Amph X-Men Movies & TV - Discussion

They will eventually have to retire Wolverine, though. At the very least in the image of Hugh Jackman, and he's become so synonymous with the live depiction of the character that I think I would prefer him written out somehow down the line than replaced with a new actor.

 

I mean if they want X-23 to be the new Wolverine for the movies I'm fine with that... I just don't see how that's feasible when she's so young and in the far future from where the main team is. I mean it's not like the main franchise is going to start with a brand new team in the future, it's still going to be based around the characters from Singer's first movie... and the timeline just doesn't seem to work for that. Time travel and sending her from even further in the future back to the past is really the only option and then you have to create an entirely new time travel method as the excuse for why Kitty couldn't do her role in the movie was because she didn't have a body in the past to go into. So they are going to have to break their own rules if they plan on making X-23 be the team's new Wolverine... or just create a new team for her to be on.

And I really can't see Fox thinking a new Wolverine and a new team of non-classic characters is a safe flagship to bet on...

A series reboot and getting everyone into the same time period would really best way to move forward at this point, the franchise is too spread out across all these years.

 

I suppose, but the MCU has the Avengers as the big movie where everyone teams up. As spread out as the timelines are they are never going to get that with the cast from Apocalypse and Deadool and presumably X-23, etc... and with Jackman leaving... essentially the core X-men team now is going to be lacking a Wolverine on their team, who are they going to get to replace that slot on the team?

I mean with the MCU... they had a WWII story but they moved Cap from that to the modern times, they didn't just let him stay there. The best thing about a combined universe is seeing the different characters interact.... the way the X timeline works or appears to work now, it kind of makes that a very low chance.

I mean as of now my best hope for X-Force is it involves Cable going through time and recruting people, so just apperars to Psylocke after the end of Apocalypse and recruits her, goes to Deadpool does the same, goes into the far future to get X-23, etc... I mean at this point time travel seems to be the only way to actually get these people together in teamups.

 

Having different teams in different eras works. X-Factor in one time period, X-Force in another, etc. Besides, we all know that they'll recast Wolverine sooner or later.

 

What you're saying makes perfect sense. Honestly, I gave up on Singer's X-Men after Days of Future Past and will see this Wolverine film next year because I like Hugh in the role.

And you're spot on with a series reboot and I'll add Singer getting the boot.

I'll just say for me, one of the many cool things about X-Men is that there is an X person for everyone, fans of the films and comics haven't really had much of an opportunity to know many characters after the initial movie. Brief moments and/or cannon fodder. Singer has overplayed the same four characters instead of slowly diversifying the mutants that appeared and giving larger roles to mutants people responded to. We never really had that opportunity because Singer and Fox (and Vaughn) have played it safe and keep mucking up the time line.

Frankly, I wanted more with Bishop, Blink etc. from DoFP. Just as I wanted more with Azazel, Havoc etc. in First Class. They were interesting to me because they were new and their powers were different. And then they get killed off...

For a few years, I was cranky about Maverick not being a part of the cinematic Team X (even his incarnation as Agent Zero was changed completely). Now I am grateful he never made the cut, but for those interesting mutants who did make the cut and were quickly killed off, it's just an absolute shame they went that route.They had the opportunity to push other mutants, they chose not to.

I can't comment on the whole time line etc. 1) because I just don't care about Singer's take on the X-Men and 2) I've forgotten most of it anyway, but I appreciate your posts and taking the time to think these things through.

And I'll say I am glad Deadpool was a hit (no I haven't rented it yet), but it proves people will try other mutants especially if they bring something different to the table and be a bit closer to the source material.

 

If Fox is going out of it's way to make an old Wolverine movie and trumpeting the fact it's one last time, I kinda doubt in 2 years we'll see a movie with like, Sam Worthington as Wolverine. Also Jackman is up there with RDJ with actor identified with the character level. The character after Wolverine 3 is probably gonna be off the table for a bit. And Deadpool / Gambit will be the new ubiquitous X-Men.

 

Yeah I pretty much agree with everything you said about the franchise. DoFP was definitely the worst cinematic experience I've had, it was just a betrayal of every promise and expecation the franchise left me with First Class. It completely convinced me for the X-men franchise to continue into the future Singer must go and they must reboot back to square one. Too much damage has been done already.

Did love Blink, still recall how the actress had a 3 movie deal and Kinberg said she'd be in Apocalypse... that turned out well.

At this point I'm only interested to see the characters I like, so long as they look like the characters. Psylocke was literally the only reason I saw Apocalypse, and if i was able to just watch a cut with just her scenes I would gladly have done that instead.
The next Wolverine movie... I like X-23, if she looks and acts like X-23 I might give it a shot. But other than Deadpool and hopefully X-Force I don't have much faith in the rest and they'll have to convince me to give any of the others a shot.

At this point I honestly expect the next X-men movie in the 90s to be Xavier, Magneto, Mystique, and Wolverine moping in civilian clothes in the mansion because 10 years ago Jean exploded into the Dark Phoenix and killed everyone and died 5 seconds after the end of Apocalypse. I mean that's essentially how they segued from First Class to Days.

And I'd recommend seeing Deadpool, it's at this point the 2nd best X-men movie despite only having 2 X-men(well 1 if you only count comics where I don't recall Negasonic being an X-men but just Emma Frosts's student on Genosha) but Colossus looks and acts like Colossus and if they did a whole X-men movie with that same devotion to the characters we'd have a great X-men movie.

 

Wolverine: makes sense given what the comic arm did. Anyway, you guys win.
Ignore the long time Wolvie fan buffing her Weapon X helmet in the corner here.

 

Watching Deadpool felt like watching a cartoon. I was half expecting someone to have an anvil drop on their head and walk away bouncing like an accordion with a chagrined look on their face. I liked it, but if that movie had taken itself seriously, I would have hated it.

 

I think that was the whole point!

 

Again, no official confirmation the girl in the set photos is Laura Kinney. Much like the wide speculation that Wolverine 3 was going to be Old Man Logan.

However, I wouldn't put it past Fox to put Laura in Wolvie 3, as they really don't care about timelines, character ages or continuity. They could drop X-23 in the film for the dollars.

I'm hoping the little girl is either Gabby, Zelda or Bellona.

 

Clones? It would be like the x-men universe meets orphan black.

I'm not familiar with X-23's clones comic story at all, which comic/comics is that from?

 

It's the first story arc of the very recent All New Wolverine called "Four Sisters."




And speaking of Orphan Black, I would love if Tatiana Maslany played Laura Kinney.



If you want to read up on X-23, I'd recommend X-23: Target X as it's a good origin story has nice artwork. Plus it introduces X-23's arch nemesis that set to appear in the All New Wolverine series.

 

Watched it today, it was good overall other than Mystique being everywhere simply because her actor was famous.

The post credit scene got me excited, we FINALLY got to see Mr. Sinister. Was he going to clone Jean, or Wolverine?

 

I know that was the point, but my point is that it only works because it is self-aware and meta. However, something just like that, but earnest and not meta is the kind of thing you seem to want.

 

As for the biggest problem of the movie, I think a powerful villain like Apocalypse requires more than 1 movie and a post credit scene to set up and finish the arc.

Also, was Mr. Sinister behind the Future Sentinel's design, this could explain why those Sentinels were out of control and got the ability to absorb the DNA the Mystique.

 

Unpopular opinion alert: I think X-Men: The Last Stand does more with the X-universe and progressing the characters than X-Men: Apocalypse does. Apocalypse is much more artistically done, and the character moments are much more resonant, but things a-happen in Last Stand and everything is pretty much still status quo at the end of Apocalypse.

I do like the hook that Apocalypse is a cult leader and I think it's effectively but the movie doesn't exactly pay it off that well. Oh, and did anyone notice the 30 seconds or so when Apocalypse first woke up and he's kinda ... scared for a minute, encased in his stone tomb and his breath starts to accelerate. That's the only moment in the movie where he seems sort of human ... and then he goes all God-like monologues for the rest of the flick.

 

I think the events in XMA are a test of the team that develops and strengthens them. It's also the first formation of the team, after the off-camera events between FC and DOFP basically reset all of the team's progress in FC. A friend of mine complained that all of the movies since FC have been about recruiting new members who come into their own during the course of the movie. When are they going to actually be in their own, instead of constantly coming into it? I argued that if it wasn't for that aspect of the story, you'd just have 'freak of the week' style stories in each movie, where a villain is introduced and the heroes take him down. It's fine for a weekly show where you can develop other small interpersonal plot threads on the side over the course of a season, but in movies coming out every two years you can't really do that.

So you have to have some other narrative device to make things interesting beyond the fighting the bad guy. The Avengers movies and Cap 3 have used the conflict between the internal members of the team as this other drama, where it came to a head in Cap 3 and will likely continue over the next several MCU flicks. Iron Man 3 had the PTSD and nervous breakdown plot thread, which I didn't really find that interesting, felt like more of a gimmick really. Same with Stark's imminent death and drinking of denial in Iron Man 2. YMMV.

Besides, the X-Men began their life in the comics as teenagers, where their struggle with, and learning to control, their powers was meant to resonate with the comics' adolescent readers and be a metaphor for their journey into adulthood. As such, if the movies keep perpetually dealing with that forever, it couldn't be more appropriate.

I agree with you about Apocalypse, but then the refrain in here is that he wasn't god-like and extravagant enough.

 

X-3: The Last Stand might be my 3rd favorite X-Men film. Why? Because by the time we got to this film, I stopped caring about the franchise being faithful to the source material and Wolverine was a proper member of the X-Men as he was a teacher or sorts. I didn't care that Cyclops died, because Singer crapped his character from the get-go. Moreover, I thought the plot and the pace of the film was intriguing and threaten mutants more than the previous two films. Additionally, the film was more light hearted and had a good amount fun action sequences. I love the Juggernaut in this film.

Let's not forget that Last Stand, set up the Kitty and Bobby relationship that was featured in Days of Future Past.

 

Last Stand also has insanely bad dialogue, Famke Janssen looking tired, and unintentionally hilarious moments such as Professor X's "death". The bridge moving sequence was cool I guess.

 

You shall NOT pass!

 

Nothing will ever be as bad as Storm's line in Singer's original X-Men film, "Know what happens to a toad when it's struck by lighting? The same thing that happens to everything else."

 

The rest of the dialogue in the original (written by David "Solid Snake" Hayter) is great though such as:

Cyclops: Say something that only the real Wolverine would say.

Wolverine: You're a ****?