Would the PT have been better without Natalie?

Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by Darth_Joe, May 27, 2002.

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  1. bjork_109 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 1
    Personally I think that Portman's acting was a bit...well...bland. She's convincing to a certain degree when she is playing the regal queen and senator but other than that I had a REALLY hard time believeing her emotional roles. She's pretty I agree, and maybe that's the only reason why George picked her for the role. *Shrug* This may sound strange also, but I think Leia/Carrie is better looking and has better acting skills than Portman. But did Portman ruin PT? No. I think she damaged them, but not ruined. I like Star Wars for Star Wars; and I don't let little things ruin it for me. :)

    Of course, some of my dislike toward Portman might be because she got to kiss Hayden...LOL. ;)

    -Bjork.

  2. macoco Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 7, 2000
    star 3
    In answer to thread topic: absolutely not.

    I would boycott a non-Natalie PT.

    It would be horrible.

  3. zeva Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 2
    Absolutely. Her acting abilities are PATHETIC. To make matters worse, she does not even seem to have formed a personality yet. Look at Carrie Fisher as Leia. Sure, she was not incredible, but you knew what her character was like, you knew what her personality was like, etc. She drew life into the lines and the direction (or lack thereof) by Lucas and the other directors of the OT. This little girl unfortunately does not seem to believe her character could exist, and it shows in her acting. The fact that so many people have caught on this even though they are not expecting Oscar performances from a Star Wars movie is telling all by itself. Those who think the PT cannot exist without her, well....I truly don't know what to say to you that will make you see the light, so continue enjoying her poor excuses for acting abilities. As for me, everytime she comes on she looks retarded, with lots of simulation instead of interpretation, imitation instead of being in the moment. What the hell, she just SUCKS, that's it!


    To the person who suggested Anna Paquin: you should be a casting director. She is an EXCELLENT choice. And I mean excellent not only because of her looks and her acting ability, but because she also has experience working in films that are FX heavy (X MEN), where she still manages to bring a badly written character ALIVE, something little Portman forgot or never learned after THE PROFESSIONAL
  4. JediHeretic47 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 16, 2002
    star 1
    What macoco said.

    I have grown to appreciate her performance even more in recent viewings. She's subtle when she needs to be, and not so much when she doesn't need to be.

    And besides, that "I call it aggressive negotiations!" line is pure Leia.

  5. yodaschum Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 9, 2002
    star 4
    She's got a cute little face. :p

    To people who say she can't act - she can, have you seen LEON?

    the thing is I can't see who else Lucas could have chose - Reese Witherspoon?

    The other thing, is Star Wars does not do its actors any favours, they have to act in front of blue-screen and talk to tennis balls on sticks. Most of the actors say its "an experience" but not very rewarding and they are glad to move on to different things. I know this is true of the OT actors who to this day regard Star Wars as some joke they got involved in - they really had no idea how big it would be.

    So all I'm saying is does it really matter? If it was Meryl Streep playing the part we would be saying she sucked too. Lucas likes to cast the main roles on how they look - Ewan, Hayden, Liam, Chewbacca hehehe . Then he likes to use seasoned pros like Cushing, Lee, McDiarmid in the official parts.

    Bleh! What am I talking about. Portman - yes she can act - just not in Star Wars, but thats because Lucas doesnt direct his actors, he just wanders around in the background. Harrison Ford when he first met him thought he was the "sound guy" then when they were shooting he would look for direction and Lucas would be asleep in the back of a truck! Seriously, he is more interested in directing the spaceships than the real actors.
  6. Dayda_Amidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 28, 2001
    star 3
    amen to that, yodaschum

    natalie rocks... not so much in star wars as her other movies, but she still gave a convincing performance which is really all that matters.
  7. zeva Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 2
    Directing kids is a different animal. In some cases they're so inexperienced (read: unpolluted) that it is possible to get a great performance out of them. This also works for non-actors. It is a hit and miss process that involves selecting the right type first and then interacting with the child to see how he or she reacts to direction, then gauging their specific attention span, and of course structuring the scene to get the take you want first (as early and as fresh as possible). This could have been the case in THE PROFESSIONAL, because she excels in that role. Nobody is arguing or has argued that. Why people keep bringing up that film to defend the work she did in AOTC is beyond me. The threads asks about her acting in the PTs, and not her ENTIRE body of work.


    and just for the record, I have directed kids and have experience directing actors and non-actors alike.
  8. Imperial_Guard Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 13, 2002
    star 4
    I think she's done okay and some people seem to want a more defined role and personality that they can more easily pin down like Leia but I would argue that the somewhat mysterious persona where she has multiple roles has been portrayed quite well.

    The only reference that we have in the OT to her is Leia in ROTJ and from that description I always imagined that the mother of Luke and Leia would be a bit mysterious like you can't quite exactly figure her out and I think that from what we've seen in the PT so far, that seems to have held up and I think it's because she's under a lot of stress from all corners so that she doesn't have as much time to establish a stronger personality as 'herself'.

    Leia refers to Padme as being very beautiful but also sad and we've seen that in the PT so far and undoubtedly that sadness will be enhanced in Episode III. Personally, I'm hoping that Episode III will give us the 'definitive' Padme where GL and Hales really concentrate on her character and dialogue.

    To answer the thread question, I don't really think so. I think Portman has done and will do fine.

    It's also important to remember that Portman really has no real reference from the OT to relate to unless you want a Leia clone. Hayden Christensen had Vader in the OT and Jake Lloyd in TPM. Ian McDiarmid is a SW veteran and Ewan McGregor has Alec Guinness to watch and emulate because they are present throughout the entire saga in one form or another. Padme is decidely one of the few major 'original' PT characters that exists exclusively in the PT world.
  9. I_Hate_Sand Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 6, 2002
    star 1
    Natalie's white outfit should've got an oscar! :)
  10. BlueMules Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2002
    star 3
    Date Posted: 9/7 9:40pm Subject: RE: Would the PT have been better without Natalie?
    She's got a cute little face.

    To people who say she can't act - she can, have you seen LEON?




    OHHHHHHH Pleazzzzzze! That was 10 YEARS ago. Are you telling me that her acting was better a decade ago?
  11. QuiGonHrafn Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 3
    Natalie is a good actress who doesn't deserve this kind of treatment. Are you really going to tell me Carrie Fisher is a better actress - have you watched ROTJ? (the main reason Fisher is memorable is her partnership with Harrison Ford - Who wouldn't be fun opposite Ford The Empire Strikes Back?) What about the so called "real actresses" of today like Halle Berry (who I quite like) and Julia Roberts who has no acting abilities. How Roberts won an Academy Award I'll never know. Do you really think the PT would have been better with them (or the likes of Kirsten Dunst and Alyssa Milano who I have seen many suggest in the forums) in it? I am a huge fan of the PT (I think it is better than the original) and it would not be half as good without the fun, charming and graceful person Padmé is (which Natalie has created). Natalie Portman is a good actress as well as being beautiful. She has a certain charm few Hollywood actresses have. Instead of thrashing her (like the stupid critics) we (Star Wars fans) should be backing her and the entire SW cast (don't forget many critics slaughtered McGregor and Christensen's performances in AOTC just like Anakin slaughtered the tusken raiders). I'm not saying she is the greatest actor in the PT. She is not as good an actress as Neeson, McGregor and McDiarmid are actors (they all have much more experience) but she certainly is a quality actress who does her job well - a job no other Hollywood actress would have done as well.

    Before you're quick to cast your opinion, remember lines like: "I will not give into this." - very dry and ruined what was a very good performance by Hayden

    That scene was excellent from both Hayden and Natalie. Their love is convincing and Natalie is more convincing than Hayden (who is convincing) in the love scenes. Please do me the favour of not copying everything these critics (who hate SW and everything and everyone concerned with it) who have only one purpose with their criticism: To convince people not to go to see the Star Wars films and it appears they were successful with AOTC.
  12. Anakin_Skywalker20 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 16, 2000
    star 5
    great... not this thread again.. For the last time.. no no no... Natalie is great actress... in fact i just had a dream where she was about to die...but i was Anakin and I saved her from dying... anyways... heh lol that was a weird dream... anyways... The thing is... I was really impressed with her performance... you ppl are so blind!! I don't see why you ppl can't see that. watch her eyes...her face. I saw ep2 5 times, with each viewing... Natalie is better and better and better..same with Hayden. Don't Forget there were some bad performances in OT...but who cares. I don't care. I love the OT and I love the PT. Sure, the OT had its flaws...the PT does too... but hey... they're just flaws we have come to accept... We accepted the OT for what it was... and we should do the same for the PT. I found the love story to be believable. Ewan was great as Obiwan. but anyways...back to Natalie... I like her, not because of her looks, not b/c she's hot and sexy..er.. but...of her abilities- I believe in them and it worked. I like how she protrays Padme. *Sighs* well... thats all i can say...from my brain... peace! :cool:
  13. Ben-Obi-Wan-Kenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 1999
    star 3
    "Would the PT have been better without Natalie?"

    YES!
    Portman sux
  14. QuiGonHrafn Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 3
    Then who would have been your choice of Padmé? AND I EXPECT AN ANSWER
  15. zeva Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 2
    your question has been answered at least ten times in this very thread. read prior posts...AND I EXPECT YOU TO DO IT!!!!!



  16. bjork_109 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 2002
    star 1
    I think what it all boils down to is that everyone has their own opinion about what's good acting and what isn't. Just like some people think Woody Allen in a comic genuis, other people just sit there and raise their eyebrows. Some people love Julia Roberts, others would rather burn her at the stake.

    No one is going to get a absolute answer about if Portman ruined PT or not...but I personally would much rather watch the movies and enjoy them rahter that nit pick about the actors. Sure Portman might bug me a little bit; but she certainly didn't ruin PT. So many elements go into making a Star Wars movie; I don't think that we can really except the Great George to get them ALL right. ;)

    I think that we should just all wait for Episode III...Lol.

    -Bjork.
  17. Devilanse Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 11, 2002
    star 5
  18. halcyon_daze Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jul 20, 2002
    Natalie *almost* completely ruined AOTC for me. More often than not, I found myself cringing in my seat whenever she opened her mouth. There's just something about her that doesn't seem right. I think "fake" is probably the best word to describe it.

    Granted, she was tolerable in TPM, but her performance in AOTC was god awful. However, I say she *almost* ruined it for me because it's STILL Star Wars, and Hayden and Ewan more than made up for her shortcomings.

    Bottom line - Natalie Portman is simply not a good actress. I was expecting so much more from the mother of Luke and Leia.

    Who should have been cast as Padme in her place? That's hard to say... Actually, there aren't that many actresses in the 20-25 range that I have much respect for. I agree that Portman was definitely NOT the right choice though.

    mojo@halcyon.cc
  19. Enigma_X Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 22, 2002
    star 2
    Acting is highly subjective. A dozen intelligent individuals can watch the same performance and come up with a dozen different viewpoints on it. And then once you get into an actor's entire career-worth of performances... I've never seen anything to indicate that there is any way to determine whether or not a person can act. Period. I don't think it's possible to definitively declare someone a good/bad actor/actress. It's like trying to judge whether or not a painting has any meaning. A lot of it is in the viewer's baggage- or, to use a more common-place cliche, the eye of the beholder. Razorback did make a good call with Leo DiCaprio. After 'This Boy's Life' and 'What's Eating Gilbert Grape?', it was widely considered a given that he was quite possibly his generation's greatest actor. Anthony Hopkins called his acting job in 'Gilbert Grape' the performance of that year. And yet I've heard him compared unfavorable to freakin' Freddie Prinze, Jr. And I will say now, in the next sentence, that Freddie Prinze, Jr. was great in 'Sparkler'. A friend of mine thinks Gwyneth Paltrow is the worst actress Hollywood has ever produced. I think James Dean (whom Hayden rather resembles, IMO) was garbage in 'Rebel Without a Cause'. Natalie's given some incredible performances and some lousy ones, just like anyone else who ever aspired to the title of actor. For me, her performances in TPM and AOTC were good enough for me to accept her as Padme. For me, that's good enough.
  20. homeless_jedi Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2002
    star 4
    no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no!no! no! no! no1 no! no! no!no!

    nnnnnnnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!
  21. Darth Kruel Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2000
    star 4
    Ms. Portman did alright. Why her performance left a lot of people unimpressed, I haven't the slightest idea. She did well.
  22. Little_Younglin Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 2002
    star 1
    First, I'm a man, 27, and I think NP is gorgeous. O.K. Is that a fact that invalidates me to make a point about her as an actress? I hope not. Let's see if I make my point with a few examples:

    - I don't like Sigourney Weaver's looks, and I think she's a wonderful actress. I love her part as Ripley, I like her in "The Year of Living Dangerously", she portrayed a wonderful 'baddie' in "Working Girl" and I LOL with "Galaxy Quest".

    - I think Milla Jovovich is one of the most beautiful females that ever existed, but I see her in "The Fifth Element" and I think 'OK she's cute'. I later saw her in "Joan of Arc" and I thought her acting skills aren't better than any regular girl in the street.

    After establishing this, let's take a look at Portman's work outside Star Wars:

    - "Leon", she's fantastic in that role. I think everybody would agree with that. One of her best portrayals up to date. Scene as example: Mathilda knocking on Leon's door for the first time.

    - "Heat". It's not a big role, but she made a very believable problematic teenager. Scene as example: Lauren Hanna (Pacino's stepdaugther) breakdown while she's dressing for her father's visit.

    - "Beautiful Girls". Her portrayal as Marty is wonderful and you actually believe Willie's reactions as she pops in his life. (Willie: Timothy Hutton's character). Scene as example: skating in the ice, or maybe the 'Romeo and Juliet dislexic version'.

    - "Anywhere But Here". This is a movie driven fundamentally by her character, and I think the movie works overall. Scene as example: Peter in her apartment.

    - She is nothing but background in "Everyone Says I Love You", I can't remember "Mars Attacks" (I have to watch this movie again), and I didn't watch "Where The Heart Is".

    Now, let's think for a while in Padme Amidala as a character: she is a 24 year old Senator, who used tom be a Queen of her world from 12 to 20. She was a politician for half her life, and she has to go through a period of crisis when her world was in danger. She is rational, she cannot let her feelings drive her behavior for the sake of her people's wellbeing, and she is used to work in politics, where showing your thinking is a major flaw. Now this young padawan re-enter her life. She likes what she sees, she likes his behavior with her, and she falls in love with him. Now, we suppose the only experience she has in dealing with such matters was twelve years ago, in the school, at the age of 12. She knows that following her feelings is somewhat forbidden because of their jobs. Then, what did she do? She let her rational self rule her behavior and deny the possibility of a relationship until she thinks she's gonna die, when she thinks 'The hell with everything' and surrenders to her feelings. What do I think such a person's behavior will be in such circumstances? Portman's Padme.

    I rest my case.
  23. QuiGonHrafn Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 3
    your question has been answered at least ten times in this very thread. read prior posts...AND I EXPECT YOU TO DO IT!!!!!

    I have read prior posts and "Ben - Obi - Wan - Kenobi" never said who he wanted to play Padmé instead of Natalie (unless I missed it). The question was directed at him and him alone and I WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THAT WAS OBVIOUS!!!!
  24. bassethound Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2002
    star 1
    Ok..if Natalie isn't playing, I guess I can pick Jennifer Love Hewitt, Anna Paquin, Thora Birch, Britney Spear..( just kidding). How about Brittany Murphy? She is a really good actress.
  25. Master_Bumpy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 9, 2001
    star 2
    Portman is a very talented actress who may have had some difficulty with this type of environment.

    In AOTC, I felt her performance was stiff in places, but she also came through really well in other scences ("agressive negotiations" et al).

    I think that the editing of the film may have detracted from her performance as well. If you read the novel, most of the scences cut from the movie revolved around Padme and the development of her character (Senate speech, Padme's family, Padme finishing C3P0 etc..)

    The scene by the fire is particularly stiff, but after reading the novel I noticed that every other line of Padme's has been cut (referring to her family and such). Put this back in, and I think it would flow much better.
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