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CT Why Palpatine's Empire hate non human races so much?

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by Slowpokeking, Oct 13, 2012.

  1. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    The alien ghetto on Coruscant is a lot nastier in Wedge's Gamble than it's portrayed by the Imperial propagandist in The Illustrated Star Wars Universe.
     
  2. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 29, 2000
    Always thought the subtext in the ISWU was that you should be equating them with the Warsaw ghetto, myself.
     
  3. janstett

    janstett Jedi Master star 3

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    May 29, 2004
    Sidious took Darth Maul as an apprentice and at least by the "Sidious" book his master, Darth Plagueis, was a Muund.

    At this point I'd like the theorize that humans originated at the center of the galaxy and spread outwards as colonists, where they ran into the other races. There's actually a lot of support for such a theory and would explain things like the human settlers on Tatooine having to deal with the native Jawas and Sand People, for example. The duality of Naboo's humans and Gungans fit nicely with that theory too.

    So the seat of power at Coruscant would naturally have a human bias.

    It's also fun to imagine that Palpatine's stomach was turned by the diversity of the Jedi population and the Senate, his disdain for the crumbling edifices of a diverse democracy bringing along with it a racial component for "sameness" if it wasn't there already.
     
  4. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

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    Sep 2, 2012
    One who took the view that Muuns, and humans, were superior to most of the other races of the galaxy.
     
  5. Sitara

    Sitara Jedi Master star 3

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    Oct 8, 2001
    Uhm guys, I thought it was pretty obvious.

    Sidious/Palps/Empire did not hate aliens at all. That was just some EU crap thrown in to 'explain' why the leadership of the Empire was human along with all the Storm Troopers and to give the Empire a 'racist' bent because of the political situation in those days in America. The real reason ofcourse, was that CGI did not exist in those days, so it was not possible to have large bunches of aliens running around. Which is why you got the retarded Ewoks in ROTJ. TPM instead gave us the gungan army, which was much better and much believable in how they could defeat a superior/high tech force.

    So anyway, if they had made all the empire officers aliens, that would have taken the costs through the stratosphere. Though yes I do wish they had made the Storm Troopers some humanoid alien species, like Bith or Sullustan or something. Just show one or two troopers with their helmets off and they are munn. Then we find out they are all clones, so we automatically realize all the stormies are munn.

    If Sidious had truly been racist, do you actually believe he would have chosen the heir to the Sith line, and his own heir as a Zabrak (aka Darth Maul)?

    The PT should have had more aliens in key positions though. Vallorum should have been alien, to show aliens can rule the Republic. Tyrannys/Dooku should also have been an alien. They could have still hired Chris Lee which Lucas really really wanted for some reason, and then put some light make up on him and made a new alien race from him. Qui Gon could have been alien (again, Liam Neeson with some light makeup and/or CGI on, a new humanoid species made for the PT) And so on and so forth.

    Oh well, at least Yoda, head of the Jedi Order, was an alien. Mace should have been alien as well. We already have Kenobi and Anakin to identify with as the protagonist human Jedi.
     
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  6. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Maul wasn't so much his heir as his tool. It was the earliest Star Wars magazines, published right after the first movie- that had the stormtroopers having the attitude that the only good alien is a dead one- the EU simply expanded on that.
     
  7. janstett

    janstett Jedi Master star 3

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    May 29, 2004

    Yeah because there were no aliens in Star Wars. o_O
     
  8. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

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    Sep 2, 2012
    The article I quoted earlier points out there's aliens on Tatooine in the bar, the absence of visible aliens elsewhere, and speculates that humans dominate the society of the SW galaxy, with aliens on the fringes.
     
  9. Sitara

    Sitara Jedi Master star 3

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    Oct 8, 2001
    Uhm...having MORE aliens would mean MORE costs. Isn't that kind of obvious?

    And again, the tech was too basic at the time. Yoda was great true, but having a bunch of Yoda's running about would be problematic. A bunch of Chewbaccas running around would just look ridiculous.
     
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  10. jacktherack

    jacktherack Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 19, 2008
    Are you kidding? You think the Gungan's were more believable?
    It was horribly done slapstick...
     
  11. Sitara

    Sitara Jedi Master star 3

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    Oct 8, 2001
    Yes, yes they were. Not only that, it was MUCH more believable when they took on the battle droids. They used actual tactics, they used a shield generator. The best part though, was that they lost to the droid army.
     
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  12. jacktherack

    jacktherack Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 19, 2008
    you mean like slapstick?
     
  13. Valairy Scot

    Valairy Scot Backpacking One Pack a Day Mod of New Films star 6 Staff Member Manager

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    Sep 16, 2005
    Turning (the apparent majority) human sentiment against the (apparent) minority aliens was probably a political tool - focus the newly disenfranchised's (those once part of a Republic now a part of an Empire) fears and uncertainty against fellow citizens.

    It's happened real world - (it wasn't just) look at Hitler, he was able to focus the German's dissatisfactions against small groups of "outsiders" who "were responsible" for all the problems that Germans legitimately faced - no need for me to go into a mini history lesson, or point out all the other similar examples which exist.

    In other words: redirection.
     
  14. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Force Ghost star 8

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    Sep 2, 2012
    As to whether he, personally, felt that aliens in general were inferior to humans in general- that might require a certain amount of combing the books for examples of Palpatine's internal monologue.
     
  15. Jedi Master Thon

    Jedi Master Thon Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Feb 3, 2013
    Think of it as Adolf Hitler's belief in Aryan superiority. Hitler believed that anyone else was inferior, as Palpatine does.

    Edit: sorry, I didn't realize this was mentioned previously.
     
  16. Game3525

    Game3525 Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 25, 2008
    Agreed.

    That is one of the sillier concepts the EU has ever came up with. It really doesn't make sense for Palpatine to be a bigot given what we know. He is a manipulator who sees every being as an object to reaching his goals, him using racism and xenophobia of humans to gain more control and power over the galaxy makes far more sense them him personally caring what species certain beings are.
     
  17. Chainmail_Jedi

    Chainmail_Jedi Jedi Padawan star 2

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    Jan 26, 2013
    has George the Hutt said anything on the matter of Palpatine's racism?
     
  18. DarthBoba

    DarthBoba Manager Emeritus star 9 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jun 29, 2000
    No, the guy who just gave 4 billion dollars to charities hasn't commented.
     
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  19. Chainmail_Jedi

    Chainmail_Jedi Jedi Padawan star 2

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    Jan 26, 2013
    Contribute meaningfully or don't post. -Darth Boba
     
  20. lGrandeAnhoop

    lGrandeAnhoop Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Oct 29, 2015
    Because, just like with HP, the compulsive need to make the tyrant into Hitler won over.
    In HP, it was set up as early as the second book, and came to define the series like WMD became to define 24 - and they put their own, natural spin on it with magicians vs. normies.

    In SW, this has never been a thing :)p) until the EU, which I find a bit risible - 6 movies (or 3 if it started earlier) without the grey-uniformed Space Nazis also being racists, aaaaaaaaand nvm they're racists.


    It's fun to see some hints of that in the movies, but really, people there just have a natural tendency to treat robots or aliens in a certain way. Seems to be mutual.
    The Empire's made of humans because they wanted the Empire to be completely straight and not "wacky" in any way.
     
  21. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jan 1, 2011
    The Empire being racist is very, very clearly written into the film.

    It's no coincidence that there are not only no aliens, but no nonwhite men or even women. Whereas the Rebellion has two female leaders, plenty of aliens, and increasing numbers of nonwhite men are shown to take part in the Rebels' fight (although the first film was all white people). This isn't just an invention of the EU.

    The exclusion of women and nonwhite men from Imperial ranks sends a pretty clear message.

    In practical terms, Empires have frequently created divisions among subject populations by putting a minority in power against the majority. It was a favorite British colonial tactic -- the British would elevate a minority population as the governing body that answered to them and another, different minority would fill the military role. In this way, these minorities would protect British interests, knowing that the majority would turn on them and overthrow them should they lose British support. It was a shockingly effective policy but it also generally screwed up large regions of the world once the British Empire fell.
     
  22. lGrandeAnhoop

    lGrandeAnhoop Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Oct 29, 2015
    You didn't read my post.
     
  23. PiettsHat

    PiettsHat Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Jan 1, 2011

    Yes I did. Specifically, I was responding to this point: "In SW, this has never been a thing :)p) until the EU, which I find a bit risible - 6 movies (or 3 if it started earlier) without the grey-uniformed Space Nazis also being racists, aaaaaaaaand nvm they're racists."

    The Empire's always been racist. Chewbacca is called a "thing" in the original film. And given the casting choices for Imperials, I'm not sure how anyone can argue that "In SW, this has never been a thing." Unless you were being facetious. I admit I wasn't sure what you meant by this " :)p) ".
     
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  24. Jedi Knight Fett

    Jedi Knight Fett Force Ghost star 7

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    Feb 18, 2014
    I don't know how people don't understand that the empire was racist. In the movies there are no non humans serving the empire in Command.

    I do not though think that Palpatine is Racist because of
    Maul
    Mas Amada
     
  25. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Nightsister of Four Realms star 9 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Holy thread necro.

    The idea that "humans are naturally racist" is just...no. That is all.

    In the NEU, there are two dark-skinned women serving the Empire (Rae Sloane and Ciena Ree) so if the Empire was intended to be racist and sexist, that idea is being retconned by Disney.

    Speciesist remains to be seen, and I think the precedent is there with the officer's treatment of Chewie.