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CT Why didn't we see David Prowse's face in ROTJ

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by fl00dsm0k3, Apr 5, 2014.

  1. fl00dsm0k3

    fl00dsm0k3 Jedi Knight

    Registered:
    Nov 3, 2012
    I was watching ROTJ today and when the scene where Luke took Vader's mask off came on I wondered why we didn't see David Prowse's face instead of Sebastian Shaw.
     
  2. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 6

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    Oct 4, 1998
    Because Prowse is not a dramatic actor. He would likely ruin the scene.
     
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  3. MOC Vober Dand

    MOC Vober Dand Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 6, 2004
    They needed an ac-TOR for that particular job. I've seen mock ups of him in the scene though and I think he could've looked the part. That voice though...
     
  4. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    The main issue was that Lucas and Marquand had agreed to hire an actor to play Vader unmasked, as well as having him look older than Prowse was. Prowse 47 when he did ROTJ and Shaw was 77. Not to mention that Prowse has a West County accent which isn't intimidating at all, which is part of the reason his voice was dubbed over in the first place.
     
  5. DantheJedi

    DantheJedi Jedi Master star 5

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    Aug 23, 2009
    Didn't the fact that Prowse also had a tendency to spill secrets about the movies also precluded him from being considered?
     
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  6. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    Nope. Anakin and Obi-wan were written to be not that far apart in age. There wasn't a sixteen year age difference when the OT was made. Guinness was in his 60's when he made the OT. Prowse's actions is largely why Bob Anderson filmed most of ROTJ, instead of him.
     
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  7. TX-20

    TX-20 Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 21, 2013
    Jake Lloyd & Hayden Christensen would beg to differ.
     
  8. TheChosenSolo

    TheChosenSolo Jedi Master star 4

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    Dec 9, 2011
    Might wanna take that back, especially in the case of Jake Lloyd.
     
  9. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    He was an actor. Just because you didn't like his performance, doesn't make it any less so. It's "Star Wars", not "King Lear".
     
  10. MOC Vober Dand

    MOC Vober Dand Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jan 6, 2004
    I don't think the acting skills of Jake and Hayden are particularly relevant to this thread.
     
  11. Slowpokeking

    Slowpokeking Jedi Master star 5

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    Sep 21, 2012
    Actually Prowse was in the right age of Anakin, and he looks more like Mark Hamill.
     
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  12. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    Anakin Skywalker was originally only like five or ten years younger than Obi-wan, who was supposed to be almost seventy. Prowse was nowhere near seventy when he did the OT. Lucas changed the characters ages when he sat down to make the PT.
     
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  13. Qui-Riv-Brid

    Qui-Riv-Brid Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Apr 18, 2013
    Actually the ages had already changed by Jedi as Anakin was no longer just a few years younger but was now a student of Obi-Wan's when Anakin and Darth were merged.

    The age thing was kind of glossed over anyway and didn't really matter for the unmasking scene. The only part where it did matter was for the final glimpse at the end and a more elderly fatherly look probably seemed better at the time than a much younger man besides Shaw still looked younger than Obi-Wan though the actor was older.
     
  14. Beautiful_Disaster

    Beautiful_Disaster Jedi Master star 4

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    May 12, 2005

    That's what I had heard.
     
  15. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    It's kinda semantics, but you still get the point.
     
  16. DARTHLINK

    DARTHLINK Jedi Master star 4

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    Feb 24, 2005
    Always figured he wanted to get the guy who could best pull off the "I've been stuck wearing a life support suit complete with mask and helmet for twenty-three years" look.
     
  17. Scummy_and_Villainous

    Scummy_and_Villainous Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    May 13, 2013
    Here again is a quick mock-up I made and posted here about a year ago concerning this very subject to provide a better visualization for our forum members:

    [​IMG]

    As I have stated before, I wouldn't trade Sebastian Shaw for the world, but I am certain this would have worked, provided, of course, that there would have been voice over-dubs.
    Not only does he look more like Mark Hamill but he also looks a lot like Hayden Christensen.
     
  18. VadersFollower

    VadersFollower Jedi Knight star 1

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    Jul 18, 2011
    For me Shaw was just a bullseye. This guy was just glowing with a warm fatherly figure aura, and in the suit really sold the idea of a very weakened, sick man. Removal of Shaw at the end of ROTJ brings very mixed feelings in me. On one hand, Haydens presence is, imo, the biggest tie to the PT, so its one of the strongest elements tying the two together, if not the strongest for me, along with Fetts voice, but I always enjoyed the elderly Anakin by Shaw very much
     
  19. There_Are_Four_Lights

    There_Are_Four_Lights Jedi Padawan star 1

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    Apr 30, 2014
    Why not put Hayden in there, if he was going to override the ghost? Dunno.
     
  20. darth-sinister

    darth-sinister Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 28, 2001
    Because Lucas was content with Shaw's performance, which is what he was originally only hired for. Anakin was supposed to appear as a ghost, that was a last minute decision and done under the guise of publicity material, which Shaw had no idea he was going to appear in the film that way. Hayden was filmed the same way, but done for a different reason. The other major difference is that Hayden looked too young, back in 2003 compared to Shaw who was much older at the time. So this fit what Lucas had opted for which is an older physical being and a younger ghost form.
     
  21. MOC Vober Dand

    MOC Vober Dand Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jan 6, 2004
    Setting aside the rightness or wrongness of Shaw/Christensen, old/young, I agree that Shaw's performance in the helmet and as the ghost are indeed excellent. Wonderful acting which captured the moments perfectly.
     
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  22. Bring_My_Shuttle

    Bring_My_Shuttle Jedi Knight star 1

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    Oct 22, 2006
    Because it can't be emphasized enough just how cringeworthy the character of Darth Vader could have been:
     
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  23. MOC Vober Dand

    MOC Vober Dand Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jan 6, 2004
    And when you've found them, somebody get me a coiiderrrr!
     
  24. Django Fett

    Django Fett Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 7, 2012
    Thats absolutely spot on. Which was why Bob Anderson played Vader not only during the sword fight but for all the key scenes like "sister, if you won't turn to the dark side then may be she will" and when Vader throws Palps down the shaft. Something that didn't happen on ESB.
     
  25. CommanderDrenn

    CommanderDrenn Jedi Knight star 4

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    Oct 19, 2013
    Except from an invterview with Prowse:
    [​IMG]