Why no Separatist hardware in the OT?

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Darth_Lear, Jan 18, 2007.

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  1. Darth_Lear Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 21, 2003
    star 3
    This question could be rephrased as: when making the PT and overseeing the design of the Separatist ships/droids/vehicles etc., why didn't Lucas design them in such a way that they could be perceived as evolving into a lot of OT things later, like he did with the Republic hardware.

    Here's one possible, quick answer that I don't think is satisfactory. Although Palpatine/Sidious was the ultimate leader of both the Confederacy and the Republic, he took the former less seriously and that it was always going to be the Republic, and therefore its associated hardware, that was going to become his Empire. I have a couple of problems with this. Firstly, As Lucas himself said, in TPM, he was carefully monitoring the effectiveness of the droid army with a view to its potential future uses. It was only when he saw its shortcomings (central control, no independent though or creativity) that he ordered the Clone army. So Palpatine was not, in principle, against taking aspects of the Separatist war machine seriously as forming part of his future military apparatus, he just saw that the droids were very limited. He could still have made later use of, e.g. Separatist ships.

    Secondly, it seems to me that, post Ep.III, the Separatist forces, although having been disbanded, neverthless left behind a huge military apparatus. Irrespective of the fact that Palpatine was also behind the Confederacy, the fact is, this vast armada of ships, droid weapons, etc. ended up being entirely at Palpatine's disposal, and he could make any excuse he liked if he wanted to incorporate it into the Imperial Armed Forces. So, why didn't he? I can understand him wanting to bin the bog-standard battle droids, but I'm sure he'd be able to find a use for the droidekas. :cool:

    DL

    EDIT: In fact, I suppose the Death Star itself is an example of Separatist technology that ended up serving the Empire, but there aren't many others.
  2. DroidGeneral Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 22, 2005
    star 4
    Separatists were the enemy. The Death Star was a secret project and no body knew about it except Palpatine. All the other stuff such as fighters and starships were meant to be operated by droids.
  3. Jamiebacca Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 2003
    star 4
    Maybe we'll see a huge galactic recycling bin in the tv show.
  4. DarthWolvo23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 30, 2005
    star 4
    some of the big seps ships in ROTS have a similar look to ships used by the Rebels in ROTJ.
  5. Owain-MakashiStyle Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 16, 2007
    In Rogue Squadron Three (video game based in the original trilogy on the gamecube) there is a segment in which you fight battle droids and also get to fly a "relic" jedi starfighter, so maybe some story in the extended universe more, but i agree about how the ships/vehicles etc could have been designed better to look more like a part of evolution somehow instead of being created then the designs just disappearing
  6. Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2001
    star 6
    Why no Separatist hardware in the OT?

    Because the OT was shot first. If they ever do a TV show or more movies around the OT time I bet they use aliens and technology from the Seperatists. But when GL made the PT, he wanted to bring in something new for a villian, ergo, the Seperatists.
  7. Darth_Lear Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 21, 2003
    star 3
    Because the OT was shot first

    Indeed it was. And do you think GL had in mind for Obi-Wan Kenobi a minature star destroyer for a fighter in 1978?

    Having said that, we know how revisionist GL can be when it comes to who/what was shot first. [face_mischief]

    But you could be right and I was actually wondering myself if the best way out of this dilemma could be the initial use of Separatist hardware after Ep. III but its gradual phasing out by the Empire over the next 20 years.

    Perhaps DarthWolvo23 has a a point - it's difficult to tell. In any case, it could perhaps be argued that the Death Star evolved from the design of the core of the TF ships.

    DL
  8. YYZ-2112 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2004
    star 4
    Somehow I don't think Lucas is finnished with the series. Sep hardware may yet be seen in the OT at some future date.
  9. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    From the end of AOTC and the ROTS battle scenes, the clone wars were a one-sided Republic butt-whooping. Besides, the Seps were the enemy. It'd be like NATO openly using Nazi equipment after WW2, complete with swastikas.
  10. MistrX Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 20, 2006
    star 4
    I'm surprised Palpatine never utilized those destroyer droids in the New Order. Seems like those would have been an effective weapon. Especially against those freakin' Ewoks.
  11. Darth-Stryphe Former Mod and City Rep

    Member Since:
    Apr 24, 2001
    star 6
    But you could be right and I was actually wondering myself if the best way out of this dilemma could be the initial use of Separatist hardware after Ep. III but its gradual phasing out by the Empire over the next 20 years.

    Well, GL always planned on having designs in the PT notably different than those of the OT. He wanted the OT to show a warn out era. Having the Separatists on the loosing side gave him an excuse not to worry about their technology not appearing in the OT.
  12. DARTHPOWWOW Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 28, 2006
    The thing is, you really don't need SEP hardware in the OT. Sidious's plan for the Clans and Federations that formed the SEP Council was to destroy and bankrupt the alien races that by far stood the chance of rebelling against him once he took command of the Empire. I would suspect at the end of the war, what was left of these races would have been held accountable by the Empire with all accounts frozen, all military hardware handed over to be scrapped, all installations and plants used for manufacturing of hardware seized and brought into the Empire.
    These facilities would then "pump" out ships for the Empire with controls made for humans, which of couse is 99.9% human(.01 left for Thrawn). You don't see the Tech just like you don't see the alien races that made up the SEP council in the OT....because probably not many exsist after the whopping Vader and the Emperor put on them.

  13. Master_Shaitan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 31, 2004
    star 5
  14. BAR_BAR_DRINKS Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 9, 2003
    star 1


    Sids didn't forsee that, did he?:oops:



    all those battledroids were in the OT! where do you think they got metal for the DeathStars?
    like the Jawas, the Empire recyles![face_idea]
  15. DarthNidLoc Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 2005
    star 3
    Most Seppie stuff was droid controlled. After the Clone Wars nobody was going to use a droid army. the droids got spanked. Also the OT takes place 20 years later so things progressed. While Imperial Hardwars looks alot like the Republic ships they are still not exactly the same. It was just progression of tecnology. The moved from the Actis Interceptor and V-wings into the Tie Fighter(which design was is something of a combination of elements from both). The Star Destroyers from ROTS have major cosmetic differences then the ones we see in the OT, including a different brigde tower(the upright part) a and the're hanger opened up on the dorsal rather the underneath.
  16. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    It also opens up underneath as well. :p
  17. Carnage04 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 8, 2005
    star 5


    Symbolism was big for the Empire. Star Destroyers, AT-AT's, Storm Troopers......the Empire left no doubt who was coming to sack your planet if you were on their hit list. Sending a hodgepodge of ships to attack would do little to inspire the overall image of Order that the Empire was trying to produce.

    Reason 2 is that droids were not looked kindly upon after thousands of battle droids were running all over the galaxy destroying things.

    Reason 3 is that in many cases I think that the Empire wanted to find reasons to enslave alien populations. What better reason than to get cheap labor to build a new fleet of warships for THE FIRST GALACTIC EMPIRE!

    Carnage
  18. sith_rising Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 7, 2004
    star 4
    I'd imagine that Palpatine nationalized the guilds, federations, bankers and corporations that made up the Seperatists, then had all their droids and war machines collected and destroyed. He's not foolish enough to let them maintain their militaries, since they'd be the only ones in the galaxy capable of standing up to the Empire. The Clone Wars showed that the droids were inferior weapons, but they could still be a threat if some rebels got their hands on a Droideka factory or some Federation tanks.
  19. yoshifett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2004
    star 5
    [image=http://www.willisms.com/archives/kanyewest.gif]

    "George Lucas doesn't care about continuity"
  20. sith_rising Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 7, 2004
    star 4
    lol, we could use that in the "why does Leia remember Padme?" threads.
  21. rumsmuggler Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 31, 2000
    star 7

    Awesome..

    [face_laugh]



    The true answer is because the OT was made first, and he didn't have the backstory of the saga all together until he started working on the PT. He didn't finalize the PT until it was time for him to work on it..
  22. DARTHPOWWOW Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 28, 2006
    So then basically we should be ready for a new Super, Duper, Special Edition, Fully Restored(again), Ultra Definative, Directors cut of the OT where CGI will be used to toss some Neimondians in the Cantina scene, and to add a street merchant selling retro-fitted battledroids that were reprogramed for "ettiquette and protocal".......awesome!!!
  23. DarthBoba Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2000
    star 9
    Evidently people don't get the right to do what they please with their product if other people don't approve. :rolleyes:

  24. DINVADER_RETURNS Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2003
    star 3
    Did you guys not see the Star Destroyer bridge at the end of EP3 looking the same as in ESB? As for Nemoidians added to the cantina, Duros are their close relatives and already there.
  25. skyysoblue Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2005
    star 2
    90% of the hardware for the separatist was droid operated. the one problem with droids is that they cannot be "persuaded" to do anything outside of their programing. The droids themselves are not to bright. For example, when Obi Wan and Anakin back into the elevator. The right decision would have been to open fire and kill the Jedi. Instead, they followed their programing which at the time was to "capture" the Jedi.

    Droids army's are also very vulnerable. Take out the command ship and the entire army shuts down.

    We also do not know the shelf life of battle droids. They may only be built to last 2-3 years. So to maintain the army you need to maintain the production facilities.

    Also, don't forget that none of the forces going against the droids built their own battle droids. If that were an effective way to fight, you would think that some of the planets being invaded would have had their own droid armys.
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