Why is Han Solo tortured in Bespin?

Okay, I examied the thread index, I did a search and I skimmed thru many many posts.
I think I have done enough research at trying to avoiding redundancy (and I couldnt find my answer)

SO My question is "Why is Solo tortured?"
He is tied to some aparatus and is electrecuted or something. He says later
"They didn't even ask me any questions" .

So even Solo himself wonders. Someone told me it ahd something to do with preparing his body so that the Carbonite would stick to him

But is this is the case, Why didn't Luke need these preperations as Vader was trying to freeze him?

Anybody got any ideas?

 

I always had the impression that they tortured Han in order to lure Luke to Cloud City.

 

It was to lure Luke to Bespin. The vision Luke saw when he was on Degobah was because of Han being tortured. They didn't care about asking Han any questions, he was simply bait.

As to why they didn't need to go through the preparations before freezing Luke, it was simply because the device had been, say, warmed up, when they used it on Han.

 

Exactly!

Though they did have to 'reset the chamber for Skywalker' after freezing Han.

 

I understand the "Lure Luke to Bespin" theory, but I think there's on tiny inconsistancy with it (in light of the PT).

Anakin senses Shmi's suffering at the hands of the sand people in "real time," as it's actually happening whereas Luke senses Han's suffering in the future. That being the case, instead of Han's suffering luring Luke to Bespin, a more accurate statement would be to say that Han's eventual suffering lures Luke to Bespin, which doesn't make much sense to me. It makes it sound like Vader didn't have to torture Han, but simply could have planned to.

I prefer to think that the Empire is simply cruel, Vader sadistic, and that he couldn't allow Han to escape with the princess like he did on the Death Star, so he needed to wear the guy down.

 

Actually, Luke is sensing it in real time. But the editing in ESB is a bit off, so it seems, watching the movie as if Luke is sensing it well before it happens.

 

The only flaw with that is the fact that he would have had to sense it a little bit earlier because Han being frozen in carbonite happened, and then Luke got there while they were transporting him, and even with a hyperdrive, it would have taken him a long time to get there.

 

"The only flaw with that is the fact that he would have had to sense it a little bit earlier"

Not if he was having a vision of the future, as was stated in the film.

 

It doesn't matter whether Luke was sensing it in real time or not (though I'm pretty sure he was seeing the future). Vader had no way of knowing exactly how or when Luke would sense Han's suffering. Nor is there any reason to believe that Jedi visions follow prescribed "rules" concerning when they take place, or what events they depict. Moreover, even if Vader could have somehow known that Luke would have a precognition, if Vader had merely pretended he was going to torture Han, with no intention of actually doing so, Luke never would have had his vision (since Han was not going to be tortured).

But the second argument is moot. The truth, I think, is simply that there are no simple rules for what sorts of visions Jedi have and when, so Vader had no way of knowing that Luke's vision would be precognition rather than in real time.

 

"I prefer to think that the Empire is simply cruel, Vader sadistic, and that he couldn't allow Han to escape with the princess like he did on the Death Star, so he needed to wear the guy down."

That's...a bit of a stretch. Vader has several captives, making escape by any one of them futile. Why would Vader need to "wear the guy down" anyways? It's not like they're going to have a footrace or anything.

Keep in mind Yoda's words...

Obi-wan - "It is you and your abilities that the Emperor wants. That is why your friends are made to suffer"

Yoda and Obi-wan saw the vision also, though none of them know the eventual outcome ("always in motion, the future is.") Remember that Obi-wan felt the "suffering" of the people of Alderaan, and Luke called out to Leia in a time of great need as well. Now, this isn't to say that I'm advocating anything along the lines of "Han Solo is a Jedi" (though it's a great thread), but it's quite clear that Vader expects Luke to show up at Bespin, if for no other discernible reason than to save his friends.

Calrissian - "Lord Vader set a trap for [Skywalker]."
Leia - "And we're the bait"

While Vader may not be exactly sure what it might take to "call" Luke, I'm sure that torture is a proven means. Consider this: Leia was tortured on the Death Star, and Luke subsequently rescued her. Whether or not Luke felt her suffering in ANH, it's not a stretch to consider that Vader remembers this "coincidence", and tries to repeat it.

I wouldn't be surprised if Vader uses something like this in the Jedi Purge as well.

 

Luke's vision was unquestionably of the future simply because Yoda says so.

That being said, I still think there's a fundamental hole in the "To Lure Luke to Bespin" theory as I stated in my previous post.

Also, why Han? Why not Leia? Or both? Certain EU sources suggest Leia was in fact tortured on Bespin, but there is no screen (thus no definiative) evidence of this.

Any thoughts?

 

I see it like this. Vader might not KNOW it will draw Luke to him, but he's pretty sure it will. Like in AotC, Ani is drawn by the suffering of the one he cares about, this being his mother. He cares so deeply for her, because she took care of him, wich is why children are taken early to be trained as jedi.

Vader knows that Luke probably wasn't trained properly as well, so he does it...Times three, he has three people that Luke cares about, so thats triple the bonus points( ^.^ ) He figures that these people HAVE to draw Luke in, and besides, they're all he has...

 

I was always under the impression that all 3 of them were tortured. Han by electrocution, Chewie by those high pitched sounds that seemed to cause him pain and Leia's was off screen.

Luke: "Han! Leia!"

Then he falls and Yoda tells him about control. Then Luke says he sees a city in the clouds and Yoda says he has friends there.

Luke: "They were in pain."

This is pretty solid evidence to me that Leia was tortured also.

P.S. and Yoda then says, "It is the future you see."

 

"a more accurate statement would be to say that Han's eventual suffering lures Luke to Bespin, which doesn't make much sense to me. It makes it sound like Vader didn't have to torture Han, but simply could have planned to."

This is not a hole. Do you really think Vader was having second thoughts about torturing Han? I don't think he cared either way, since he wasn't even planning to take any of the captives with him anyways. Think of how many high-ranking imperials he killed for their inability to catch Luke! Vader had one goal - catch his son. Everything else was just a means to an end. Vader had no problem breaking a few eggs to make his omelette, if you catch my drift.

Vader had every intention of using whatever means necessary to capture Luke. To assume that he was going to say "Now I'm going to torture you......NOT!" seems incredulous to me. Fact is, Luke foresaw the future, and the future came true as Luke foresaw it.

"Anakin senses Shmi's suffering at the hands of the sand people in "real time," as it's actually happening whereas Luke senses Han's suffering in the future."

Remember that in AOTC, the Tusken Raiders had Shmi for over a month. There's really no telling how long she had been suffering before Anakin picked up on her "call". Besides, it really makes no difference when her toturing occured, since "farseeing' involves seeing the past, present, and future of someplace other than where you are.

As for not torturing Leia in ESB, you should consider that he already failed to "persuade" her in ANH. It was the imminent destruction of Alderaan by Tarkin that finally changed her mind, not Vader's interrogation droid. If torturing Han hadn't worked, I'm sure Chewie would have been next.

 

Perhaps Vader was just getting perverse enjoyment of the suffering of others with the punishing of Han for his imputence earlier (and at the Death Star).

UKS

 

It looked like Leia had been going through something unpleasant before the "We're the bait" scene. Besides, showing a woman getting tortured would likely be construed as sick or perverse (some people like that sort of thing). It was probably psychological torment, but who knows?

 

Anakin senses Shmi's suffering at the hands of the sand people in "real time," as it's actually happening whereas Luke senses Han's suffering in the future.

Do you know this for sure? It is clear from the start of AotC that Anakin has been having these visions for quite some time due to the conversation with Obi-Wan about his dreams. Now, according to the AotC novel, Shmi spent around a month with the Tuskens, leading you to believe that Anakin was indeed experiencing dreams about the future and then about the present later on.

 

Yeah Anakin could have been seeing that for a long time.

 

"Perhaps Vader was just getting perverse enjoyment of the suffering of others with the punishing of Han for his imputence earlier (and at the Death Star)."

Vader has a clear mission throughout ESB, and even Obi-wan says that they are being tortured to attract Luke, so I'm not sure where you're getting this idea from.

"Now, according to the AotC novel, Shmi spent around a month with the Tuskens"

This is in the film as well.

 

MeBeJedi is right -- Ben says, "It's you and your abilities the Emperor wants, that is why your friends are made to suffer."

I had forgotten about that line. You've made a believer out of me.

As for Leia getting tortured, who knows? The novel or the script say that she looked worse for wear, but obviously she wasn't in the shape Han was in.

 

Burns, I want my brain back now.

I was going to make the same observation that Anakin says he's been having dreams about Shmi since long before she was captured. He was aware of Shmi's future suffering on some level, but it wasn't until her pain moved from the future into the present that Anakin was so stirred by it that he had to go to her. Vader probably assumed Luke would react the same way to Han and Leia's suffering, so it wasn't enough for him to plan to torture them. All that would do was give Luke bad dreams. However, it turned out that Luke didn't react the way Vader expected him to. It was only after the fact that it became obvious Vader wouldn't have needed to torture them.

I agree that Vader's torturing Han and Leia just because he got a kick out of it is a stretch. Han and Leia were valuable to Vader, so it would make no sense for him to endanger them needlessly.

 

"All that would do was give Luke bad dreams."

You'd know about those, wouldn't you, Mara?

"I was going to make the same observation that Anakin says he's been having dreams about Shmi since long before she was captured. He was aware of Shmi's future suffering on some level, but it wasn't until her pain moved from the future into the present that Anakin was so stirred by it that he had to go to her."

It might also have something to do with the fact that Anakin was physically closer to her at this point as well, since Naboo is very close to Tatooine. On Coruscant, there's no mention made of his nightmares.

"So it would make no sense for him to endanger [Han and Leia] needlessly."

Except when it came to testing the carbon-freezing unit for the Emperor's prize.

 

Well , thanks for your input everybody!

I generally accept the arguement that Vader was torturing Han to bait Luke. As far as a preminition, real time, etc. this matter not to me. Luke, I recall, did see the future.
Vader probably planned to torture them when he caught them, and knew Luke would sense it in real time or before (preety much what you said Awindell)

I guess my confusion was about the actual method of torture (electricution or whatever). I thought it was bait enough to just hold them prisoner. But it makes senses that the needed to be tortured so Luke could sense it more.
SO it could have been fire, physical beatings, anything used to torture Han and that would have not changed the story.

And KMAN, you do have a point in Vader wanting to wear down Han. I dont think that was his primary motive for the torture but Im sure he enjoyed it much.

Solo, so cocky, makes the Imperial Police chase him through half the movie. Then he fires at Vader.

In real police chases, aren't Police more proned to torturing the arrestee after he resists arrest and endangers the lives of officers?

But like I said, not Vader primary motive.
He just enjoyed it!

 

While attracting Luke's attention might have been one goal, I really think Vader was torturing Han just for the hell of it. Payback if you will.

 

Vader new Luke would feel it and go to Bespin and try to save Han and his friends.