PT Why weren't more Jedi sent to face Darth Maul?

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by Darth Weavile, Oct 12, 2017.

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  1. Darth Weavile Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 2017
    I never got why the Council didn't decide to send more than Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan to investigate and capture Darth Maul. We know Qui-Gon (correctly) believed that he was a Sith Lord, and that it concerned the council. So why not send some (or all) the council members to go to Naboo?

    Can you imagine Maul opening the door and seeing not just Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan, but also Yoda, Windu, Ki-Adi, etc? It's not like the council had anything better to do, as they all were present on Coruscant and visited Naboo after the battle.

    Why didn't the Jedi take more action? You could say overconfidence, but this seems like common sense. Did they not believe Qui-Gon? No doubt he probably survives if they sent more help.
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  2. darkspine10 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 7, 2014
    star 5
    Maybe they just expected Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan enough to deal with the possible Sith threat. Additionally, Padme's return isn't directly supported by the Senate, she's doing it on her own,so perhaps the Jedi don't want to be seen to act to forcefully in this issue, so as not to alienate themselves from the Senate.
  3. Martoto77 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2016
    star 4
    Good question. In a period of peace, you'd think that they could have afforded to send more Jedi to learn as much as possible. Not just one Master who is at odds with the council about the mission and other developments arising from their escape already.

    No living Jedi has experience of the Sith. It seems daft that they just send the two Jedi to possibly face an assailant that was not afraid to engage them. If Obi Wan hadn't pulled off his miracle jump then the Jedi would have been completely in the dark about the emergence of the Sith. (Although by destroying him the moment he reappeared it's a puzzlement what they could have learned on Naboo that they didn't glean from their encounter on Tatooine, after which they were skeptical about him possibly being a Sith.)
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  4. Darth Dnej Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2013
    star 4
    This is a question I always wondered about. It simply comes down to the Jedi not having the foresight to make the logical choice, and also being confined to the Galactic Senate. The Senate didn't seem to want much involvement in Naboo, after all.
    I say...send Saesee Tinn to help the Naboo pilots, Oppo Rancisis to help with the Gungan strategy, and Dooku to go to the palace with Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan.
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  5. Erkan12 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 27, 2013
    star 4
    Good question indeed, but the things are not always as simple as they looked.

    First of all, they didn't know if Sith has returned or not for %100. They didn't believe Qui-Gon at first. As Mundi says, Sith has been destroyed 1000 years ago. Mace was overconfident that they should've known if the Sith returns. Or maybe they didn't want to believe the possibility.

    And if they would send a crowded Jedi strike team to Naboo, just because Qui-Gon suspects that it was the Sith, that would seem insecure and confused to the public. That wouldn't send a good message to the people and the senate. They would think that Jedi council are afraid and they know something and not saying to the people. That's what I would think if I would see a large group of Jedi knights are going to the Naboo, just because of a rumor.
  6. Martoto77 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2016
    star 4

    But the Jedi are also recognised as Ambassadors. Negotiators. They don't have strike teams (that comes later when they allow themselves to be installed as warriors).

    More ambassadors, more perspective. Shows that the Republic is taking what's happening on Naboo seriously. Not that they are hiding something.

    The Jedi would know they've got better protection than they had on Tatooine, where the possible Sith was not afraid to attack them out in the open.

    At this point, the Jedi don't seem to need much of a mandate from the senate to do anything.
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  7. Darkslayer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2013
    star 6
    I think the Council didn't really believe Qui-Gon when he said he was attacked by a Sith.
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  8. Samuel Vimes Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    I don't think so.

    First, if they send 5-6 Jedi instead of just two, one of whom was not even a Knight.
    How would the public know about it?
    Do the Jedi give press-conferences every time they go on missions?
    Would the senate know?
    It appears that the senate didn't know about the two Jedi sent to Naboo at the start of the film.

    The public/senate might find out after the mission is over. But if the missions ends with success, why would that make the Jedi look bad? And if it fails and all the Jedi die, then that is bad on multiple levels.

    And why would the Jedi sending several jedi make them look bad if we assume that the public finds out?
    Naboo has been invaded by the TF and the senate has shown itself utterly incapable to do anything about it. It refuses to even admit that an invasion has taken place.
    So the Jedi decide to act and do somethng about and stop the TF's ruthless and illegal invasion.
    In the eye of the public, the Jedi would look pretty good.
    The senate is powerless and ruined by corruption and abandons a helpless system to a powerful attacker. But the Jedi refuse to allow this injustice and act on their own.

    The senate might not like it, as it makes their inaction look even worse.

    As for what they knew.
    They doubted Qui-Gon sure but they did believe him enough to order him to go back there and find Maul.
    Mace said they would use ALL their resources to unravel this mystery.
    So ALL resources apparently is one jedi master and one padawan?

    Add to this, the Jedi KNOW what the TF has done. Unlike the senate, they don't doubt that the TF has attacked and invaded Naboo. In effect declaring war on the republic.
    And they also know that the senate has shown itself unable to do anything about it.
    Shouldn't that worry them?
    The TF has a battle hardened army while the republic has no soldiers.
    And the TF has just shown itself to act very differently than they had before and with far more daring and boldness.
    Plus there is the possibility that they are allied with the Jedi's worst enemy, the sith.

    If this is not a "All hands on deck" situation, what would be?

    The TF could attack other planets for all they know.
    So stopping them is pretty vital, not just for Naboo but for other worlds as well.
    The Jedi are the protectors of the republic and the republic is under attack, shouldn't they act?

    No, this bit, like so many others, are because the plot demands it.
    It makes little sense and makes the jedi seem clueless and dimwitted.
    And makes the plot contrived.

    Bye for now.
    Old Stoneface
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  9. Qui-Riv-Brid Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 2013
    star 5
    I don't see why they would.

    They didn't know Maul was a Sith like Qui-Gon thought he was nor did they think Anakin was the Chosen One regardless of his midi-chlorian count and obvious Force potential.

    The Jedi can't fight a war for the Queen of Naboo. That isn't what they do. It's already been established in TPM that even sending 2 Jedi as Ambassadors at all is a pretty extreme thing at that point. Send a bunch of Jedi in that environment when the Senate has yet to determine if there actually has even been an invasion in the first place is a no go.

    No. That simply isn't how the Jedi do things. It takes something truly extreme and galaxy shaking for them to do that. As in AOTC. For this minor dispute they simply are not going to do that. No one can know this is all just to get Palpaltine the secret Sith Lord into power. Now if it had been declared by the Senate that there was an invasion then that is another thing entirely. That didn't happen though.

    They have tons of other things to do. This is just another one. After the battle on Naboo then it's clearly been established to the Senate that there was an invasion and that the warrior was a Sith and this leads to taking Anakin into the Jedi Order.

    They clearly did not believe Qui-Gon. He might be correct or maybe not. What needs to be appreciated (and is seen right in the movie) is to tell the Jedi that the Sith have returned after 1000 years and oh by the way this kid is the Chosen One (how convenient since that ties into the prophecy) is like saying "The sky is falling." or the boy who cried wolf.

    It's clearly established that Qui-Gon is the outsider Jedi who doesn't play by the dogmatic rules. He is the way the Jedi should be one can argue but not the way they are which is the entire point of the way it's presented.

    This ties into the whole other thread where people asked why did Qui-Gon take Anakin to Naboo? The answer is that is what Qui-Gon does. Why did he go to Tatooine in the first place? Why pick up Jar Jar and other "pathetic" life-forms as Obi-Wan calls them? Why let their fates be decided by this boy in a pod race? Why think that he is the Chosen One? Why think that this dark warrior is a Sith? Like there is no possibility of another being strong in the Force using a Lightsaber? Of course if you beleive Anakin is the Chosen One then leaping to the conclusion of a Sith return makes perfect sense.

    Who is happy with various decisions of Qui-Gon in TPM? Not Obi-Wan, Padme, Panaka or the Jedi.
    Last edited by Qui-Riv-Brid, Oct 12, 2017
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  10. Alexrd Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2009
    star 5
    They didn't. They sent two Jedi to discover the identity of a 'dark warrior'.

    We know, the Council didn't. The Council didn't saw what we saw.

    Of course they had things to do. They are the Jedi Council. They oversee all of the order's tasks and operations. To go to a Jedi funeral hardly means they had nothing better to do.
    Last edited by Alexrd, Oct 12, 2017
  11. Martoto77 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2016
    star 4
  12. Kenneth Morgan Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 27, 1999
    star 5
    Their overconfidence was their weakness, and Palpatine took advantage of it.
  13. Martoto77 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2016
    star 4
    It if wasn't for Anakin then Palpatine's plan to tear the senate apart would have succeeded much sooner.
  14. gezvader28 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2003
    star 5
    did they know that Maul was on Naboo at this point tho ?
  15. Darth Weavile Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 2017
    Well, they knew he was after the Queen, and the Queen was going back to Naboo.
  16. Darth Sin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 14, 1999
    star 5
    For me, whether they believed Qui-Gon or not, the fact that he told them that this individual was well trained in the Jedi arts should at the least gotten there attention. The fact that Qui-Gon as a Master Jedi recognized this fact, the Jedi should have at least better considered it could be a Sith. I am thinking they would have some idea of a rogue Jedi running around. So if it is not a former Jedi, who could it be.

    And by the way, even a rogue Jedi attacking them should have alarmed them to the point to possibly send a separate investigation of this "mysterious warrior!" Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan already had their hands full protecting Queen and all that was going on with the Trade Federation. The Jedi were like a type of space police. So they should have at least sent a "back up squad" to Naboo to try and investigate and encounter the possible Sith. I don't see how this would have been seen inappropriate for 2-3 Jedi coming. They could have said what Anakin said in AOTC, "Jedi Business!" If there were any remote possibilities of the Sith's return, or a dark rogue Jedi running around attacking anyone, especially Jedi Knights, they should NOT have disregarded Qui-Gon's assessment.
  17. Qui-Riv-Brid Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 2013
    star 5
    If they had sent a whack of Jedi every time there was a problem then he would not have had to plan so hard for AOTC!

    Hence sending him to Naboo with the Queen:

    MACE WINDU : Now is not the time for this...the Senate is voting for a new Spreme Chancellor. Queen Amidala is returning home, which will put pressure on the Federation, and could widen the confrontation.
    YODA : And draw out the Queen's attacker.
    KI-ADI : Events are moving fast...too fast.
    MACE WINDU : Go with the Queen to Naboo and discover the identity of the dark warrior. That is the clue we need to unravel this mystery of the Sith.
    Last edited by Qui-Riv-Brid, Oct 13, 2017
  18. The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2012
    star 4
    1. Politics. - The Jedi were afraid that a substantial presence on Naboo would make it appear that they were taking sides in a conflict that wasn't approved by the Senate.
    2. Arrogance. - Perhaps Qui-Gon wasn't specific enough in his description of the skirmish, but Maul nearly killed him. To think that there isn't a significant chance of him or Obi-Wan dying in battle against a possible Sith?? Screams of Jedi superiority and arrogance.

    That doesn't answer his query. You're just rewording what he said.
    Last edited by The Supreme Chancellor, Oct 14, 2017
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  19. williamjj666 Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jan 8, 2016
    posting here for the first time...
    its an interesting question..but throughout the prequel trilogy the jedi were being outsmarted at every point, and they were overconfident, rigid and prone to do stupid things..so just one of the stupid things in the long list.
    Last edited by williamjj666, Oct 14, 2017
  20. gezvader28 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 22, 2003
    star 5
    but they wouldn't expect Maul to know this .
    Also - if the Jedi send more jedis it would look like they were going to fight for the Naboo , in effect taking a side which politically they mustn't do .
  21. Master Endz-One Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2017
    star 1
    The Council probably didn't want the public to know it interfered in the conflict on behalf of Naboo. It was a secret mission for a reason. They also didn't want anyone to bring too much attention, due to the fact they wanted to keep the Sith hidden. Last time the Sith arrived a giant War erupted.
  22. The_Phantom_Calamari Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2011
    star 4
    They didn't really think it was a Sith. They basically just wanted Qui-Gon to go with the Queen and use the opportunity to apprehend her attacker, so that he could figure out who he was (probably not a Sith) without blowing everything up into a bigger deal than it needed to be. They severely underestimated the situation.
  23. Erkan12 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 27, 2013
    star 4
    Of course they don't make a press conference. Why do you think they need one to understand? What do you think they will do when they arrive Naboo? Protect the queen. That's what Qui-Gon did. If they send a Jedi team there, it means they will also protect the queen, because without doing that there is no point in going there since Maul was after the queen. So, the people and the senate will learn it quickly when the Jedi team arrived Naboo, because they can't do their job without guarding the queen. So I am not sure why did you forget this obvious and important part of the mission. That's not about hunting a rogue warrior, this is about protecting someone who is a politician.

    Why would the council send a Jedi team because of the unseen TF invasion? They need the senate's approval for that. They are working for the senate and their loyalty is for the senate. That's how the Jedi order works. Jedi order sends a large group of Jedi at the Geonosia because the senate approved before that. The senate didn't say anything about Naboo and there wasn't any evidence for them to say that's an invasion yet. So not sure why you also ignored this fact.
  24. Alexrd Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2009
    star 5
    No, it's reminding the fact that the Jedi didn't know who the dark warrior was. And even assuming he was a Sith, the two Jedi that were sent were enough to handle him.
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  25. Rickleo123 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 20, 2016
    star 2
    It's not like Qui-Gon was some mook 2nd rate Jedi Knight with little experience. He was a master who was on the level of the other members of the Council. I mean to them it was as if they were sending one of the best duelists in the order to apprehend the "dark warrior." They had confidence in his skill along with Obi Wan as a promising padawan. If Qui-Gon felt the threat was warranted I'm sure he would have asked for more reinforcements.
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