1. The Jedi Council Forum Rules have been revised.

    View the revisions here, and see the Communications thread for more details.

X3 (X-men 3) Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed

Discussion in 'Archive: SF&F: Films and Television' started by Tabula Rasa, Jan 20, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Juliet316 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 27, 2005
    star 8
    It was in USA Today's Weekend edition. It also quoted a Fox executive that stated that yes, Jackman would play Wolverine in the Wolvie spinoff and that they want Ian McKellan around to anchor the Magneto project.
  2. marc_craigwb Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2005
    star 1
    i agree,however after seeing it all my fears were for nothing-its a great film and i think it was very brave to kill off cyclops xavier and jean grey-it really felt like the final film,sure theres still room for spinoffs and prequels but it pulled off a movie with endless characters without becoming a mess-i never felt short changed by any character apart from maybe cyclops death.if its possible to make a good movie with multiple heroes/villains lets see spidey or bats kicking more than one ass at atime-we know they can cope
  3. malkieD2 Ex-Manager and RSA

    Member Since:
    Jun 7, 2002
    star 7
    I hardly think so sunshine ;)

    You can't 'pick apart' someone's subjective opinion of a piece of media.
  4. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    Not your opinion, sunshine. You're entire outlook. (Technically, yeah I can. You posted it in plain words, so I can. Anyway, I'll stop, it's your right, sorry.)

    That said, how will they even get the Emma thing to where it needs to be? Not be introducing her as the White Queen of the Hellfire Club, I hope.
  5. Sn4tcH Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2004
    star 4
    While we're at "picking apart". What about the handling of Sabertooth in X-men.

    He had nearly no interaction with Wolverine and considering how important they are in each others pasts, it was absolutely atrocious how they handled it. Not to mention he and Mystique hardly looked at each other, despite the fact they have a child together in the comics.

    Speaking of children, where the heck were Pietro, Wanda, or even Lorna for that matter!? Magneto AND his children should have been involved in the first film!

    And since this was the first film, why didn't they use the first team of Cyclops, Marvel Girl, Angel, Beast, and Ice Man? Or heck they could have started with the second team with Cyclops, Thunderbird, Colossus, Nightcrawler, Storm, Sunfire, Wolverine, and Banshee!? Seriously! This is a bastardization of a sacred institution!

    And Senator Kelly was killed, so the following movies after that should have been set in the "Days of Future Past" timeline, correct? Your telling me Mystique stuck around for that long? I doubt it.

    And where the heck is Wolverines Japanese background info!? This is essential to understanding Wolverines psyche and sense of honor! But he wasn't quite feral either... this isn't Wolverine at all!!!

    And Rouge! She can't fly, she doesn't have strength, and she sucks! These are my memories that they are destroying!

    Oh and then there's X2... a whole nother can of worms!

    First and foremost, Mystique and Nightcrawler, mother and son... BARELY EVEN LOOK AT EACH OTHER!? What the heck!? Bryan Singer should be burned alive!

    William Stryker. Sorry... REVEREND WILLIAM STRYKER! That's right, William Stryker was a preacher in the comics, with some military background. Thus the name of the arc "God Loves, Man Kills". By taking the reverend aspect out of the story, it destroys the story!

    And he has a mutant psychic son!? No no, I don't think so. William Stryker killed his wife and his son out of rage because his son was born a mutant. This caused Styker to think that the reason why God had given him a mutant son was a sign that he must rid the world of mutants... Why don't they just piss in every X-men fans mouth and tell them to enjoy it while their at it!

    And Xavier gets brainwashed, not psychic *****-slapped by some mutant psycho noob who looked like a little girl in the past apparently.

    Oh and Stryker was stopped by his own men, NOT Wolverine and Magneto...

    And Lady Deathsrike... I knew thee well. In the comics at least, not as the terrible movie character with no depth at all, and AGAIN a Wolverine nemesis neutered to the point where they're NOTHING like they should be.

    And Pheonix, what the heck does Pheonix have to do with this story!!!?

    So in closing Bryan Singer raped my childhood, and David Hayter (or David "X-men fan" Hayter as I like to call him) should be locked away forever, because he is a stupid poo head.

    [/sarcasm]

    Now after all this, don't I sound stupid? I don't like the fact that there's certain people saying, "Well the hardcore comic fans don't like X3". That's BS. I AM a hardcore comic fan, and I think X3 was flawed but FINE! Do you know why? Because they've torn apart the comics enough with X-men and X2, so I didn't expect X3 to be anything like the comics either!

    Do I think the original X-men film has a stupid story and that they had already completely changed the characters for the worse by then end of it? Yes. Do I think by changing William Stryker into a military advisor instead of him being a preacher took the heart out of the story in X2? Yes. Do I think the way Jean and Scott were used in X3 were bad? Yes.

    Do I still enjoy all three X-men movies? YES!
  6. Darth-Lando Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 6
  7. -Phoenix- Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 21, 2005
    star 5
    I haven't said it before, but...





    Sn4tcH FTW
  8. Darth_BADLungs_Vader Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2006
    star 1
    Saw the movie on sunday and I liked it. It had some realy good action and for a marvel film I thought it delivered two fun hours of strong entertainment. Though the movie was fun it could have been alot better. Some of the main charecters were just pulled off screen for new ones to come in. Cyclops was treated like a piece of *****. Xavier should not have died and Magneto got over it way to fast as he did with musique. Jean should have stayed dead and what the hell happened to pyro and juggernaut? Did they survive or were they killed by Jean? It should have been half an hour or so longer because the movie just feels realy realy rushed. That aside it was cool and fun and Id give it a 4/6 rating.[face_peace]
  9. Sn4tcH Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2004
    star 4
    By the way... I'll never take the name of David Hayter in vain again.

    The man wrote the screenplay for X-men and X2, and he does the voice of Solid Snake in MGS and Captain America in X-men, Spider-man, and any other cartoon where Captain America has appeared. He is like a god.
  10. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    None of the films thus far missed the main story by this much, if you'll agree.

    God Loves, Man Kills had the essence there, as did the Mags encounter.
    This completely misses Phoenix.

    I'm not pissed because the film doesn't live to the comics, it's a separate entity entirely. I'm pissed because it didn't do justice to the first two in wrapping up the plot.
  11. Sn4tcH Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2004
    star 4
    Well I think it did, I watched all three of them in row. It works well when you watch it that way. As you get where the characters are and everything in the first two, and three is just the ending. The climax, the final battle, and so on. I didn't expect a big heavy story, the first two had set that up.

    And, IMO, I think what they did to Stryker in X2 is much worse than what they did to Jean in X3 as far as completely destroying what the character was like in the comics. The essence of "God Loves, Man Kills" is completely dependant on the fact that William Stryker is a reverend. And also I think if they were going to do Stryker right, they should not have done him at all. But that's just an opinion.

    And as for missing the main story, I didn't see anything that really resembled any story from the X-men comics in all three. I see a lot of characters that act kinda like they did in the comics. But not enough for me to burn anyone alive because it wasn't "exactly like the comics". I mean look at X-men, none of that ever happened... I can't judge a stories loyalty to the comics, if the story never happened in the comics, right? So, that first movie set the tone for me and what to expect for the rest of the series. The fact that they tried to actually adapt one of the stories to film with X2 did suprise me, but they way they strayed from the main point of that arc also suprised me too (Again, if you're not going to do it right, don't do it).

    When you look at all three X-men and X3 just don't resemble anything that even looks like the comics. And X2 just missed the point.

    But again, that didn't make me think any less of the films in the end. They're their own self-contained little world. Like Ultimate X-men. The films have nothing to do with the comics besides the name, so why should I expect them to be perfect?
  12. Yodas-evil-twin Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2005
    star 5
    A-*******-men!
  13. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    Alright. Again, it's not like I hate it, I just can't believe that everyone thinks it lives up to the first two.
  14. ComicDiva Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 27, 2004
    star 4
  15. KissMeImARebel Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2003
    star 4
    I'm gonna have to agree that X2 did drop the ball on the GLMK story a bit. Though at least it managed to hit on Stryker's personal vendetta regarding a mutant son - at the core, it was still a personal issue driving the guy wacky. It's a shame it dodged the religious fanaticism though.

    For me, X3 just got it completely wrong with the Phoenix Saga - and it's amplified IMHO by the fact that it involved team members. Villains like Stryker come and go - but characters like Jean and Scott - these are our heroes.

    And while X2 just excised the themes of GLMK, X3 mangled themes AND characters - not to mention this is it for Scott and Jean - this is their legacy - blech (IMHO).

    There was only one important thing X3 had to have for me: Jean defeating the Phoenix via willpower and sacrificing herself, and Cyke being the one to calm her down so she could do this.

    That's it. That would have satisfied me.

    It's really annoying because if you watch the X2 commentary - the writers had talked about doing the Dark Phoenix Saga in X2 and envisioned an ending with Phoenix using Cyke's optic blast to commit suicide - seriously why couldn't we have had that?


    And speaking of religious fanaticism, here's an X3 review that would make the Rev. Stryker proud. I got a kick out of it. (hat-tip to SHH)
  16. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    Both of you last two hit exactly on what I'm trying to say, although I think KissMe got a little closer.

    That said, thanks Diva for pointing out the GLARING INCONSISTENCIES AND MISTAKES in the argument.

    He is the exception, no doubt.
  17. JediPrettyBoy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 10, 2005
    star 4
    I've only seen X3 once, but do we really know that Scott is dead? We see his glasses floating which makes us assume, once the movie is over, that she vaporized him, but what do we really have that confirms his death? I can't remember every scene, and when she starts to lose it in the mansion with Wolverine, those scenes of her and Scott went by kind of quickly.
  18. Darth-Lando Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 6
    No, it never shows Scott die, and when Wolverine asks her she never confirms it.
  19. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    But it's likely that he's dead, I just don't think they had time to film the scene because Jimmy Marsden left with Singer.
  20. Darth-Lando Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2002
    star 6
    But he didn't "leave with Singer". Notice he was still in the movie. Note that he was commited to Superman Returns before they even had a director for X3, let alone a timetable for when they will be filming. Are actors not allowed to work on more than one movie now? I highly doubt that the character's death has anything to do with the actor, besides the possibility of a scheduling conflict for shooting.

    Anyone that knows anything about comics knows that character's are never dead for good unless there's a body. And sometimes, not even then. (i.e. Colossus)
  21. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    Yes, but did he himself not state that he couldn't film that much because of his committment to Superman Returns?

    I have my facts straight.
  22. ObiWanCon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 15, 2004
    star 4
    The Fox suits didn't want Cyclops in the movie at all because Marsden was working on Superman they were bitter about Singer but then they were convinced to add him back into the script and they managed to fit Marsden in a little without major problems so it comes down to what would you prefer Cyclops not in the movie at all or the small part we got personal I?m not sure I thought Marsdens performance in the movie was one of the highlights but I didn?t want him to die so it?s very hard what do you guys think.
  23. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    Uh...a lot to digest, but yeah.
  24. Sn4tcH Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2004
    star 4
    So, I was just thinking. If they ever did decide to do an X4, I think Planet X would make a good storyline to end it with. For those of you who don't know the story, Magneto had kept himself hidden by becoming a teacher in Xaviers School (in diguise of course). He finally reveals himself, and re-cripples Charles, and within the course of one day, conquers NYC and makes it into a giant Mutant safe house/Human concentration camp (which I found interesting, as Magneto had finally went from Holocaust survivor to a Hitler like figure). Now during the story, Wolverine and Jean are stuck on Astroid M. As it begins to burn up (because it's heading towards the sun) Wolverine stabs Jean to put her out of her missery. What this does instead is releases the Pheonix Consciousness and brings Jean and the Pheonix back at full strength. Anyways, a huge battle happens, Magneto kills Pheonix, which leads Wolverine to kill Magneto.

    Now this could EASILY be turned into a movie. Instead of having Magneto be hiding in Xaviers mansion, he could just laying low while getting his strength back up. Wolverine already HAS stabbed Pheonix, so she could come back at any time, and it could be explained that Pheonix was more than just a seperate personality of Jean. Then we can get some real Pheonix effects with flames and such. Also, Cyclops makes a return in those issues too, because he had been gone for a while because he had cheated on Jean with Emma Frost. And that takes care of a Cyclops return. For the film just say Jean injured him, and he had to take time to heal.

    I know it's a lot to swallow, and I don't think I'm writing it in a very easy to understand way. Just go on Wikipedia and look up Planet X to get the story. But I really think it would fix things with the right director. The story has the return of Cyclops, the return of Pheonix, the death of Pheonix, and the death of Magneto. And I know most of the events have been retconned away (Which still pisses me off as that story was one of my favorite X-men stories in a LONG time), but it would make a good ending to the films.

    With all that said, I am one of the people who believe that X3 is the last real X-men film. But I do feel X3 didn't feel like a good enough ending, and I think something epic like the events of Planet X would make an awesome ending...

    And this whole post kinda came out of nowhere... heh.
  25. one_armed_scissor_14 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2005
    star 3
    I would actually prefer the Ages of Apocalypse to be told.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.