Why people are not getting Episode I DVD

Discussion in 'The Phantom Menace' started by Ewan_tw, Oct 8, 2001.

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  1. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4

    originally posted by Ernest_Rister

    "Getting the picutre? THE PHANTOM MENACE *eploded!* out of the gate, and then declined steadily week to week until by the end of August, 13 weeks into its run it was pulling down a pallid $120,000 a week!"


    Ok, I think you need to look at the charts again. The weekend of 8/27 TPM made 900,000 bucks. The DAY of 8/31 it made 120,000. That's 120,000 a day, not a week. Which means it was making 7 times more than what you stated. Comprende?

    It didn't make 120,000 week until it showed up unanounced back in the discount theaters on Christmas Eve. (DECEMBER 24). Which is 7 months after it was released.

    I didn't list TPM's day to day performance because the link I provided has all that info readily available.

    Titanic was a COMPLETELY unique case. Titanic made almost the same amount week after week for months. It had an amazing run, but NO OTHER moder movie has performed like it. TPM performed like many recent big summer blockbusters, only with a higher opening an lower drops than most of them.


    There's no point in comparing TPM's performance in June and July to Sixth Senses' in September and October. Harball was the number one movie a few weeks ago, and it only cleared 9 million bucks (2nd week). I'm not arguing that it didn't make most of its money after a few months but that's the same as most big blockbuster movies.

    Chart the performance of most of the big summer movies from the last 5 years. You'll see that their performance looks a lot like TPM, with TPM making more money.





  2. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4
    I'd be interesting in hearing what other 'word of mouth' movies you're talking about. Look at othe movies released in May and June. See how much of their totals were made in the first two months.

  3. Luukeskywalker Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 23, 1999
    star 5
    Ernest_Rister, you are WAY off the mark.

    Amazon did a little competition thing one day between TPM DVD pre-sales and The Mummy Returns DVD presales.

    They called it, "Battle of the Heavyweights: Menace vs. Mummy"

    TPM had pre-sold over 44,000 copies while Mummy Returns had only sold 20,000 copies. Also keep in mind that Mummy Returns was at that point VERY close to its release date while TPM's was still 2 weeks AFTER MUmmy Returns. By that reckoning, Mummy should have had its peak in pre-sales as it was getting VERY close to the street date at that time.

    And TPM was giving it a royal arsh whooping, over 2 times the sales!!!

    And Ernest_Rister, I noticed the box office stats you posted stated that TPM made "only" $30 million dollars in one period of its run.It looked to be in the course of about a week. It was the point where your commentary on that was something like "uh-oh starting to lose steam" or something of that nature.

    I ask you, Mr. Brilliant, name one movie to me besides Titanic that made that much money in the period of one week well over a month after its release?????

    I know compared to the first two weeks that was FAR lower. But come on, give me a break. Thta is still pretty amazing.

    I guess if TPM had made literally 500 billion dollars in each week of its first month and then in each week of its second month it only made 100 billion dollars, becuase it dropped 80%, you would still imply that 100 billion dollars was terrible.

    You can't only look at percent dropoffs becuase the amount of money made by a movie in its first few weeks might be so astoundingly high becuase of enormous hype, that when it turns more "modest" to say the least after that, it is just unfair to call something like that "going splat".

    No, my brilliant friend, Godzilla went splat and Austin Powers 2 went "splat" and Pearl Harbor "went splat".

    TPM, almost grossed a billion dollars world wide and is the second highest grossing movie ever. I hardly call that "going splat"

    BTW, the TPM VHS sold 5 million copies in its first 2 days of release. That is fact and there is no way you can disprove that. After those numbers were announced, one expert said that it would probably end up in the top 5 selling VHS movies of all time. It was all over the news. In fact I remember Jim Rome making fun of star wars fans when th news broke of TPM's record breaking VHS sales, becuase he claimed "we have no life".

    When TPM was anounced to be released on VHS, it went staight to number 1 at amazon in the 4 months leading up to its release and never budged for 4 months straight!!! And that is the truth. I saw the ranking almost every day.

    And when the DVd was released. Guess what? Straight to number 1!!!! Now, the DVD market is much more competitive that the VHS so, wih classic like The Godfather and Snow White, it has not exactly stayed at number 1 the whole time, but has been in the top 5 the whole time. But has still outlasted EVERY movie that has cracked the top 5 over there since TPM was announced 4 months ago. In fact it has outlasted The Godfather, Shrek, The Mummy Returns, Snow White, just to name a few. Oh yeah, Citizen Kane as well.

    So you are wrong and are just in denial. Get over it.


  4. VladTheImpaler Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 13, 2000
    star 4
    >>>Blah blah blah...did NOT perform like a word of mouth hit...blah blah blah<<<

    Oye. You're acting like TPM was a small, little-hyped movie with a limited release. The fact is, TPM had HUGE hype. That means everybody is going to see it in the first couple weeks. It's hard to develop as a "word of mouth" hit when everyone already knows about it and has seen it.

    Let's look at The Sixth Sense. The previews weren't really that good, and a lot of people didn't bother to see it the first week. The people who DID see it realized that it was a good movie. So they go up to their friends who haven't seen it and a conversation would go like this:

    Guy: "Hey, have you guys seen The Sixth Sense?"

    Rest of group: "Nope. Is it good?"

    Guy: "Yeah, it was great."

    Group: "Cool. Let's go see it."

    Now here's the TPM equivalent:

    Guy: "Hey guys, have you seen Episode I yet?"

    Group: "Of course we did--it's Star Wars. Damn good flick, it was."

    Guy: "Oh."

    Group: "Hey, Austin Powers just came out. Wanna go see it?"

    I'm not sure if I'm communicating this idea clearly enough. But basically, you'd have to live in a cave to not know about TPM. Everyone who wants to see it is going to see it immediately. The real test of TPM's box office success is it's drop-off rate(which was much lower than the typical summer blockbuster) and how long it stayed on the charts.

    You keep trivializing TPM's position in the top 10/top 20, and I think that is wrong. The fact that it stayed in the top 10 so long shows that more people kept going to see TPM even through release after release of other hyped-up summer blockbusters.
  5. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4
    I understand. One thing I noticed that no one had mention yet is that most of the big movies with Great Legs are original or the first in a series. Even if a sequel makes more money, it usually does so fairly quickly.

    The big movies make almost all their money in the first two months. I believe Earnest stated this. Titanic was a unique case, no other recent movie has performed like it, it was beyond amazing.

    Sixth Sense also did super, but I'm not sure there are too many more movie like. Movies that made a lot of money, say 200 million, that didn't make almost 90% of their total in the first 8 weeks. The Lion King and Toy Story 1 also had better legs (TS1 only a little better).

    Actually I'm compiling a list of blockbusters as far back as 1993, and how much of their total they made by the 8th week of release.

    The Phantom Menace compares favorably to many big movies that are considered to have had 'great legs', or at least really good ones; Gladiator, The Matrix, The Fugitive among others.

    I just wish I could find more detailed info for Jurassic Park 1. That movie played for a really long time, but I beleive the percentage of its total it took in after 8 weeks was a bit better than TPM's, but I'm not sure.

  6. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4
    By the way, Sixth Sense made 2/3 of it's money at day 36, compared to day 25 for TPM. That's definitely better, it's only a week and a half. But again, August, September and October are much slower months for the box office than May, June and July. There are less big movies coming out in the fall, so if there is a popular movie out, it can make more money and hold on onto more screens longer.
  7. dehrian Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 1999
    star 6
    There's a very popular board called Home Theater Forum. It's pretty much TF.N for home theaters. There's a thread over there with over 100 replies wherein people are reporting or asking for places to find the TPM disc early. I frequent that board. Have for years. I have never before, for any title, seen that happen. This disc is going to be huge.

    And, for what it's worth, those of you planning on passing it up are missing a great disc. I put it as one of the five best discs out there, up against Fight Club, Snow White, Toy Story box, and T2. I've been playing with it steadily since I got it Wednesday, and there's some fantastic stuff on there. The documenatry alone is worth the price of admission if you have any interest in seeing how a film is made.
  8. Princess-Leah Sketch Card Artist

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2001
    star 5
    The majority of purchasers will not be die- hard fans, or the critics, or the people who like dark, violent-laden, uber-slick, add-another-blck-to-the-depression-foundation, films. But, the people who would like their children to see something that is without said elements. Frankly it's good, clean entertainment.
    It's an element that is sorely lacking in the film-world of ultra-violence and ultra-profanity.

    I'm surprised by many 'fans' that were so overcome with anticipation that they never once considered that they were setting themselves up for disappointment.
    Like idealizing a person before you've met them...maybe a star that is admired...then when you meet that person they are rude and arrogant...etc. It's bad to idealize anything.

    There are movies that are far better than any of the Star Wars movies...and worse...it's just a fact. Star Wars wasn't meant to please everyone, wasn't meant to garner Oscars, or to create an unprecidented iconic following...it was just meant to entertain. Anyone who thinks otherwise has mis-placed their thought process.

    I can think of a hundred movies, all better than any of the 4 released SW. And, can also think of hundreds and hundreds of movies that were FAR, FAR worse.
    I take the movies for what they were, ENTERTAINMENT. Nothing more, nothing less.
    I do not expect miracles from GL or his business. Just a nice way to spend a couple of hours. No profanity, no nudity, no gory violence, no serial killers, no rapists, no terrorists, no madmen. There are precious few movies that are made without the above mentioned elements.

    If a list of great movies was created to pass on to our children, Star Wars would just make the list. For pure entertainment I doubt that we'd want to give our 5 year olds...'The Godfather' or 'Traffic' or any number of critically acclaimed pictures because of their truly dark natures.

    It's a shame that people place so much value in the trivialities of entertainment rather than the value of entertainment itself. Films are amusements...ways of escaping the reality of normal, everyday life...which we need.
    There are so many other more important issues in the world to 'argue/discuss' about...

    'Who ISN'T going to buy Episode 1 on DVD' or 'why I don't like Star Wars or The Phantom Menace', 'why I don't like Jar-Jar/Ewoks/Anakin/'place-your-'don't like'-here' are just reflections of people who don't have purpose, direction or focus in their lives and who take 'entertainment' too seriously.

    If you don't like it...don't buy it (some people are buying it even when they don't like it, what's up with that?). If you like it...buy it. Simple.





  9. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4
    "I can think of a hundred movies, all better than any of the 4 released SW. "

    :eek: Blasphemy!!!

    ;)


    There may be movies that are 'better' than the Star Wars movies, but there aren't any movies that I like more. But then that's me. :)
  10. MountainMan Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2001
    star 3
    [Any criticisms] are just reflections of people who don't have purpose, direction or focus in their lives and who take 'entertainment' too seriously.

    Careful there. Your post was very well reasoned until you went for the jugular. Trying to sum up your otherwise valid point by insulting those who don't like The Phantom Menace is a sure way to get yourself in trouble on these boards (and it's just bad form.)

    Just accept that some people don't like the film and move on because, frankly, it doesn't matter a wet slap what they say. TPM is a successful film proving that even after 20 years Star Wars is as popular as ever.
  11. Princess-Leah Sketch Card Artist

    VIP
    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2001
    star 5
    Well, I DO accept that there are persons who don't like or critisize something or love it so much that it interferes with the normal course of their lives. I am sorry if I gave any indication of a lack of acceptance.

    What I have made clear is that critics(Pro OR Con), don't stop at mere opinion, it continues on indefinitely in a series of quips and attacks which only serve to make others uncomfortable. Thus detracting from the spirit of the boards as a FUN place to be.
    I wholeheartedly respect a differing mind- set when it doesn't involve treating others WITHOUT respect. These detractors seem to enjoy vocalizing their dislike too much. Exploring every avenue of negativity repeatedly.
    Why is that?
    Why are they are so attracted to the one place where they would seem most likely to 'hate' even more?

    What I DID fail to mention in my previous post was that EITHER side can be thought of as losing their focus in life when the subject of entertainment becomes their raison d´être. For that I apologize.

    Again, if you like it, great...if you don't like it, great. But...there are precious few reasons to stay aboard if one hates the very thing that the site promotes...fun...hehe, :D it's very funny. If I hated a certain type of food I wouldn't be eating it again, or creating topics on message boards about how and why I hated it. Seems illogical, masochistic and negative. :(

    I don't care 'why' there are people who are NOT going to buy or WILL buy Ep 1 DVD. Though it certainly DOES appear that there are many who do.

    I read the boards quite a bit...but, don't usually mark the occasion with a post. Just trying to get a little break from reality, a very precious commodity indeed. :D

  12. Ernest_Rister Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2001
    star 1
    <<Amazon did a little competition thing one day between TPM DVD pre-sales and The Mummy Returns DVD presales. They called it, "Battle of the Heavyweights: Menace vs. Mummy"

    TPM had pre-sold over 44,000 copies while Mummy Returns had only sold 20,000 copies.>>

    Yup. Just like the theaters, just like home video, MENACE is going to be big in its opening weeks. No doubts there. Its in the long run that MENACE will slip up, because it simply isn't a beloved film. I suspect SHREK will probably be standing tall as the all-time best selling DVD come January, that or SNOW WHITE. But MENACE? Nope. Sure, I expect huge sales up front, that falls in line with the video release. Its the film having long term legs, selling well for WEEKS that should have your concern. Not a boatload of cash in three weeks and then bottoming out.

    <<Also keep in mind that Mummy Returns was at that point VERY close to its release date while TPM's was still 2 weeks AFTER MUmmy Returns. By that reckoning, Mummy should have had its peak in pre-sales as it was getting VERY close to the street date at that time.>>

    MUMMY RETURNS and PHANTOM MENACE -- two sterling examples of cinema.

    <<And TPM was giving it a royal arsh whooping, over 2 times the sales!!!>>

    ITS THE MUMMY RETURNS! Did you know SNOW WHITE just kicked the crap out of MUMMY RETURNS? SNOW WHITE sold a million DVD units in a single DAY. 25% of its initial shipment was gone in 24 hours. MENACE's competition isn't MUMMY RETURNS, its SNOW WHITE AND THE SEVEN DWARFS. MENACE will beat that single day sales record, no doubts, but its the long term sales you're going to have to watch. Most DVD purchases are made over-the-counter at retail stores, not over the internet. That's where this battle will be fought.

    <<And Ernest_Rister, I noticed the box office stats you posted stated that TPM made "only" $30 million dollars in one period of its run. It looked to be in the course of about a week. It was the point where your commentary on that was something like "uh-oh starting to lose steam" or something of that nature. I ask you, Mr. Brilliant, name one movie to me besides Titanic that made that much money in the period of one week well over a month after its release????? I know compared to the first two weeks that was FAR lower. But come on, give me a break. Thta is still pretty amazing.>>

    Man, you guys just don't get it. MENACE had a MASSIVE audience turnout. Everyone wanted to see it. The average number of movie-goers in a given summer week is 25 million or thereabouts. In the case of MENACE, you're looking at a HUGE increase of that number, because of the love and affection for the original trilogy.

    Ask yourself this question: do you know anyone near your age who hasn't seen it? That's what I'm getting at. With THAT kind of an audience base, MENACE could have shattered TITANIC like so much tin foil. Wo why did it behave like PEARL HARBOR, opening huge and then droppin off steadily after its opening weeks? Same reason PEARL HARBOR did.

    BAD WORD OF MOUTH.

    Here endeth the lesson.

    <<BTW, the TPM VHS sold 5 million copies in its first 2 days of release. That is fact and there is no way you can disprove that. After those numbers were announced, one expert said that it would probably end up in the top 5 selling VHS movies of all time. It was all over the news. In fact I remember Jim Rome making fun of star wars fans when th news broke of TPM's record breaking VHS sales, becuase he claimed "we have no life".>>

    Oh, did you catch the reports from indpendent sources, like DVDFile.com, which investigated and reported that these numbers were bogus? That MENACE had actually sold far less than was being reported? Look at the revenues for MENACE from VideoBusiness.com. If MENACE did indeed sell 5 million in its first week...then it sold 2 million the rest of the year. Explanation? Have one?

    The best-selling videos for 2000 were TARZAN and THE SIXTH SENSE...MENACE was in 4th, nowhere near TARZAN in terms of sales, and nowhere near the likes of the all-time best sellers list. Agai
  13. C-3P0 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2001
    star 4
    Who cares?

    Would anybody's opinion of The Phantom Menace change if more DVDs or VHS tapes are sold?

    Why would it make a differance? Does anybody have to justify thier feelings about a piece of entertainment through number crunching?

    Does it matter if TPM is the number one selling DVD of all time or the last place entry?

    Darth23 liked the movie.

    Ernest_Rister thought it was dissapointing.


    At the very least, you guys should wait until there is DVD sales data to analyze before spouting all this crap.


  14. Jedi_Master_Carr Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2001
    star 1
    It is pointless to argue with you. You keep saying that everybody hating because it didn't have tons of repeating viewing that is a stupid stament because very few people see a movie more than once in theaters. There was a survey that said that the average movie goer sees 4 films a year max. Think about it I doubt they would see the same film 4 times they would see 4 different films. Even young people can't go see it countless times unless they are loaded with money its not cheap to see a movie you now it cost about 5 bucks just to see a matinee in most places. And I can't believe that you compared TPM's run to Pearl Harbor. Pearl Harbor dropped 50% 2 weeks in a row and it never really did that well after its first weekend. TPM has a 30% drop next weekend which is amazing.
    TPM is in class of summer films like Jurassic Park, Independece Day, Lion King and Shrek. They are all films that had strong legs and had small drop offs, they aren't like Pearl Harbor, The Mummy Returns, Austin Powers 2, Planet of the Apes, etc. Speaking of two of those films both Mummy Returns and Planet of the Apes both destroyed TPM's numbers but the Mummy Returns barly passed 200 and POTA never and will never pass it. That says something right there TPM had a smaller opening then both of them and made twice amount of both them. Finally your arguments are all flawed and I think that is because you are biased and are trying to convice us that TPM was a collossus failure. But you haven't so why don't go bash the film somewhere else I am sure one of the basher threads would love to have you aborad.
  15. Ernest_Rister Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2001
    star 1
    The title of this thread is "Why People Are Not Getting the DVD".

    I'm illustrating why. Its not as popular as you guys want to believe it is.
  16. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    It's not as despised as you think it is either.
  17. Ozzel TF.N Foreign Book Covers Staff

    VIP
    Member Since:
    May 14, 2001
    star 5
    [ironic sarcasm]Wow, Tarzan sold more copies than The Phantom Menace. It must be a better movie. I no longer like the Phantom Menace. I bet no one else does either, nor should they.[/ironic sarcasm]


    And for the record, I have never seen Tarzan. I saw The Phantom Menace 7 times in the theater, and will soon be owning a third copy of it on home video.
  18. C-3P0 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2001
    star 4
    The title of this thread is "Why People Are Not Getting the DVD".

    I'm illustrating why. Its not as popular as you guys want to believe it is.


    So?

    What's wrong with anybody thinking what they like is more popular than it really is? (Not that I'm saying TPM wasn't very successful.)

    You want to prove someone wrong. Why?

    Does it harm you in some way if someone disagrees? Will numbers actually change anybody's opinion on the film? Do you need to feel justified that you are not the only one that didn't completely enjoy TPM?

    I don't go to Highlander boards to prove to them through BO reciepts and VHS sales that the series isn't wildly successful.

    I just don't understand some peoples need to be right.


    Edit: playing with markup codes :)
  19. Riley Man Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 1999
    star 5
    Day 7: 124,723,784 (Wow! Huge number!)
    Day 14: 212,558,695 (Incredible!)
    Day 21: 263,679,744 (over 1/2 of its gross in 21 days!)
    Day 28: 303,061,673 (over 2/3 of its gross in 28 days!)
    Day 35: 332,861,798 (uh-oh! Losing steam!)
    Day 42: 356,021,057 (losing more steam!)
    Day 49: 374,889,918 (where's the love?)
    Day 56: 387,465,405 (the end of eight weeks of release)


    So let's get this straight...
    It's "losing steam" because it "only" made $29M in it's fifth week? And it's losing even more because it "only" made $24M in it's sixth week? And there's no love because it "only" made $18M in it's seventh?

    How many movies do you think make anywhere near that much in their fifth, sixth, and seventh weeks?

    Since you mentioned Sixth Sense, let's take a look at it. It opened on the 6th of August and made $26.7M opening weekend. I'm going by IMDB's list here.
    $176.2M - 5th Sep, 1999
    $197.6M - 12 Sep, 1999
    $213.2M - 19 Sep, 1999
    $225.0M - 26 Sep, 1999

    That's $21M in it's fifth week, $16M in it's sixth, and $12M in it's seventh. And that's being generous since my "fifth" week is actually four days ahead.

    I think the problem you're falling into is seeing the fantastic numbers of TPM early on, and then using ONLY ratios after that. You're not looking at the $20-30M it was still making during its second month. Show me ONE movie in the past three years that made $18M in its seventh week.
  20. Ernest_Rister Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2001
    star 1
    This from someone who claims that Greedo was always supposed to shoot first...even Go-Mer has repented on that line of b.s.

    And by the by...quality and grosses should never be confused. TARZAN made less than MENACE in the theater, but it made more on home video. MENACE made a lot of fast money in theaters, but on homevideo it sold less than half of the units 20th Century Fox predicted. Is TARZAN more well-thought of than MENACE? Can't prove that by numbers. The only thing it proves is that more people wanted TARZAN in the their homes than MENACE.
  21. C-3P0 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2001
    star 4
    This from someone who claims that Greedo was always supposed to shoot first...even Go-Mer has repented on that line of b.s.


    What does this have to do with anything posted in this thread?
  22. MountainMan Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2001
    star 3
    Dude, what the hell is your point, anyway? All this, "TPM was a disappointment because it only made $20 million in its 7th week," bull-sh.. is starting to get really old. Hell, even Lucas was pleasently surprised that the film did as well as it did. According to some reports, he didn't think it would do much more than break even let alone rake in $400 million and hold its own against some extremely stiff competition.

    But the thing is, I think the raw numbers you keep spouting off like they're gospel are being used in a misleading way. First of all, you need to rank The Phantom Menace along with other sci-fi films such as The Matrix, any of the Star Trek films, The Fifth Element or any other prominent sci-fi film in the past few years. Sci-fi is definitely a niche product and Star Wars is a niche in a niche so to compare The Pantom Menace's success to that of films aimed toward the mainstream audience will give skewed results.

    Tarzan was designed to capitilize on parents looking for a safe movie to take their kids to and folks who grew up when the Disney name still meant something. There are a lot of parents out there who love to plop their kids down in front of a TV with some kid safe show on, so it's no surprise that more people would want Tarzan in their home. The Phantom Menace, on the other hand, was definitely meant for Star Wars fans specifically and sci-fi film buffs in general. It was never meant to appeal to the general audience.

    So taking all those factors into account, a niche film that ranks 4th in a summer of big films and is one of the highest grossing films of all time is impressive as hell if you ask me.
  23. jedimaster chris Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 1999
    star 2
    Titantic also didn't have very much competition. On a list on the top 100 grossing movies, the first movie to make that list after Titanic came out was Saving Private Ryan I believe. That came out in July of 98. While Star Wars The Phantom Menace came out in May of 99 and the nearest film to make the top ten list came out in less than a month, which was Austin Powers 2. Star Wars had way more competition. Titanic was free to do what ever it wanted for about 7 months. Summer is a blockbuster time but also a competitive season. TPM did above and beyond with the competition it had to put up with.
  24. Ozzel TF.N Foreign Book Covers Staff

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    Member Since:
    May 14, 2001
    star 5
    George Lucas, from Mr. Showbiz:

    "It was always meant that Greedo fired first. In the original film you don't get that too well. But in terms of Han's character, I didn't like the fact that when he was introduced the first thing he did is just gun somebody down in cold blood. That wasn't what was meant to be there. The other issue is a perception issue. We had three different versions of that shot: one he fires very close to when Han fires, one was three frames later, one was three frames later. And we sort of looked at it and tried to figure out which one would be perceivable, but wouldn't look corny. It's very hard to do that, because, I mean, obviously if you know the film real well and you're looking for that you see it. If you don't know the film very well and you're just watching the movie, it almost goes right by you. People don't perceive what's happened there, even now. So, it's trying to find that medium ground, and it's always this way in film, of what can the majority of the audience perceive and what can't they perceive. I like fast-paced movies--accusations have been made about this--and I like things to go by in an almost surreal way. So I'm caught between doing things that work for me--really understanding the scenes and understanding what's going on--and the audience, which I know is looking at something for the first time, and things go by in a very different way. So, there's always the conflict about where you draw the line. Perhaps I should have done it two frames sooner."

    Who's talking B.S. now, buddy?
  25. Darth23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 1999
    star 4
    Ernest_Rister:

    TPM did NOT make a lot of 'fast money' in the beginning only. TPM peformed better than most big movies (movies grossing over 200 million). There are probably 2 or 3 big movies that had better legs than TPM. Titanic, which performed like no other modern movie, Sixth Sense and Toy Story 1, which had better legs than TPM, but not that much better. More recent films which have had good or even great legs are Gladiator and Shrek, and they faded at the about the same rate as TPM (almost exactly, actually). Which means they had legs, better than most movie released recently.

    You can only put TPM in the same category with Pearl Harbor if you ignore the performance of both movies, or if you really don't understand them.

    Pearl Harbor dropped 49% after a huge opening, and another 50% the weekend after that, then dropped 33, 30, 30, 31, 39, 45, 23, 47, 45 percent. Pearl Harbor made 95% of it's total after 8 weeks (assuming it crawls past 200 million)

    TPM dropped 20% after a big opening, then 36, 22, 26, 25, 5, 43, 24, 25, 18 and 35 percent. Phantom Menace made 89 % of its total after 8 weeks.


    If those drops look the same to you then I don't think there's any hope.

    This for a movie which SHOULD make most of it's money early. After all, it was the most hyped movie of all time. Of course people
    want to see it early. If it only had hype it would have been dropping 40% when it was dropping 20.

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    Sequels usually don't make as much as the first in the series, if they do they have bigger opening and make more money quickly. it's because they are known quantities, have a 'built in audience' and that audience wants to see the movie sooner rather than later. all the movies with better legs than TPM were either the first in a series or had no sequels. (Titanic, Sixth Sense, Lion King and Toy Story 1) They weren't as well known when they first came out, and therefore had to 'find' their audiences.

    Toy Story 2 had a bigger opening and made more money that the original, and it had good legs - but it didn't perform as well as TPM. It managed to drop 50% a few times in its first weeks and had made more if it's total after 8 weeks than TPM (92%) :)


    This whole issue of how much fast money TPM made can't be talked about with out looking at how other big movies performed. As I already stated, there are only a few movies that had a better long term performance that TPM. Perhaps that's your definition of 'legs'. That 3 or 4 movies you can name had them and no other movie in recent history did.

    If you look a little more closely you'll see a definitely differnce between TPM and most of the other big movies.

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