Would suited Vader have felt more evil if we saw him fighting in ROTS?

We saw the guy in the OT...he fights Obi-Wan and Luke. But that doesn't seem all that convincing of his villain status. However, if we saw suited Vader fight say, Mace Windu....and kill him, then it'd be much more convincing of the blood on his hands. What do you think?

 

I dunno Alpha...Suited Vader - Unsuited Vader...They're both just plain AWESOME!!!! It's hard to decide which one was more awesome than the other.

 

Yes, maybe at the very end see him kill an unnamed Jedi or something. Or at least show Vader unsuited do some damage in the temple.

Gee, the most potential for the most butt-kicking duels and we get bubkis.

But I would like to see Vader do something actiony. In ANH he seems clunky, so a reaffirment of his skills would be welcome.

Maybe we will see something in that tv show rumored to come.

Dont forget Dark Lord. It's kind of a lame book, but it at least lets you know what Vader's doing.

 

Well, I?ve always loved suitless Vader .

Hmm, it?s hard question but somehow I always thought that the suit made him slower but maybe it?s just because he was getting old .

No, you know what, I don?t think that he should have been in his suit during the ep. 3 fights, cuz then you wouldn?t have seen all of the emotions that burned inside of him and it wouldn?t have been good, because basically it was what it was all about, the betrayal, pain and personal suffering that he felt, that we get to feel, was in his eyes and if the would have been covered by thick red lenses then the scenes would have lost everything it was so no, he should have been in the suit, and it doesn?t hurt the fact that he is sooooo much hotter without it either .

 

Nah, you've got to think of the OT.

If Lucas really wants us to watch the Saga in numerical order, then it's far cooler seeing FrankenVader in ROTS, believing Anakin to be this kind of pathetic figure, then suddenly at the beginning of ANH he's chucking guys against walls and being a supervillain.

 

Now this is what the entire Saga is all about! You see Vadar*unsuited* as evil, but yet still not as evil as he is in ANH, when he's chucking guys against walls as Garth_Maul said. Anakin turned Victim to Villian in the transition of ROTS to ANH.

Rachel Rose

 

You want him to fight Mace in the suit before his injuries have healed ??????????

 

I agree.The PT shows how Vader gradually becomes a monster while the CT shows Vader being a badass Sith terminator running around slaughtering Rebels and Jedi

 

EDIT: Stupid Double Post

*Force chokes OPPM*

 

More evil? No, I don't think so (IMO).

 

He was evil enough for me in ROTS after all he did... more fighting from him in the suit wouldnt have added anything.

 

I think Lucas could have showcased Vader's "one handed" lightsabre style a little here. It's a disconnect between the PT and the OT in this regard. But, as for the fighting itself, ROTS hit the nail on the head: this is about Anakin becoming Vader. The suit, both a life support system and Anakin's purgatory, rightfully comes after he's journeyed to Mustafar, Star Wars' version of hell, and been rescued by Palpatine, the devil himself. It is a puncutation mark -- and a darn big one -- for all of Anakin's deeds and the path to evil.

 

I don't think it would have been better to see suited Vader. He's completely changed in the CT and has learned to project his anger in a more controlled way, and having him duel someone and slice their head off or whatnot would have shook that collective attitude of his. I suppose we could really see Anakin in Vader after that though. The PT is about Anakin's journey to become Vader and the CT is about Vader's journey to become Anakin. Let's just leave it at that

 

Well I mean Grievous only got more powerful when he was outfitted with prosthetics. They could've had it so that suited Vader was just as strong as he was before. So maybe you could have written the story so that the Jedi only find out about Palpatine AFTER the Mustafar duel, and suited Vader shows up in time to save his master.

 

So what exactly would happen in the scene where Anakin pledges himself to Palpatine?

 

"What would happen to the flippin' film?" is a better question!

 

Every Star Wars film had a pretty definitive climax.

Ep 1: Trade Federation/Darth Maul defeated.
Ep 2: Obi/Anakin/Padme saved, Clone Wars begin.
Ep 4: Death Star Go Boom
Ep 5: Heroes beaten down. Han in Carbonite, Luke finds Vader is his father and has Arm chopped.
Ep 6: Death Star, SSD, Emporer, and Vader go boom.

What if Gungans running down some rogue droids that weren't under control of the TF ship was shown at the very end of TPM.
What if AoTC ended with Obi-Wan doing some more library research.
What if ANH had Luke and Han blow up 6 more tie fighters on their way back to Yavin.
What if Empire had Vader beating the hell out of Lobot after the Luke/Leia scene.
What if RoTJ had a strike team to look for remaining stormtroopers, finding a few with some surrendering and others giving a little resistence.

Episode III Climaxed with Vader getting butchered and tossed in a suit while his kids were being born and his wife died. Seeing him pwn some unknown Jedi assailants attacking Palpatine or something would not have any real feel behind it. The Saga has six parts that all continue the story while ending an Era of sorts, mostly like the list above, but...TPM ends the era of TF attacking Naboo, AoTC ends an Era of Peace and brings War, RoTS ends the era of the Jedi, ANH ends the era of hopelessness for the galaxy, ESB ends the Era of Vader being a faceless villian, RoTJ ends the era of the Sith.

Carnage

 

Well first of all that line bothers me. "Doesn't seem all that convincing of his villain status"..

Without sounding like a fan boy This is Darth Vader were talking about. Has the PT changed your view so much that you think Vader's status as a villain is unimpressive?. Suited Vader is an example of one of the best villains ever, I doubt he needs to kill Mace Windu to establish that.

 

The events in ROTS are supposed to define Vader as a character far more acutely than anything the OT did. When Obi-Wan tells Luke about Vader betraying and murdering his father, you get the picture of what he is. But when you get to ROTS who gets betrayed and murdered? Only Mace Windu, really. The Jedi Temple raid wasn't that impressive. Sure he kills a few kids and some other Jedi here and there, but that would pale in comparison if he killed Ki-Adi Mundi or Mace Windu in open combat.

So if things had played out that way, then when you see Luke step up to the carbon freezing platform in ESB, you know that Vader has blood on his hands. You know he's a murderer and betrayer.

 

Vader did betray and murder Anakin. Look at all that Vader did. He went against the very ideals that Anakin once pledged himself to uphold. Vader had blood on his hands because he choked Padme, contributing to her death. He stopped Mace from ending Palpatine's regin of tyranny. He killed little children, for ******* sake!

That last one is evil and what has divided many fans on his redemption.

 

Going into the Temple and killing everyone there, including the little kids, is in most people's opinion the worst thing that Lucas could have shown him doing, far worse than killing other Masters. But this isn't about Anakin physically harming people, it's about his psychological and ideological shift. We don't need to see suited Vader fight, or unsuited Vader kill everyone in sight, the point is that he has turned into a person who is now capable of it. He gives up everything that was ever important to him, tried to harm everyone who ever loved him. That's what's important in ROTS.

Suited Vader should be an OT thing, the PT isn't about it. And while Anakin is indeed Vader without the suit, we associate it with him being Sith. There is always some doubt in ROTS about whether he's really accepted being a Sith, which is as it shoudl be, but in the OT there is no such doubt. Once Vader embraces the light again at the end of ROTJ, we once again see him without the suit, which we associate with him being Anakin.

 

Mandy's right, ROTS is about seeing Anakin become Vader and the other side of the Vader we saw in the OT. The more vulnerable one. I for one can't see Vader now in the OT without seeing the man on the table asking about his wife. I know how he got there. I know what he's probably thinking under that helmet and I know how far he fell from seeing where he started.

 

I see what you are saying. But instead of the scene of the Death Star being created, which only seeded confusion as to why it took so long and created lots of debate about how many more years it took to weed out any problems the first time around as to the 3-5 years or less it took to make one in RotJ, why not show Vader fighting or something, that way it shows you he doesnt suck in the suit, he's still a good fighter. Or maybe just him battling 3-4 dueling robots or something to show him train so you see how he got from a limping dufus to a dueling master. Or something like that. Just to incorporate the red lightsaber. I know if you read the novels you get some of that, but the casual SW fans dont read the novels.

 

But again, even with the OT, Vader's story is 100% not about him being a badass. It's a psychological character study. There's no need to see him fight anymore than he does. We have to see just enough to be able to help fill out the tragic hero model. Sure, there's lots of battles and excitement in Star Wars, but it all serves the core story, which is how psychologically a good man goes bad, and how he is able to be redeemed.

 

Good post. Agreed.