Would Padme have died if Obi-Wan hadn't snuck on board her ship?

This is too much.

That isn't Anakin breaking Padme's heart.

You really think Vader was up for a chat about whats right and whats wrong?

we need a violin face.

he doesn't mean to kill her. his heart breaks when he finds out he has. he isn't thinking straight. i know you won't have it because it's easier to believe he just turns with the flick of a switch, but this isn't how things work.[/quote]Whether he intended to or not, his actions alone is what caused her to die. His turn starts in AOTC with the killing of the Tusken, don't you see? The seduction started from the moment TPM was over.

 

you have no evidence to prove that she couldnt convince him if that thight ass medler hadnt showed up in his cocky superman position.

i'm with you, sithrules, just so you know.

off now, need to go to bed.

 

Ah, that was sithrules. I'm interested in plenty of POVs. But when they are wrong and obviously wrong, I'm not going to pretend they are valid.

I said he loved - but in a selfish way. But that isn't Anakin on Mustafar.

You're welcome. Come again!

 

Let's try to refrain from posting about Users and argue the Topic.

 

Ah, that was sithrules. I'm interested in plenty of POVs. But when they are wrong and obviously wrong, I'm not going to pretend they are valid.


thats exactly the point.you think we are wrong and you think you are right but you cant be 100% positive that you are right unless you are GL who i doubt you are.


as rolando said back to the topic.

i think she would have obviously died eventually,and thats what anakin failed to get,everything dies,even suns burn out.

i just dont think obi wan's presence in mustafar helped the situation and i dont see any other way around it.

 

Obi-Wan didn't choke Padme, Anakin did. She was about to withdraw from Anakin and leave him anyway. Anakin would have stopped her.

I'm tired of this "devil made me do it" attitude regarding Anakin. He is responsible for his actions. Obi-Wan coming down the ramp did not require Anakin to chike Padme out. His own fear and paranoia drove him to do that heinous act.

At this point, Anakin is a horrible human being and deserved to catch on fire.

 

Do you have to create a word to understand what it means?

I'll go to real life illustration. Say you have an angry man who thists for power, willing to do anything to keep the power and trusts no one in an argument with his wife. Then during said argument, another man walks in, let's say he's a cop who is determined to stop the man in his thirst before more are killed. So the man then starts to attack another person, after killing so many before. How do you blame the last victim on the cop, especially when the wounds from the attack didn't cause his wife's death?

Vader is a criminal, Padme is his unknowing wife, and Obi is the cop. You can't blame the cop for a criminal committing another crime.

 

if you are tired of this then dont visit this thread any more because you will find plenty of people who give obi wan a good amount of responsibility for padme's nap

so what if he is responsible for his actions ?? obi wan coming down the ramp DID require anakin to attack padme,he is a sith,they do not tolerate betrayal,from his POV she brought him there and obi wan should have known better than to come down in the worst part of the argument.

if she was going to leave him or try to put some sense into him is something we will never know until GL says so if he ever does.

as i see our opinions are like oil and water and thats not gonna change.

 

Do you have to create a word to understand what it means?

yes,because you may think you are absolutely sure of what it means but thats only your POV.the only POV that can be used as cannon is GL's

 

You think he was required to choke his wife and it's Obi-Wan's fault? In the immortal words of Obi-Wan...

"WELL THEN YOU ARE LOST!"

 

did i say it was obi wan's fault ?? i only said obi wan didnt add anything positive to an already very bad situation. all i critic about obi here is that he could have chose better timing:come down as they land.

 

What about not discussing the users is really so hard to understand??

 

Maybe Obi-Wan respected Padme and thought maybe she would have more sway over Anakin to reason with him, but as soon as he saw Anakin was having none of it, he entered the picture. He heard Padme withdraw from Anakin, exclaim that Obi-Wan was right, and he came to deal with it.

 

That's the truth of it. Obi-wan stepped in when it became clear that Padme was not going to sway Anakin. Why must everyone be to blame in this situation but Anakin? When does he take responsibility for his own actions and decisions?

 

i already said that it was anakin's fault but obi didnt add anything positive to an already heated discussion.maybe padme wasnt gonna sway anakin but no one can prove that he would have still attacked her if obi wan hadnt come down the ramp.

please understand my POV im not asking you to agree with it but at least give it some consideration

 

I honestly didn't think Lucas could pull it off and make people sympathetic to Anakin, but he reeled in a huge percentage of the fans.

In fact, I never expected him to write such a brilliant Faustian tale such as ROTS.

But you still have got to see that Anakin does fall and he could have prevented it all. He literally sells his soul to the devil - no one else sold him away.

I am giving it consideration. How about Padme giving heed to what Obi-Wan told her and not try to rush off and face a mass murderer. She was in denial and put herself an unborn child at risk. She couldn't believe it until it was too late. Had she trusted Obi-Wan like she said she did, she perhaps would have been safe.

But I still don't think the choke killed her, just Anakin's transformation into evil incarnate.

 

I agree with you here. Anakin is definitely responsible for all of this. There just was never a "good" time for Obi-Wan to come into the picture. And he showing up did make things worse for Padme. But again, Anakin shouldn't have lashed out on her, cos he was pissed about Obi-Wan. Do I think he would have attacked Padme if he hadn't shown up? I want to say no, even if Anakin was mad at her he doesn't have the Obi-Wan "excuse", but there is no evidence to suggest one way or the other.

 

what really makes me mad is that he swallowed the crap that a sith was gonna help him save the only thing that he loves and a potential enemy

i mean a sith caring about others ??!?!?!? no one could even think of falling for that,thats the only thing that bugs me about anakin,he could never understand that 1+1=2 until ROTJ.

 

I understand what you're saying and can see things from your perspective. But don't forget that when Obi-wan stepped out on that ramp (another great moment in the saga) he didn't whip out his lightsaber and charge. He took up where Padme left off, still trying desperately to reason with someone who just killed innocent friends and children and attacked his own wife. Who could do something like that? Still hesitate to stop such a monster because you still love the friend he used to be. That's the epitome of brotherhood and still Anakin continued to step all over it.

Could Obi-wan have waited? I don't think so because I happen to believe that Obi-wan, of all the Jedi had learned to act not think and follow the will of the Force at all times. I believe it was Lucas' intent to say that Anakin was beyond saving at this point. By Mustafar, going to the Dark Side wasn't about saving Padme anymore, it was about seizing power. Nothing she could have said at the time would have convinced him to let it all go and leave with her.

 

maybe...maybe not,this is a topic that will always be open for debate until GL decides to say anything about it if he ever does.

 

]

I'd say two times for sure.

When he says "Nooooo" at the end of the movie and begins to hate Anakin Skywalker and when he chucks the Emperor down the shaft and saves the galaxy.


No one hates Anakin Skywalker more than Darth Vader, people. Star Wars 101. Take the class.

 

rhonderoo and his/her wisdom(wich one is it ) saved the day ,again !!

 

rhonderoo - If Vader was truly taking responsibility when he said "Nooo" he would have repented from his evil ways. Instead, he embraced them even more. That's not taking responsibility. You were only half right, he only takes responsibility at the end of ROTJ. At the end of ROTS he is the exact opposite of the pendulum.

Ballgame.

 

Anakin knows he is doing the wrong thing but he cant control his actions or his anger. He loses it and then tries to pass the buck and rationalise his actions. But he knews he is wrong. but he is on the path, he doesnt want to be on it, but he knows he cant get off, so he goes along with it.

 

but after she died he had nothing to live for but power and his new empire.why would he repent if she was dead already ??