Why don't Jews accept Jesus as the Messiah?

I also think that there'd be some issue with Jews accepting Jesus as the Messiah, as we have that "no idolatry" thing, for which all those statues of Mary, the crucifix, the worshipping, etc. might encroach onto.

Actually, can someone explain that to me, about how that clause is gotten around?

That's mainly a Catholic thing; I was always told that they got around it by taking the "graven images" part out of the Ten Commandments.

 

Hurm, interesting.

Now, again, I'm not fully knowledgable about such things -- but is Jesus generally thought to BE G-d, or the son of G-d, or some combination therein?

(weren't there some conversations between Jesus and G-d that would, were they one and the same, intimate that G-d was talking to Himself or something?)

 

That's mainly a Catholic thing; I was always told that they got around it by taking the "graven images" part out of the Ten Commandments.

That's a fundamentalist bit of garbage (in my view). Such images and icons serve as reminders of God and those that follow him, not as figures to worship.

 

Yes, but in most religions with idols the IDOL is for the exact same purpose, yet the commandments expressly forbid it.

And Bubba, while I don't doubt your commitment to your faith, I seriously, seriously doubt you've explored and studied any religion as intensly as Christianity. And you're biased, you always believed in Christ. It's relevant to the thread, we are asking why Jews aren't Christian. They viewed the evidence first hand, and they didn't accept it.

THere are shloads of holy texts that seem to confirm that Jesus may have existed, but really, it's pretty hard to prove someone DIDN'T exist, so it's always a possibility. And how do you know those documents aren't forgery's?

I mean IMHO, the bible is a fictional book. All religions have their holy books, and I don't see what's so special about the bible. Essentially, I don't see any REAL difference in the major world religions. They all have a valid purpose, to channel your thoughts and serve God. Again, which one you choose depends primarily on what religion your parents were.

Bubba, you are right, some people are taught right things and others are taught wrong things. But generally, people who are religous overwhelmingly follow the religion they were born into.

There is nothing in Christianity that proves it is the one true correct religion over the others. So why SHOULD the jews believe in Christ?

 

The Bahai have a prophet who post-dates the prophets of Judaism, Christianity and Islam. According to Bahá'u'lláh, the word of God is a work in progress, depending on the changing needs of humans as they evolve socially and politically. Their prophet is merely the most recent of God's messengers.

Why don't Christians accept him as the true revealer of God's will?

The Bahai are kind enough to accept Christianity as being an expression of God's word, even if it's obsolete and preempted.

 

There is nothing in Christianity that proves it is the one true correct religion over the others. So why SHOULD the jews believe in Christ?

I should note here that the thread is not about why aren't Jews Christians. That discussion (as has been pointed out) is pointless.

The question is why didn't they accept Jesus as the Messiah that they are/were looking for. To answer that, you would need to look at the prophecies of the Messiah found in the Torah and compare them with the life and actions of Jesus, as they are interpreted by the Jews. Which of them applie to Jesus and which do not (according to the Jews).

Kimball Kinnison

 

But to do that you have to believe that Jesus existed as the bible said he existed, rather than believe the stories were written to make Jesus look like he filled the prophecy. If the biblical Jesus is basically fiction, then you can't make that kind of historical analysis of why the Jews, at the time, didn't accept his divine origin.

 

Doesn't the thread title say Why DON'T Jews accept Jesus as the Messiah, as in the current Jews?

 

"Now, again, I'm not fully knowledgable about such things -- but is Jesus generally thought to BE G-d, or the son of G-d, or some combination therein?"


The Son is God, but a different aspect of Him. When the Holy Spirit caused Mary to conceive, at that moment Jesus became the son of God. But at the same time, the Holy Spirit became part of Jesus, making Him God Himself.

 

Doesn't the thread title say Why DON'T Jews accept Jesus as the Messiah, as in the current Jews?

Yes, but that would go back to the reasons why the past Jews did not accept Jesus. It is asking for the reasons behind the rejection of Jesus, which are historical in nature.

For the record, there are groups of Jews today who do accept Jesus as the Messiah, but who do not consider themselves Christians.

In other words, Christianity (as in the doctrines and teachings of modern or past Christian churches) is off topic here, but the life of Christ with respect to prophecies of the Messiah is not. This is just a friendly reminder to everyone.

Kimball Kinnison

 

The Son is God, but a different aspect of Him. When the Holy Spirit caused Mary to conceive, at that moment Jesus became the son of God. But at the same time, the Holy Spirit became part of Jesus, making Him God Himself.

So, wait... I'm tyring to understand...

Was Jesus entirely G-d, or a human being carrying a portion of the Holy Spirit?

And was any part of Dogma true, in respect to the Metatron being the entity that humans saw when the bible dictated "human talks to G-d," or that humans couldn't process G-d's words directly?

Becuase I'm still stuck on the "thou shalt have no other god before Me" aspect of things, which could explain a lot why Jews don't believe Jesus was the Messiah.

 

"It is asking for the reasons behind the rejection of Jesus, which are historical in nature."

Look, a historical analysis of the problem goes like this: "The Jews at the time were probably largely unaware of Jesus's existence. Therefore they were unconvinced of his divine origin.

And if the stories of his divine origin weren't even written until long after the "historical" Jesus's death, then a discussion of why Jesus's contemporaries didn't believe he was the son of God is pointless.

Christianity blossomed far away from the location of the "actual" events, both temporally and physically. That gives you the answer for why Jews didn't convert to Christianity. They weren't exposed to it. And even if they were, eventually, they weren't inclined to be receptive to that particular message, absent proof, of which there was none.

 

Jesus was God. His true being was God. But He was also man. A paradox.

 

Ah, okay. I kinda get it now.

I'd guess, then, a fairly large portion of the issue would be that Jews -- who as Jabbadabbado mentioned were likely highly unconvinced of Jesus' divine stature -- didn't and don't believe that Jesus WAS G-d.

Getting to the point of SON of G-d may be feasible, but actually G-d would be unlikely.

Were that the case, Jews would be incapable of believing Jesus was the Messiah, wouldn't they? Isn't the Messiah supposed to be G-d, Himself?

(NOTE: Most Jews don't believe that the rebbe in Brooklyn, a member of the Lubavich sect of Judaism, was the Messiah either, even though it's what the Lubavich believed.)

 

I think the fact that Christianity ultimately sprang up far away from the jews is evidence enough that the jews found the arguments for the Christian faith unconvincing.

If the question is a historical "why not?" then the answer is that the Jews didn't have a clue, at the time, that a claimant to the Messiah job was parading around, possibly because he never existed, probably because he never existed in the way the bible says he did.

If the question is a contemporary "why not now?" then why single out the jews at all? Christianity is equally convincing, or unconvincing, to every non Christian.

 

I'm not sure how I like the wat the title of this thread was used.

But anyway.

Yes, I don't believe that Jesus was the messiah. I do believe he existed and was a wise rabbi who introduced revoltionary ideas. But that's it. I just see Jesus as the first Jewish hippie.

A good rabbi.

There is just no evidence to us that he was and besides, he did not fill the requirements of the messiah.

We don't believe in Jesus as the messiah, we don't believe in Satan and we don't believe in Hell.

 

That's a fundamentalist bit of garbage (in my view).

Well, I did hear it from fundamentalists, I'll give you that much...

But is there really a difference between the Exodus 20 you use and the KJV?

4. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:
5. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;


Such images and icons serve as reminders of God and those that follow him, not as figures to worship.

So why do so many people flock to see images of Mary in unusual places?

 

Jews sound pretty cool.

Anyway;

"The Son is God, but a different aspect of Him"

See this is what I think, but I think that applies to all deities of all religions. They're all aspects of one so vast we can't comprehend it.

 

"A house devided against itself cannot stand."


How can the devine be at war with itself?

 

Jews don´t accept Jesus as the Messiah simply because he died without building and securing the state of Israel forever.Simple!

 

McCartney:

And Bubba, while I don't doubt your commitment to your faith, I seriously, seriously doubt you've explored and studied any religion as intensly as Christianity. And you're biased, you always believed in Christ. It's relevant to the thread, we are asking why Jews aren't Christian. They viewed the evidence first hand, and they didn't accept it.

I still don't see the relevance to this thread of whether I've studied other religions; please elaborate.

At any rate, many may not have seen the evidence first-hand. If the Gospels are accurate, only those who already followed Jesus witnessed the Resurrected Christ.


THere are shloads of holy texts that seem to confirm that Jesus may have existed, but really, it's pretty hard to prove someone DIDN'T exist, so it's always a possibility. And how do you know those documents aren't forgery's?

There are also secular histories that confirm Jesus' existence.

But there's no certain way of knowing that any document isn't forged -- or, for that matter, that the universe even existed before we were born, as this may all be an elaborate charade.

But hold the Bible up to the same standards you would hold any other ancient book asserting to be historical, and it holds up extraordinarily well.


Bubba, you are right, some people are taught right things and others are taught wrong things. But generally, people who are religous overwhelmingly follow the religion they were born into.

Sure, but why people believe what they believe is an entirely different question than whether what they believe is credible.


There is nothing in Christianity that proves it is the one true correct religion over the others. So why SHOULD the jews believe in Christ?

Hold Christianity up to some imaginary ideal in which a religion offers obvious and uncontestable proof of its correctness, and you're right, there's little reason to accept it. But hold Christianity up to the real alternatives -- including atheism -- and it holds up remarkably well.


Edit: If I may respond to dabbado:

The Bahai have a prophet who post-dates the prophets of Judaism, Christianity and Islam. According to Bahá'u'lláh, the word of God is a work in progress, depending on the changing needs of humans as they evolve socially and politically. Their prophet is merely the most recent of God's messengers.

Why don't Christians accept him as the true revealer of God's will?

Is there any compelling reason to do so?


The Bahai are kind enough to accept Christianity as being an expression of God's word, even if it's obsolete and preempted.

How kind, but that's a nonsense statement. If you accept Christianity, you accept that Jesus is the Christ -- the promised Messiah, or Savior. If you accept Christianity's central claims, among them that Jesus is God Incarnate, that precludes also accepting any other religion that subordinates Him as a mere prophet.

Jesus asserted that there was a way, a solitary way to God. He didn't point to that path, He claimed to be that path.

One cannot accept a subordinated version of Christianity. Any attempts to subordinate it is an implicit rejection of it.

 

Just quick query, why do some people write God as G-d?

 

"Just quick query, why do some people write God as G-d?"

I'm guessing superstition.

 

Jews are forbidden to write or type the word god, hence g-d.

 

Well Bubba, I was born a Hindu, and I think there is far more truth to that religion than any other. It's far more spiritual and not nearly as dependant on it's mythological stories. The myths are a part of it, but it merely serves to illustrate the larger ideals. But also, at it's core, Hinduism is like Budhism, it's more of a philosophy that a religion.

My point is, it's ultimately ridiculous to ask why Jews don't believe in Jesus as the Messiah. It's because they are Jews, at Jesus didn't cut it with them (if he even existed at all.)

Bubba you are an adamant believer in Christ. You are biased, just like I am and everyone is. And the point about you not studying other religions is meant to prove that you don't have any real practical scientific comparison of the different religions, you study your own and know it's ins and out very well, but you don't know the other religions well enough to compare. I think you'd find that those religions hold up JUST as well as Christianity.

Basically, EVERY religion has learned scholars and people who claim that their 'holy books' are fact and their is evidence. The fact is, there is absolutely ZERO, NADA, BUBKIS, when it comes to qualitatively PROVING that a religion is true. It's impossible. And while it's impossible to prove it untrue as well, it leaves little room for claiming that the religion is backed up by substantive fact.

Religion is based on faith. If you have faith, it's true. If you don't, it's not.

Jews didn't have any faith in Jesus, that's why they didn't accept him, plain and simple.