Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII and Beyond (Archive)' started by stellarmagic01, Nov 5, 2012.
And I think you're argumentative just to be argumentative.
Just to be argumentative? You made a statement and I responded. Disagreeing with you isn't being argumentative.
If nobody has any actual discussion to contribute beyond personal sniping and random discussion of plot elements in the EU, I'm going to lock this. Y'all have the rest of the day to actually come up with a coherent discussion.
Okay, an actual discussion... I can do that.
I've struggled since creating this thread to articulate exactly how I feel on the subject of Episode VII and it's relationship to the Expanded Universe as well as how I view the Expanded Universe itself. In my mind there are vast portions of the Expanded Universe that really are not worth much, they're pulpy novels meant to be consumed by a Star Wars craving public, but like any form of public or popular fiction we have occasional occurrences where the stories have risen beyond just being a 'Star Wars fix' if you will and are readable as popular entertainment. These books have a longevity and following that is only partially derived from the STAR WARS title emblazoned on their cover.
In any restart, reboot, retcon, or realignment of the Expanded Universe following Episode VII there's a great deal to be gained from the inclusion of those titles, at least at some level, and therefore allowing more books to be written along that storyline and featuring those characters. Those books are as follows: The X-wing Series, Jedi Academy Trilogy and it's companion work I, Jedi, and the Zahn Novels... which create a set of interwoven and interconnected stories that work well as a body on their own.
For those of us that are fans of the Expanded Universe, a distortion, or significant contradiction of those specific works is extremely painful. If Episode VII arrives and Luke is never married for example, people will be angry. Doubly so if Luke gives an anti-attachment speech.
The fans of the New Jedi Order books and their follow ups are a subset that is different. Many of us that started reading in the Bantam era were disappointed with the direction Del Rey took, and at times offended by the changing characterizations of the people in the stories as time went on. While individual stories were at times quite nice reads, they didn't form as cohesive a whole, and sometimes caused the whole series to feature characterization whiplash or schizophrenia.
I know there are fans that are very enamored with those stories, relationships, and characterizations, but... I do not see them standing the test of time commercially -or- being integrated into the background for Episode VII. As a result I will not be surprised if the 25 ABY to 45 ABY is rendered N-canon or at the very least massively reworked and retconned with the approach of the next film. I will not grieve it's loss, so long as the writers that did the best work remain, you can probably expect those characters and relationships to survive the sea-change that Episode VII represents. The exact circumstances, storylines, and events may change, but honestly I think most of us care more about the characters then specific events.
And that is probably how it should be.
Sorry to distill what you said down to one sentence, but this more than anything captured how I feel about the EU and what's coming with the ST. I've prepared myself for big chunks of what I read to be declared AU or whatever, and I certainly want the movies to be the best they can be - and if that means losing a big chunk of the EU, so be it.
I mostly read the EU to get more of the characters I had come to love in the OT and then in the EU world created around them - and that's what I'd like to see embraced in the ST.
Add in the Corellian Trilogy (despite it calling all ship-weapons 'Turbolasers') and I would agree with you -- the superweapon of the week and Solo-child kidnap of the month were (IMO) quite overdone as plot-lines. How do you stand on the YJK and JJK series, though, which you have not mentioned; and which seem to have some following of their own? Ditto, Shadows of Mindor, which also seems quite favoured?
As Del Rey is a commercial organisation, I can't see them having stuck with a formula that was doing less than breaking-even (or even just slightly better than breaking even, without prompt adjustment) in terms of sales; and yet they authorised a Trilogy and two complete nine-book arcs to follow NJO -- all of it in the same vein -- and reportedly are attracing members of the teenage age-group into the EU to join up with the older readers that have not been disappointed with the new 'feel' of the Galaxy. I used to work as assistant to a Distribution Manager, so I know that absolutely everything gets planned out year-by-year; and ths plans are later compared to the budgeted figures. If lines are not doing as well as, or better, than the sales-plan then there is always a high-level rethink; and usually changes, ranging from the minor to the more dramatic.
Frankly, I feel that those who do not like the Del Rey era have no more right to suggest that those 41 books should be declared N-Canon than the Del Rey readership has to suggest that the Bantam era (which the teenagers are reported to dislike) should be so declared. Either, in my view, would be a form of censorship, based on subjective personal opinion.
I did like the YJK and JJK series... and my enjoyment of those is partly why I really dislike what happened with Jaina and Jacen in the NJO and what followed.
Censorship? I don't understand that position Tim. I can see that you're rather devoted to the NJO stories and so forth, but asking around my circle of friends that are Star Wars fans gives me the impression that the number of people that are fans of the current direction of the universe is rather small, I don't know anyone personally that enjoyed Dark Nest, Legacy of the Force, or Fate of the Jedi, heck more people I know like the Legacy comics more then those lines.
Ultimately it doesn't matter if Del Rey hit their sales figures... because it's not their decision what the shape of the EU will be when Episode VII hits. They won't even have the license anymore at that point... they won't care. It'll be up to the people at LFL to reconcile the EU with Episode VII and I see no possible way for those works you're a fan of continuing to be accepted as they are into the continuity when George is so closely working with Kennedy as a Creative Consultant.
It simply isn't going to happen... I'm sorry. It's their call, not yours, not mine, but theirs.
Anyway, my case in neither pro-EU or anti-EU: it's pro-reality. The new films will not pander to the EU continuity; they will largely adhere to Lucas' vision for the sequels, and so it's really anyone's guess as to how closely they'll align to the EU. But the closer you get to ~40 years ABY, the harder it'll be to patch-over inconsistencies between the films and the EU, which is a big reason why Thrawn is much more likely to survive over the NJO. There comes a point where retcons become egregious, and TPTB will most likely ditch NJO/Legacy wholesale rather than deal with the ensuing mess that the inconsistencies will bring.
This is not censorship. Get real.
I can't see that wholesale binning of recent works will go down well with the people who do enjoy them, either. There may well be a considerable backlash -- we have to remember that the deaths of fictional characters provoked death threats (I hope to goodness that Lucas Kennedy et al. have remembered that too). Guns and disgruntled and/or obsessed fans aren't a good combination, are they? Remember Reagan?
I would not get to that level (and I live in the UK anyway) but who knows what a less-than-stable US citizen might choose to do?
I think you really are jumping the gun here. No pun intended.
"We live in a real world. Come back to it." - Padme Amidala
Wellll yeah. This thread just went crazy dumb. Locking.