Why do they hate us?

that link is useless - it points to a collection of polls on who you would vote for, not why you would vote for someone, or the important issues when deciding who to vote for.


M

 

how can you pretend to know what they intend to use them for ? If a "glorified walkie talkie" is what they need, then why not buy one from WalMart ? Simple communication purposes across short distances are much better to a low powered walkie-talkie, rather than an expensive cell phone or high-powered professional CB device.

Living in a free world you are entitled to buy whatever you want. Who you are to say what is purposeful, and what is not.

They do have these sort of things in the UK you know, it wasn't like they made a special trip to the US to buy these because you can't get them elsewhere.

My point was the clerk didn't know what he was doing and the customers would have been better served going somewhere else. Would you feel confident in buying a product that the clerk kept saying was "Great", but he couldn't manage to get the thing to work? I know I wouldn't.

And I know it is a free world , but people buy junk for a myriad of bad reasons and bad decisions, and this was an example of one them. Of course by saying this I put myself in "danger" of getting asked the "Who are you to say this?" question again

 

MalkieD2,

Tukafo claims that a CNN poll related to the election campaign in 2000 had information siting US concern for UFO's. I provided a link to CNN.com which has every single poll that they conducted in regards to the 2000 election campaign. How is this irrelevant?

 

still no - all that list has is individual polls on who was ahead in the election at any given point.

how about this ? Its not from the same poll, but it shows the same trend.


On the foreign policy side, we know that George W. Bush flunked a simple pop quiz and thinks that Canada's Prime Minister is named Jean Poutine, but aside from this he has engaged in little debate on international issues.

Why?

Because most Americans are only interested in foreign policy when it clearly affects American jobs, and only then is it a voting issue.

In a Newsweek Poll conducted in early January, registered voters were asked how important certain issues were in deciding which presidential candidate to support. The results showed that international issues are a low priority for U.S. voters.

In that poll, 84 percent of respondents considered education a very important issue; 76 percent health care; 75 percent crime; 74 percent social security; 72 percent economy/jobs; 70 percent moral values; 65 percent for both guns/violence and poverty; and 61 percent for both taxes and the environment. The overseas role of the U.S., meanwhile, came in at just 42 percent, outranking only the issues of campaign finance (40 percent) and gay rights (20 percent).


taken from here

M

 

"still no - all that list has is individual polls on who was ahead in the election at any given point."

Okay?

I don't care what those polls contain. What they DO NOT contain is what Tukafo says they do. That's my point.


EDIT: He also claimed that foreign policy held a position "somewhere between 70 and 80" to which your post surely refutes.

 

Al Gore would not have won. He didn't even win the popular vote, much less the Electoral College votes...which the Electoral College realy elects the president, not the people. Another count on how the US isn't that great of a democracy

Wrong! Here,

http://fecweb1.fec.gov/pubrec/2000presgeresults.htm

Bush: 50,456,002
47.87%

Gore: 50,999,897
48.38%


You can clearly see that Gore got MORE votes (543,898 to be exact) in total then Bush. Thus he won the Popular vote by a small margin. In a TRUE democracy he would have won.

 

then why post a link to unrelated polls?

M

edit: thats why I used the word "trend" ie the lack of importance of foreign policy to your average america.

I think you are a pretty good example of why you can be so disliked

 

malkieD2,

One last time, but only because you are Scottish and I know you have a hard head, as do I.

** Tukafo states that CNN had a poll concerning the 2000 election in which people stated that UFO's were of more concern then foreign policy.

** I find CNN's site that contains all of the polls they conducted during the 2000 compaign clearly showing that no such information exists.

Cool? I don't care what the polls say, I only care that Tukafo is accountable for what he states here as fact. Maybe, he can come up with a link to shut me up. Until then, it is my assertion that his statement was false.

 

you really don't get what I'm saying.

CNN conducts hundreds of polls on different subjects. The page you linked with only covers the polls where people were asked who they were going to vote for. ie Bush, Gore whatever.

It is not a page that covers any of the polls surrounding the election, such as who has the best tie collection or what areas are important to you when deciding to vote.

Those sort of polls must be stored elsewhere, hence the link you provided is not of any use.

Now, I have scoured the CNN website, and can find no evidence of the poll our above poster mentions. While this does not mean the poll was not carried out, I agree that the above poster must post a link, or retract his comment.

I tried to provide a link, which does carry his claim to its fullest extent, but it does reveal a trend that Americans do not rate foreign policy.

I hope that our above poster can provide a link, but its not *that* important.

M

 

I think that in a thread entitled, "Why do they hate us?" it is imperitive that any statements that provide factual evidence to either side of the argument be backed up with proof. If he want to come in here and make false statements, I guess he can do that.

 

I think in any debate where factual evidence is being used, a source should be posted we certainly argee on that, and I'm slightly miffed that someone comes in, throws a statement in the hat (causing an entire page of debate), then is unwilling to cite any reference.

we certainly agree on that

M

 

OK, guys, you want a source? A bit tricky I found.

I read this story on SPIEGEL, a German news magazine (one of the best and most respected magazines for political discussion in the world). I speak German so I sometimes read the the mag if I can find it or look on their webpage.
This story was run in their mag and also on the webpage. I have the mag in front of me (Edition 46/2001) but that's of little use to you. the same article is on their web page here

http://www.spiegel.de/kultur/gesellschaft/0,1518,160653,00.html

problem - it's in German and you need to register for it.

 

Well, I can translate the site easy enough. However, I am not willing to pay to be able to view this poll. Are you able to post it here?

 

Why is it such a dagger in the heart of the rest of the world that people in the US would be concerned more with the domestic issues of crime and jobs, than they would be for international issues? The crime rate, the tax rate, the unemployment rate, and social security all have more of an impact on the daily life of an average America than let's say North Korea and South Korea agreeing to build rail and road links (which, BTW I hope is another sign of reunification, but that is for another thread) between their two countries. I'm not saying international issues are not important (I mean I'd have to rip up my diploma for that ), but I don't think the rest of the world understands how much domestic issues drive national politics in the US. Look at the US election of 1992. Bush the Elder had won a war and was riding high on the popularity of that, but the economy tanked and a year later he was defeated by a candidate whose trademark slogan became "It's the economy stupid!". So, the international events surrounding the Gulf War helped Bush the Elder gain momentary popularity, but the domestic issue of the economy cost him his job. I'm not saying international events that go badly don't have a serious effect on a politician's political life (examples of LBJ in Vietnam and Carter in Iran), but all the treaties, free trade agreements, and foreign goodwill gained during your term as POTUS will net you little to no political capital if everything domestically is going wrong.

Should be there be more focus on international events in US media and politics? A resounding yes, but to scold Americans because we as a whole are more worried about domestic issues that have a perceived daily impact seems to be a bit too harsh of a criticism.

 

I don't think I (or anybody else for that matter) was trying to say that the "America first" attitude of the USA is wrong or misguided. After all other countries aren't really any different in that respect. I was trying to name reasons why certain people HATE the USA and the lack of interest in other countries is a reason why some people hate the USA

 

well, the original post was about Americans finding UFOs more important than foreign policy. (although we're still waiting for confirmation on that one)

M

 

I posted a link to the article. it costs 40 cents to register. Do that or give me your fax number so I can fax the physical article from the magazine 46/2001 to you.

Am I in court here? Why do you even think that the statement about UFOs would be incorrect? Surely you have enough common sense to realize what people are like and what they're really interested in? Ask people to name the 5 members of N'Sync or the name of 5 European heads of states. What do you think the results will be?

Don't tell me you're seriously doubting that most Americans don't care about other countries?

 

I don't think I (or anybody else for that matter) was trying to say that the "America first" attitude of the USA is wrong or misguided. After all other countries aren't really any different in that respect. I was trying to name reasons why certain people HATE the USA and the lack of interest in other countries is a reason why some people hate the USA

Well, my rant (as are all of my posts ) was a little misguided then. However, I suppose if people that hate the US because we supposedly have a lack of interest in other countries (I mean as a shortwave listener I do care about what happens around the world), they should understand that our political climate is one of the possible reasons for that.

Oh, and of course UFOs are more important, I mean there is this world conspiracy that *they* use to keep us from the truth

 

I agree with ImperialFC on this issue.

SETI is of utmost importance. Foreign affairs are insignificant when weighed against that of The Greys.

 

Tukafo take a screen cap of the page, then email it to us, or upload it onto a website.

can't you copy and paste ?

why am I asking........my German is limited.

I wouldn't be surprised if Americans did rate UFOs more important than foreign policy, or world geography.

Its funny what different people mark as important. I could certainly tell you the leaders of the UK, France, Germany, Italy etc, furthermore, however, I don't know who is in N-Sync.

Probably pretty boy names such as Jason and Brad. (why is there never anyone in a boy band called Derek or Colin ?)

I could probably have a go at naming all 50 states of America, but I'll bet no-one here could tell me a region in Scotland without using a book, the internet or some other source.

M

 

I have no doubt that you can name many European heads of state. However I think that the Senate Floor is in no way representative of the population of any country. The people here tend to be more intelligent and educated

Sorry, no cut and paste as I'm not registered for that thing myself. But I promise you, it's here in black and white

 

Tukafo,

Just type out the pertinent info in the article. I am curius to see who was questioned, where, and when. How many people participated in the poll? Was it conducted in Two Forks, Alabama or New York City, New York.

 

I could probably have a go at naming all 50 states of America, but I'll bet no-one here could tell me a region in Scotland without using a book, the internet or some other source.

Darnit man, I can't do it!!! I can tell you I stayed for three days at the Inchnacardoch Lodge in Scotland, near Fort Agustus and on Loch Ness. I suppose if you use the English system then it would be something shire, possibly Inverness since that is the closest city.

 

English system ? lol - they are not all called shires. Kent, Dorset, Sussex, Essex etc etc etc. Ok, there are a few shires, but its not the rule.

Don't stress, I was just making a point

M

 

I understand, and while I love my country, America; and it isn't as guilty as it is made out to be. There are a lot of dummies here who don't know squat about squat. They don't geography, they don't know economics, heck they could't even balance a check book. It is our education system! I may sound conspiracy theorist, but they are really more about social engineering than providing information and an intelligent means by decifer available information and to make your own, informed, decision.

Until we solve that problem we are going to continue to go down hill. The problem I have with the left is that they see no problem with this. They see it as their civic duty to politically indoctrinate whomever and whenver they can. They have carved a nich position in the US that if they are opposed, they can cry that they are only doing it for the children. If you oppose their methodology, then you really just hate kids and must an intolerent biggot. They have essentially won the label game.

So things like geography are not as important as introduction to your sexuality. The abolition of man C.S. Lewis called it, and he was right.