ST Will the Force Awakens unite Star Wars fans?

You expect to like the new movies but condemn anyone who may not find flaws in them? Yeah, 'we' hate Lucas - that first film, previously called Star Wars was an awful movie! Us Lucas haters all think you secretly want to add The Raiders of the Lost Ark and American Graffiti to Star Wars canon because we know both parties lack any kind of independent critical thinking faculties whatsoever and all correspond to a select few stereotypes.

 

I'll say one thing: I'm sitting here watching ROTS and if Episode 7 is as good as this I'll be impressed.

 

Watched AOTC the other day. Still love it.

 

I find that I watch AOTC and ESB the most, probably because they are the middle films. Kinda like the cream filling.

I like ROTS, but I don't watch it a lot because it's too depressing. If I watch it, I almost immediately watch ANH after so I get cheered up.

Another reason I hope the ST isn't a depress fest. Like killing Han and Chewie. Blowing up the Falcon. Heck, that's enough to cause a divide there! I mean who would be happy the Falcon blows up?

 

More films will mean a further dilution of the brand. What set Star Wars apart for so many years was that the franchise wasn't owned by a studio. Otherwise the brand would have been diluted long ago. In my opinion, that's where the division between the younger PT fans and the older OT fans stems from. For a lot of fans of my generation, the Star Wars prequels are the equivalent of digitally adding a CGI shark into Speilberg's JAWS. The PT invaded a precious negative space that our imaginations had spent 16 years sowing. The beauty of the OT is that it suggested a larger world beyond the boundaries of the frame. For me the PT dealt a significant blow to my overall enthusiasm for Star Wars and a good ST might go a long way in repairing said trauma.

 

In 1978, Lucasfilm were promising 12 more films in the years to come. It wasn't some high-mindedness that kept it from happening but rather Lucas personally burning out.

 

I have a feeling that the overall sentiment regarding TFA will be positive... at first. There will be a lot of people primed to love it because simply because it's unlike the PT. Upon release I think it will be hailed in the media as the return of the real Star Wars, and along with the praise will come a lot of jabs at the PT. This will of course anger some other fans, who let it fuel their own negative reactions against the ST and the people who praise it.

But eventually the newness will wear off and more people will realize it's just a movie, and one made by a fairly mediocre filmmaker to boot. The flaws (which all of them have btw) will become more apparent, and some people will start focusing on those. I'm guessing this won't take root among the general population, but at least among a subset of fans who initially thought it was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

The thing is, everyone is going into this thing with some kind of bias. I know what biases I have (I love GL, not so much JJ, and Disney scares me a bit), and although I plan on giving it a fair chance, I know there's a distinct possibility that it just won't provide what I want from a Star Wars movie. And you know what? That's ok. Star Wars is a magnificent saga, but I don't have to love every part of it equally.

Ultimately I think I'll be content just to not dislike the overall style and narrative of this trilogy so much that I can't accept it as a part of that saga. And even if that does end up being the case, oh well. I still have six movies that make up a pretty darn good story on their own, so I can just as easily live happily in my bubble with those and disregard the rest. And of course, whatever I think of this trilogy, you can be sure I will own them, so maybe after a while they would end up growing on me anyway. So really, even in the worst case scenario, it all works out ok.

But I suppose I'm digressing somewhat from the question, to which I must answer with an unequivocal no. I consider myself a fairly reasonable fan, and I've already illustrated how my biases are likely to influence my feelings, which admittedly do run strong at times. But I'm able to adapt, although we all know many fans aren't so reasonable or adaptable. So if anything, I think the ST will unfortunately only create new divisions among fans, which have the potential to be more heated and hostile than ever. But I think that has to be expected in this day and age regardless.

 

Yeah I know, that wasn't my point. My point was just that the gap between trilogies created a chasm that is unique to the Star Wars franchise. The fact that George owned the franchise allowed him the latitude to "burn out", and for the franchise to wait until he was ready again. A studio would have kept going without him.

 

I actually believe, had the PT been released in, say, 1989-95 (which I think was the original plan) things would have been a lot different for a few reasons. 1) the creative momentum of the OT would have continued, 2) Lucas would have had less time to reconceptualise the PT and yes, 3) we wouldn't have had as much time to fill in the blanks. I suspect that the gap really did have a big impact all 'round.

 

Yeah I'm with you on that. Maybe the real blame is on Marcia Lucas.

 

No.

Where much of this thread seems to boil down to fans insisting that "fans" hate on this or that aspect of the franchise just because those people are just generally awful and have to hate on everything, Star Wars, and indeed every fandom, has people who will, for most purposes, embrace everything associated with it. Their identity is tied up so much in being a fan, they experience a negative emotional reaction to any criticism to the thing they're a fan of, no matter how rational, valid, or well supported. It all must be dismissed as the work of haters: "If you hate it so much ... blah blah blah blah." Fandoms are filled with people who claim to welcome "constructive criticism" yet have never come across a piece of criticism they consider constructive.

Sports fandoms make this obvious: there are people who will even physically fight others that insult "their team," even if that team is terrible by objective measures like statistics and wins and losses. If you've ever felt like punching somebody "through the monitor" for saying something negative about Star Wars, you're probably this kind of fan. The thing you're a fan of is part of your identity, and any criticism of it is experienced as a criticism of you.

When the commercial reviews for TFA start coming out, gushing reviews will be characterized by half of the Star Wars fandom as fair, balanced, and objective ... a validation of what they "knew" all along: the ST is going to be totally awesome. Every single review that points out the negatives of TFA will be identified as the work of somebody who doesn't get Star Wars, hates Star Wars, hates Abrams, didn't really pay attention to the movie, or was even paid off by "competitors."

On the other hand, every fandom also has fans who recognize and accept the thing they're a fan of as imperfect and feel that, in so doing, they are recognizing that their appreciation comes in spite of or even transcends those imperfections. I can be turned off by and critical of certain storytelling shortcuts I feel greatly compromise the PT while still feeling that the PT positively expanded the Star Wars setting and inspired me to explore more of it through the EU. I do not find these apparently incompatible points of view incompatible at all. Yet the former makes me, to many Star Wars fans, a hater.

That's why there will never be peace in the fandom. Fans like me will probably enjoy plenty of the ST, but we will ever view it through the lens of our own tastes and sensibilities. Where we find it violates them, we will not -- and will not feel the need to -- bury our displeasure because it conflicts with the overall enjoyment we get from the franchise or ruins the fun of everybody who needs the ST to be awesome in every way.

Only objective greatness can briefly unite these two halves of a fandom, the equivalent of winning the Super Bowl in American Football. Since there is no objective measure of greatness when it comes to movies, there is no chance the two halves of the Star Wars fandom will ever be united except perhaps in line outside the theater on opening night.

 

ender2k Amen brother!

 

A united Star Wars fandom? Let me answer that with the only reasonable answer. . . .

 

ender2k

That somehow still sounds way more one-sided than it should be.

You make it sound like those who love "everything" are at fault (which is wrong in the first place, because those who defend something don't automatically love everything, on the contrary, they are usually the ones who see the flaws and are just sick of certain people bash endlessly) while the others are just saying what is on their mind. That has little to do with what is actually happening. What you actually have, is a silent majority who couldn't care either way. Then you have a lot of hardcore fans who see hardly any flaw at all, and they usually keep to themselves and don't try to convince other people of how awesome they feel something is, unless they are provoked/challenged by people who hate it, in which case they will defend the thing they love to the very end. Then you have a lot of "haters", who go out of their way to force their opinion on others, regardless of whether it is the time and space for it. Normally people who hate something simply will stop getting involved with this very thing, because it makes little sense to continously talk about something you hate, but not these guys, they feel like it is necessary to tell everyone how much they hate it, and go out of their way in doing so. They will take every change they get to mock something and just can't let it go.

In between, you have those who care quite a bit but can neither stand it if others see nothing wrong and will act as if there are no flaws, nor when people see flaws where there are none or invent things they can complain about. These people often end up being accused of being a "gushing fanboy" or "hater" in different discussions, depending on who they have to waste their time with.

If anything, the "haters" are more annoying, because the "gushers" usually keep to themselves and don't feel the need to tell everyone how awesome they thought something was. You don't see any movie "journalists" talk about news to the next Star Wars movie, mentioning how awesome the prequels were, but you do find plenty of these kind of people who just can't stop putting their opinion in a piece where it doesn't belong.


In the end, the next movie won't change anything in the fandom, apart from probably making it larger, like every new release does.
Those who loved everything so far will be split between those who still love everything, those who may not like the newest stuff and those who may at times badmouth the new movies because the "haters" will still attack the prequels and they just want to lash out in return. The haters, on the other hand, will likely be split into those who like the new movies and couldn't care less about what happened in the past, those who like the new movies and want to bash Lucas for the prequels just because they can, and those who dislike the new movies (most of which will probably find a way to blame Lucas for that as well).

In between you will have those guys who have to defend the movies against the haters and see the flaws against the gushers. And all of those once again pale in comparison to the silent majority who couldn't be bothered to spend time on useless discussions and just enjoy what they have and stay away from what they don't enjoy.

 

I'm interested to see if the traditional "sides" even matter as much after the film a year plan kicks in. ST vs spinoff could become a contentious point in itself,

 

^ ESTO

 

What if the falcon blew up and saved our OT remaining characters? I'd be alright.

Off-topic but what movie is that gif from?

 

Lady Sings the Blues.

 

What has been seen, cannot be unseen.

Raiders was saved by a competent director and writer, not named George Lucas. "A New Hope" was written by competent writers and isn't as good as TESB. Same with AG.

 

Is the Pope Jewish? Lol

 

What.

 

Reply to the OP

 

Ah ok, thanks.