Worst Moments in TV & Movie Fantasy History

Discussion in 'Archive: SF&F: Films and Television' started by Jedi Merkurian, Jan 24, 2006.

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  1. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 7
    I may have to help. Generations and First Contact were NOT crap!



    [qoute=Chancellor Ewok]
    Here you've totally lost me. Yeah, there was a lot flag waving patriotic BS in ID4, but fascism? Sorry, I don't see it. :confused: [/quote]

    Yeah, could you care to elaborate on that one?
  2. Yodas-evil-twin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2005
    star 5
    The film was a bastardization of a great novel and a giant dump on Robert A. Heinlein's grave.
  3. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    I will readily concede that the novel has a different tone than the movie, but like the movie the novel is also intended to be read as satire and again like the movie, the novel takes aim at the military mindset.
  4. Yodas-evil-twin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2005
    star 5
    Actually, I view it as the exact opposite of that statement.
  5. Beowulf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 28, 1999
    star 5
    Speaking of Christopher Lambert craptacular films...

    [image=http://images.blockbuster.com/is/amg/dvd/cov150/drt000/t081/t08182crijo.jpg]
    Beowulf (1999)


    This movie wasn't even released in theaters in the US because of how poorly it performed internationally. It is by far one of the worst movies ever made. I had to fast-forward it so I could even make it to the end. It was that bad.
  6. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    Starship Troopers was originally written in 1959, so it was part of those millitary 40s & 50s books. Heinlein and others of his era tended to have a very facist view of space exploration with conquest and governments set up under the domination of the individual head of the explorers/civilizers of whatever culture they ran into.
    Now, the people who made the movie may have intended it as a satire, but that is not what Heinlein intended.

    As for ID4, well, most of it is simple jingoism, as noted by others. I couldn't help but notice that the American President is a former fighter pilot, and has to lead the airforce attack of the aliens... So he's more important than any of the other world leaders (all of whom are pretty much ignored in the movie). The US coopts all other millitary forces on the planet, who pretty much bow and scrape to follow the American millitary's lead. Thus, obviously (in the movie) the rest of the world is the US's amorous canine plaything, waiting for the US to dominate and give orders. While that may not be exactly facist, it's close enough for me. Plus one of the main "patriotic" music motifs is a barely disguised "Deutschland Ueberalles" orchestrated and composed by a british subject.

    Plus both movies just plain sucked.

    OK, and I have a warped sense of humor.

    As for the Trek movies... Heck, I didn't like #4, and none of the movies after 6 are as good as that one.
    So I'm a nitpicker...


    BTW: Christopher Lambert's latest movie (or the last Direct-to-Video release I saw) "Day of Wrath" has him as a sherrif in a Spanish city who discovers that there's a vast conspiracy, somehow involving the church and the guards, as well as a band of assassins. Somehow, Lambert has forgotten everything he learned from Bob Anderson about sword fighting in the highlander movies, because he and the rest of the cast are about as inept as can be with a blade. Odd considering how the soldiers practice so much... Wasn't a completely horrible movie, but mainly because Brian Blessed was there to pull the fat out of the fire.
  7. Panther50 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2004
    star 3
    In fairness to Independence Day, assuming there was an alien invasion, wouldn't most countries expect the US to take the lead in any counterattack.
  8. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    There's that and the fact the world's armies had just been given a very sever ass kicking. I think everyone would have fallen in line pretty quickly behind the first person to come up with a reasonably plausible or any plan at all, for bringing down the aliens.
  9. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    Did they? All the movie really showed was a bunch of monuments being blown up, and the US Airforce being shot down, and the secret service planting nukes. I don't remember seeing anything about Chinese, Russian, Indian, or British forces being smacked around.
  10. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    [image=http://www.sg.hu/kep/2006_06/0608harag1.jpg]

    I saw this at the video store. The cover just screams, "Christopher Lambert is going to rape you!" (Foreign image used because of higher resolution on the rape-face)
  11. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    When did the Secret Service plant nukes? And as for nobody else being smacked around, there's such a thing a reading watching between the lines, which should be that hard to do in this case since there are scenes of Russian, British and Japanese air force units in hiding.
  12. Jedimarine Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    I give him a pass on "The Rock"...only Nick Cage movie I can stomach and Sir Sean owned it. Too bad his next 10 movies are rip-offs of this film.

    Why Lucas didn't sue Battlestar Galactica into nothingness in 1979 is beyond me.

    We are in accord...though I'd toss 1 in for good measure.

    HAHA...this should be a game...just how far into it did you get?

    With each one that passed, the anger numbed a bit...I look at them as no bigger a failure then any of the craptacular EU books I've read...and luckily, I worked at a movie theater throughout the prequel run, so I never had to throw down cash to see them...it helps tremendously in my recollections.


    Pass for any music by Queen...other then that...agreed.

    Sadly, Escapae from NY gets more dated and bad with each passing year...leveling the disparity between the 2. But LA is still junk (though is it really sci-fi/fantasy?)

    Very pretty...though a touch to the eccentric over the pragmatic...this one will pop up on television and you can leave it on in the background...easy to check in and out of.

    and Heavy Metal.

    Technically, this movie came out after Independence Day...so it would be the second.
    Sadly, the "satire" of this movie missed, because the cast wasn't smart enough to deliver it that way. This is one of the most brainless movies of all time. But some of the effects are good.

    Ah yes...the lament of those that cry for a canceled show to get one more gasp of life...pay attention firefly lovers.

    Amen

    It was ok when you were 7...if it hooked you...maybe you get to 11-12 still a fan...after that, it's sad.

    I'll take your word for it...not even going to test view.

    It's like looking at old photo albums and being embarrassed by how you used to look/act...I'm sure my mom has got photos of me with Castle Greyskull somewhere.

    again, I'll take your word for it.

    Ok...first off...any movie based upon July 4th is going to be a propoganda piece for the US. I mean they released this film with the hope that people would go see it before heading out to shoot off fireworks in this country...it's marketing was intrinsically tied to the holiday...of COURSE it's gonna be bias.

    Second...given the number of war veterans that have become president...it wasn't all that huge a stretch...though plausibly letting him fly the lead sortie is downright an insult to the intelligence of humanity itself.

    I was actually ok with this film right up to when Data gets mind-controlled by the alien...before that, I was alright...but that is the jump-
  13. Jedi Merkurian Episode VII Thread-Reaper and Rumor Naysayer

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2000
    star 6
    I have to side with Koohi regarding ID4 in at least one respect. One of the lines from the movies was:

    British Officer #1: The Americans are planning a counteroffensive.
    British Officer #2: About bloody time!
  14. Jedimarine Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    Not that I don't see blatant patriotism in ID4...but I don't think it's as bad as you insinuate.

    I believe the line was

    Officer 1
    "It's from the Americans..."

    "They want to organize a counteroffensive."

    Officer 2

    "About bloody time...what do they plan to do?"

    1st off, let's remember that this scene appears to be in the middle of a dessert...these men obviously are a long way from home. It's not like this an air force base in England waiting on the beckon call from the US. They are stranded and waiting for ANY information to come their way to get moving again...the Americans are just the first with a plan.

    now if he had said "Oh thank god for the Americans, We'd be lost without them" it'd be blatant...but as it is, it's more a statement about FINALLY having a plan...no matter where it came from.

    I think that sequence comes off worse then intended just because of the tone of the film in relation to July 4th. But would it have been better to simply ignore the rest of the world and have America stop the Aliens alone? Cutting a scene like that could make it turn out that way.

    The real bias is how the Americans are the only ones with an infrastructure still essentially in place (at mythical Area 51)...the rest of the contacts are all hodgepodge groups and secluded units in hiding...you'd think the Americans had a second air force sitting at Area 51.

    It's a popcorn movie with no depth...marketed to grab American's on the 4th of July...ID4 was one the films that helped establish the idea that "good" movies don't come out from June-August..."good" doesn't fit the marketing scheme.
  15. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    I give TMP a pass because of Goldsmith's beautiful score. I mean, it's so damn good I don't even notice that all I'm watching is six straight otherwise silent minutes of an Enterprise model and reaction shots.
  16. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    The Rube-goldberg machine under the furnace in the sub-basement of the jail that only Connery could figure out the timeing to was a testament to stupidity barely exceeding the Ferrari/Hmv chase.

    He didn't see it as a threat? Face it, aside from the first 3 episodes/the movie, it became junk with very little to redeam it. Robert Forschen managed to redeam some episodes with the novelizations (some of which were actually good--like the gun on the ice planet)

    Saw it in the theaters when it first came out. Watched it again in college to see if it really was that bad. It was!

    If it had been done as a full season, it might have worked. As it is, it's either too short or too long.

    1980 (1979?) saturday morning cartoon was a precursor experiment for He-Man

    Based on the previous year's "Space Academy" series, only with a Saturday-morning acceptable Han Solo wannabe character and Scotty, um, James Dohan to hopefully boost ratings. Campy. Cast included a wind-up robot or a pocket-sized R2-D2

    The first one was a cute, obscure, low-budget, post-apocolyptic Blade-runner wannabe. The second... Didn't remember what made the first one fun.

    Your brain cells. You won't see me risking mine again. Makes Godzilla movies look logical, rational, and plausible, with tight, well-scripted characters, plots, and action sequences.

    Maybe it was the millitary. I haven't seen the movie in 6 years...
    I just remember being utterly disgusted by it.


    Others have mentioned:

    Battlefield Earth--definately one of the low points of the human race--just a couple steps above various genocide attempts made throughout history (take your pick)

    Stargate: Infinity--A stargate cartoon without the goa'uld? Isn't the main series enough of a cartoon?

    Doctor Who: The 1996 American TV movie--everything that could possiblly be done wrong was, short of casting John Cleese as the Doctor (Don't laugh, the American producers wanted to do it!). The sheer scope of the violation this movie causes is just... It would take me 1/2 an hour to type it up. This show founded my theory that Americans cannot write time-travel movies. So far, no one has offered up a counter example.

    Doctor Who: the british Peter Cushing movies. Just bad, painful, BBC productions that should be burned. It's like watching the OVA of an anime series, then watching something with the same title, only all the rules are changed the the characters re-written.

    Gamera movies. Do you really need an explanation?

    Return from Witch Mountain--looks like it was made for Disney TV Sunday mov
  17. Gryffin_intended Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2007
    the lesbian kiss in Buffy because it portrayed sin!








    just kidding
  18. Sith_Sensei__Prime Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2000
    star 5
    The Ewoks Adventures were an abomination.
    [image=http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/4280/17143431hb4.jpg]




    Misson to Mars lame
    [image=http://www.soundtrackcollector.com/images/cd/large/Mission_To_Mars_Hollywood_62257.jpg]






    Ultraviolet perfect example of style over substance.
    [image=http://www.impawards.com/2006/posters/ultraviolet.jpg]





    Aeon Flux another lame script.
    [image=http://www.monstersandcritics.com/artman/uploads/aeon_flux_front_cover.jpg]




    Godzilla (1998)
    [image=http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/6468/1998godzillabm8.jpg]



    Metalstorm: The Destruction of Jared-Syn it starred a young Kelly Preston, but lacked any other good qualities. It majorly ripped off many Star Wars elements. It was also featured in 3-D.
    [image=http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/916/bluehillsjq4.jpg]


    Spider-Man 3 Horrible dancing sequence, the multilation of the characterization of Spidey's most deadly nemesis, the turn of Harry Ozbourne, and poor chemistry between the characters.
    [image=http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/9681/spider32rz3.jpg]


    Superman: Quest for Peace
    [image=http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B000059XUK.01._SCLZZZZZZZ_.jpg]


    Masters of the Universe
    [image=http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1831/515brpjb54laa280dm1.jpg]


    Conan: The Destroyer
    [image=http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/730/conanthedestroyerver3bg4.jpg]


    Reign of Fire:
    [image=http://www.tracksounds.com/images/misc/reign_fire_big.jpg]




    Wing Commander didn't have to see it to know it sucks.
    [image=http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3272/01wcyp4.jpg]
  19. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    I liked Reign of Fire. I thought the idea of a post-apocolyptic fantasy movie pretty original.




    Plotwise its a generic sci-fi action flick, but it does have somre pretty good starfighter combat.
  20. Panther50 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2004
    star 3
    I thought Wing Commander had it moments, I don't even think Masters of the Universe was that bad. But I have to agree Ultra Violent was pretty bad, same with Mission to Mars and its contemparary Red Planet.
    As for Independence Day I seem to recall that the military tried using nuclear weapons against the alien ships with the shields still up and it was a failure.
  21. Beowulf Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 28, 1999
    star 5
    With the number of movies starring Christopher Lambert that have made it into this thread, I think he should be dubbed "Worst Moment Maker in TV & Movie Fantasy History."
  22. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    Overall, I liked Mission to Mars. The only thing I didn't like was the Martian at the end. When I first saw the face, my thought was "cool, the Face was built be the Grays." The alien at the end, however, looked nothing like the Grays and I thought that was kind of dissappointing.
  23. Jedimarine Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 5
    MISSION TO MARS???

    Oh come on...it took a chance on being as close to a pure sci-fi film as we've seen in 30 years!

    Great Cast...sound look and feel...effects that weren't overdone...no homicidal robo-dogs (Red Planet) :)

    Granted, I'm not rushing out to buy it and have it on the shelf...but I wouldn't be ashamed to sit it next to the OT or Gattaca on the shelf.
  24. Chancellor_Ewok Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2004
    star 6
    You know, I don't think I've ever seen it for sale, now that I think about it, but dispite my issues with the end of the movie and only one aspect at that, its a pretty good movie. You can tell that they did some homework on the technical side.
  25. Jedi Merkurian Episode VII Thread-Reaper and Rumor Naysayer

    Manager
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2000
    star 6
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