-Gon is a guy who would be swindled easily by a car salesman if that is the brunt of his negotiation
     
  7. Sum-Wan

    Sum-Wan Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 16, 2013
    Where is the concept that they had explosive devices implanted in them so they couldn't escape taken from? Is it in the movie? If so, I honestly don't remember it. But if it is from the novelization, then it's something that needed to be explained onscreen. Still, it would have explained why they couldn't take her without permission but not why they never returned for her.
     
  8. Placeholder

    Placeholder Jedi Knight star 4

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    Jan 30, 2013
    Yes, they tell us about the bombs in the movie.
     
  9. DRush76

    DRush76 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2008
    That's correct. Anakin told Qui-Gon, Padme and Jar-Jar about the explosive devices when they had dinner with the Skywalkers.
     
  10. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Oct 23, 2003
    Covers why she was left behind on Tatooine, but does nothing to explain why the Naboo didn't go back to buy her freedom.
     
  11. KED12345

    KED12345 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Didn't she have a device planted on her so if she tried to escape she'd be killed? I recall reading that about Anakin's slave life.
     
  12. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR

    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 8, 2002
    Yes, she had a slave chip implanted in her, too.
     
  13. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    If Qui Gon had lived, I'd like to think he would have gone back to Padme and remind her to do something about Shmi's plight. Go free her, bring her back to Naboo, that simple of a thing. Shame, that Kenobi didn't learn how to talk to his ghost until after Shmi died.;)
     
  14. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR

    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 8, 2002
    There are several reasons why she wasn't freed, but I'll list one.

    Nobody cares.
     
  15. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 12, 2012
    As soon as Padme got off Tatooine she drank A LOT during the trip to Couscant to clear her mind of that entire terrible ordeal of running around after a Jedi, hanging out with slaves, etc. so he memories of it were hazy at best. Which is why she dismisses Anakin years later with "You'll always be that little boy I knew on Tatooine" because she literally can't remember anything else. Maybe also the flying blue guy.
     
  16. Placeholder

    Placeholder Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 30, 2013
    That's what happens when you make teenagers world leaders. It's sort of like teen stars. It's the Brittney Spears effect. Soon she'll be shaving her head and getting out of speeders without any underwear on
     
  17. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Another possible solution I've thought of is that the Jedi Order might have stepped in and told the Naboo not to get involved -- that because Shmi was on another planet and especially because she was Anakin's mother -- that she was under their jurisdiction. Given that Naboo had recently been invaded, they may have been more willing to accede to this than they normally would.

    In the meantime, Shmi meets Cliegg not long after Anakin leaves and they work together to free her. The Jedi get wind of this, but don't inform Anakin because they don't want to reinforce his attachment to her. There's also the fact that they wouldn't understand the depth of his attachment to her. I don't think the Jedi would have done this maliciously, but given that none of them grew up with families, I don't think they would understand the extent to which no news from his mother would be difficult for Anakin.

    This might explain why Obi-Wan wasn't too concerned about Anakin's "dreams" -- if he knew that Shmi was free, he would be less likely to give them credence and was hoping that Anakin would gradually discipline himself to let go of his mother and stop stressing out.
     
    Thoix Heoro likes this.
  18. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    as good as that theory is, I still don't buy it really.

    Naboo doesn't have to get involved at all.

    Lets be honest here for a minute though about Padme's personal wealth, we see in the deleted scenes that her family do not live in the slumns of Naboo, and I assume that when Padme is outside of senatorial business she wears her own clothes (if not, why not?) . Those gowns aren't worn by commoners. Watto will have a price, especially now he "has lost eveything".
     
  19. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2011
    Why not?

    You don't think that if the Jedi asked Padmé to step aside and let them take care of it she would? Particularly after Qui-Gon just died to protect her planet? And especially if the Jedi described it to be in Anakin's best interests?

    She's likely overwhelmed with the aftereffects of the invasion -- not just in seeing to her people's needs, relations with the Gungans, but also with the criminal proceedings.
     
  20. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    no, not Padme.

    She does things she feels is right.

    Three things

    1) why wouldn't it be in Anakin's best interest for his mother to be free? wouldn't that take a lot of weight off of him?

    2) I understand that she couldn't have done so straight away, but within a couple of years maybe.

    3) the Jedi didn't exactly take care of it did they? unless they paid Cliegg to free her and marry her, if that's the case ethics of the Jedi are even more flawed than I thought.
     
  21. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2011
    I'm not arguing that Padmé is leaving Shmi in slavery. I'm arguing that she believes the Jedi will take care of it because since Anakin is under their guardianship, they believe they have the jurisdiction to handle Shmi. Thus they tell Padmé that it's in Anakin's best interests that the Jedi see to his mother.

    She does what she feels is right, of course, but given that the Jedi just helped her so greatly, and her planet has undergone such a dire crisis, do you really think she would deny them this request?

    And if the Jedi saw that Shmi had fallen in love with Cliegg and was happy with him, then what's the problem?
     
  22. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Padme's weakness was Anakin, She married him in secret against the code. She would think what was best for Anakin, especially as Padme had actually met his mother unlike the council.

    The problem is not telling Anakin about it, if they knew she had been freed, they had nothing to lose in letting Anakin know this. So I guess the problem is: why is it a big secret that Anakin shouldn't be told?
     
  23. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jan 1, 2011
    Who says Padmé knew that Anakin wouldn't see his mother though? She didn't see him for ten years. For all she knew, Anakin would be able to go see her.

    Padmé knew Anakin was free and with the Jedi. If the Jedi told her that they were going to see to Shmi, what reason would Padmé have to believe that Anakin would not be in contact with her?

    I'd be really surprised if Padmé knew any of the specifics concerning Anakin's training or his contact with his mother.

    I do think she was grateful with to the Jedi though and would have let them see to Shmi, particularly if they asked her.
     
  24. Sistros

    Sistros Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Jul 24, 2010
    Padme knew the basics it seems. In AOTC she knew it was forbidden for a Jedi to fall in love, it's not a stretch to believe she knew attachment was forbidden too.

    From what we know from the films (I don't know about EU) everyone apart from Anakin forgot Shmi existed.

    I have the suspicion that Queens don't really come into contact with the Jedi, seems more a senator thing.
     
  25. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 1, 2011
    I don't think Padmé knew. Anakin has to explain that attachment is forbidden to her. She just seems to be under the impression that he isn't allowed to fall in love.

    But I don't know that she thought he wouldn't be able to see his mother. Anakin himself brings this up when he mentions one of the difficulties of Jedi life is not being with the people he loves.