Why should an audience have to

"...licking his tongue all over the fruit of the poor slaves who let him into his house..."

Keep in mind the nature of the Gungan tongue. His senses of taste and smell are probably connected (moreso than humans') to the point where he can probably smell with his tongue just like certain lizards. Have you ever seen a lizard or a snake flick their tongue? It's because they're tasting the air.

 

<<You do know that the Gungans would have been wiped out completely if Jar Jar hadn't helped convince them to join the Naboo people, don't you?>>

Would they? They had a "grand army". Yes, I know they almost lost the battle of Naboo, but its my opinion that that the reason for that was due to his "leadership" skills. Perhaps if Captain Tarpals had been in command of the Gungan army, they would have been able to defeat the droids.

 

Tell that to Bruce Campbell! He's a master of physical comedy (as is Ahmed Best).

Um, okay, you've stumped me, Havoc. Are you agreeing or disagreeing with me?

 

Heh heh, move along folks...

Nothing to see here...

I never double post, you know...

 

Bruce Campbell's physical comedy style fits the movies he is cast in. They were written with a humourus theme.

Jar Jar was not the featured character. However, his bungling stick out so bad, he might jsut well be the main character.

 

Why should we tolerate? Well, it's kinda' like a family, see? And SW have always been films for the entire family. Just because one of your uncles makes fart jokes and gets a bit too drunk and rowdy during Thanksgiving doesn't mean you can't enjoy your meal, right?

Well...l guess it depends where he farts.

 

<<"...licking his tongue all over the fruit of the poor slaves who let him into his house..."

Keep in mind the nature of the Gungan tongue. His senses of taste and smell are probably connected (moreso than humans') to the point where he can probably smell with his tongue just like certain lizards. Have you ever seen a lizard or a snake flick their tongue? It's because they're tasting the air. >>

That doesn't excuse him from slobbering all over their food!!!!

 

It isn't that an audience member has to tolerate an annoying character, as much as an audience member should learn why they would want to tolerate an annoying character.

As you mature and learn about the benefits of a "symbiant" life style over the drawbacks of a purely selfish one, you realize that tolerance is good for everyone not just the character (or person as the case may be) being tolerated.

 

Okay that's better, just by the way Gomer 1 Kenobi is me too.

 

I like how some see things in SW as some sort of morality lesson. I mean, you can make anything mean whatever you want for you in life: if you get a green light on the way to work, then you can make that out to mean that you're going to get a lot of phone calls... I'm not stopping you.

I'll concede that while GL is telling his story, he might toss in some snippets of his own belief system (I'd find myself doing the same), but I agree with Darth_Smeagol in that Lucas probably didn't create him to be annoying to club us across the head with an abstract lesson. You can THINK that if you want, I guess. Make it to work for ya. Lucas stated himself that Jar Jar was put in to be funny.

I won't mention (here) whether that "funny" intent failed for me or not, but I think the annoying aspect of Jar Jar is peeps' reaction to him, not design.

Well...l guess it depends where he farts.

Darth_Corleone, exactly. Yes, your analogy to TPM is QUITE apt. Restraint and control and consideration indeed!

 

And of course you don't have to think anything if you don't want to.

George has also stated that Jar-Jar was meant to be a commentary on the way we tend to treat our children here on Earth. He said we tend to ignore them until they reach a magic "of age" milestone like turning 18 (or in Jar-Jar's case, bringing the Gungans and the Naboo together), at which point everyone sudenly expects them to be able handle all the responsibilities of being an adult (or in Jar-Jar's case having him suddenly lead the entire Gungan Grand Army into battle as a Bombad General).

But don't let any of that get in the way of your only seeing Jar-Jar as being there to make the kids laugh if that's all you want to see in him.

 

And of course you don't have to think anything if you don't want to.

That is correct, Gomer. I knew that was coming, but it is a good point nonetheless. I'd buy you a beer if you were here.

Pressured into as many questions as the media forced upon him about TPM in general, Lucas has had to give answers that observation tells me he did not intend to elaborate so much upon, not just about Jar Jar. Jar Jar was a huge controversy, and I can well imagine GL not wanting to appear as the stammering, apologetic Creator of Star Wars when the media hounds started their questions. Gotta come up with something!

But don't let any of that get in the way of your only seeing Jar-Jar as being there to make the kids laugh if that's all you want to see in him.

Will do.

 

I just think if George is crafty enough to come up with something like that on the fly, he would learn to have come up with it from the get go so he isn't caught stammering for "good reasons" for characters everyone seems to hate.

 

Perhaps. Could go either way, I admit. He is only human though, so it's probable that he doesn't foresee all the stuff that will get thrown at him thanks to his wildly popular films that he never intended to be so successful. He's just one man with a really good idea and a cool imagination (plus the will to do it).

 

Sure but do you really think he would only think of making Jar-Jar funny? Considering the way there weren't any superflous main characters in the original trilogy, it makes more sense to me that George isn't into things that are merely cosmetic.

To me it makes much more sense that he thinks of good reasons for what he does, even if he doesn't tell us about those reasons with the first film in the trilogy.

But on the other hand, there are many "meanings" to be found in the saga that George never conciously intended, but which naturally occur on their own, especially when you are making a "mythology".

 

You have to sometimes entertain the possibility that Lucas makes mistakes, even big ones like Jar Jar. To believe he made a reason behind everything from Jar Jar to Maul's glued horns is absurd.

 

And sometimes you have to entertain the possibility that George comes up with some well thought out things like Jar-Jar.

Since you brought it up, the reason Maul has horns had to do with a conscious effort to make him look like many culture's depictions of evil, most of which have horns.

To believe George doesn't have any reason for doing what he does is much more absurd in my mind.

I mean really Hawk, how many things have you done for no reason what so ever?

 

<<It isn't that an audience member has to tolerate an annoying character, as much as an audience member
should learn why they would want to tolerate an annoying character.

As you mature and learn about the benefits of a "symbiant" life style over the drawbacks of a purely selfish
one, you realize that tolerance is good for everyone not just the character (or person as the case may be)
being tolerated. >>



But there's nothing "symbiant" about Jar-Jar's life style. He leeches off of people whenever he gets the chance!!!!! Qui-Gon, Anakin, Shmi, Boss Nass .....


Maybe I should tolerate and become best friends with people I can't stand because, if I'm being robbed, they might try to run away and abandon me, but end up tripping and running into the robber. This distracts the robber, and causes him to accidently fire the gun into his face.


Makes sense.

 

Yeah but he's just a kid really.

 

LOL, DarthTorgo! As improbable and ridiculous a situation as that is, it FITS some of the antics to which you are really referring...

 

<<Yeah but he's just a kid really>>

No, he's not. You can see Gungan kids in the movie, if you look closely, and they are nowhere near as tall as Jar-Jar. So my conclusion is that Jar-Jar was dropped on the head as a baby. And even all but the youngest of kids know certain things, like the fact that stealing is wrong. And most kids don't act that stupid, or aren't that cowardly. And if he was a kid, wouldn't there be something wrong with Qui-Gon taking him with everywhere? Isn't that like kidnapping and taking advantage of people? And if he was just a kid really, why would he become commander of his army? Who would have a kid become a commander like that? Of course, this is the same planet where they elect 14 year old girl as queen.

 

He is at that awkward age where he doesn't look like a little kid, but on the inside he still is. Mostly because he had nobody around to teach him anything.

1) If he were dropped on the head, is that a good enough reason to hate him?

2) When did he steal something? If you mean the lizard in the market, he didn't understand the concept of commerce. The Gungans pretty much banded together and shared everything, so money wasn't an issue, and like I said, he had nobody to teach him the ways of the galaxy. He saw a lizard hanging, noticed others eating them too, and figured you just grabed one if you wanted it. That's how he survived on his own in the swamps for quite a while.

3) I also figured that even kids understood that you can't blame someone for something that isn't their fault.

 

<<He is at that awkward age where he doesn't look like a little kid, but on the inside he still is. Mostly because he had nobody around to teach him anything. >>


Or maybe he's too stupid to learn anything. In fact, most of the stuff he doesn't "know", he has no reason for not "knowing" it. For example, unless the Gungans are communists, there would be no reason for him to understand the concept that YOU SHOULDN'T TAKE THINGS THAT DON'T BELONG TO YOU.

<<1) If he were dropped on the head, is that a good enough reason to hate him? >>

If I have to watch a movie about him that doesn't make me feel sorry for him, then yes. Actually, Jar-Jar is supposed to be "funny" in Episode I, so maybe what Lucas was trying to teach us that it is OK to laugh at people who suffer from afflictions such as that. Isn't there something wrong with that?? I guess if you want to be PC about things, then Episode I is wrong because it teaches us that it's OK to laugh at people because they are different. I mean, if it is OK for me to laugh at him because of that, then it is just as OK for me to hate him because of that. Think about that.

Or maybe we are supposed to hate Jar-Jar, you know. Maybe he's a commentary on the anti-intellectualism of American society. Think about the fact that he is "rewarded" for his stupidity, and in fact, ends up getting in charge of everything so he can screw up and waste the lives of all his people.

<<2) When did he steal something? If you mean the lizard in the market, he didn't understand the concept of commerce. The Gungans pretty much banded together and shared everything, so money wasn't an issue, and like I said, he had nobody to teach him the ways of the galaxy. He saw a lizard hanging, noticed others eating them too, and figured you just grabed one if you wanted it. That's how he srvived on his own in the swamps for quite a while. >>


So Jar-Jar is a communist. Man, I'll bet Havoc Hound is going to love that.

<<3) I also figured that even kids understood that you can't blame someone for something that isn't his fault.
>>

Those kids also often laugh at Jar-Jar. So if I can't blame Jar-Jar for being mentally defective, as you say, then these kids also shouldn't be laughing at it. Interesting. It's okay to make fun of Jar-Jar, but not to hate him. Besides, I believe comparing Jar-Jar to a mentally disabled person to be insulting and demeaning to that person. Even they show more caring and comittment and intelligence than Jar-Jar does in Episode I.

 

Darth Torgo: "Or maybe he's too stupid to learn anything. In fact, most of the stuff he doesn't "know", he has no reason for not "knowing" it. For example, unless the Gungans are communists, there would be no reason for him to understand the concept that YOU SHOULDN'T TAKE THINGS THAT DON'T BELONG TO YOU.

Go-Mer: Well if they were would you lay off the poor guy?

 

Go-Mer,

Do me a favour and look inside yourself. Imagine a Lucas who tried very hard to make a comical character, fully rendered in CGI. Picture him believing the character would not be hated and that he would be the main comedy relief for TPM. Then picture the audience cringing at Jar Jar and Lucas thinking he have made an error. You said it yourself, George is only human. Let him be human. Take a deep breath and realise that in your world, where everything in TPM was planned and even the REACTION was planned, this world does not make sense. It is placing Lucas a a God-Like figure. Maybe if you occasionally allowed yourself to let go and believe there are mistakes in the films (with acting, characters and effects not glued horns!) you may see things in a more rational, objective way. As it stands, almost every new member comes along and is shocked at your worship of SW. It's just unreal the lengths you will go sometimes and a little creepy.