"Yo Joe!" G.I. Joe Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Archive: SF&F: Films and Television' started by Quiet_Mandalorian, Jan 31, 2009.

  1. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    Maybe I'm just drinking the KoolAid, but I believe the studio's reasoning. Critics won't be fair about it at all. The film critic at the paper where I work (this guy is an angry movie snob) walked around for days saying how bad Transformers 2 was going to be, and he trashed it in his review. He's allowed to do so, but the review seemed predetermined, and was completely unfair.
  2. Koohii Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 30, 2003
    star 5
    No, you're not in Jonestown. There are a number of valid points in that article. Esp that fanboys ripped on the Transformers movies, saying they sucked. Oh yeah, I'm one of them.
  3. Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2000
    star 6
    I totally understand the studio's strategy, and it's a good one. But I don't agree with the notion of critics being unfair. The first Transformers was a bad movie, so there was no reason to expect the second to be better. It wasn't, so they were under no obligation to pretend it was. Most big action movies are critic-proof these days anyways; if the bangs and booms and boobs are big enough, audiences will see it.
  4. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2005
    star 5
    I don't. It's entirely possible to make a geeky genre-film that both audiences and critics enjoy, as The Dark Knight, Iron Man, Spider-Man and Spider-Man 2 and numerous other films have demonstrated. Unfortunately, it seems rather doubtful that that will be the case here.
  5. The_Smirking_Revenge Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2008
    star 2

    I think it's already been established that you're a mega-fan... We get it. Why? I'll never understand.

    -T_S_R
  6. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    There are hundreds -- maybe thousands -- of critics, and not all of them go into a film with an open mind, ready to judge a picture based on what it aims to do. A lot of critics are elitists, who will never give films like G.I. Joe a fair shot. Many will, but a lot will not. For instance, if you read Rex Reed's review of the first Transformers, at no time does he examine the screenplay, or how possible thematic elements were cultivated. Instead he spends three paragraphs saying how stupid the premise is!

    You can't go into a Transformers film and attack it because it has robots disguised as cars, and they chase around an energy "Cube." That's not fair.

    And not everybody thought the Transformers films were bad -- a lot of critics gave them positive reviews. I'm sorry if I'm wrong, and I don't mean to sound confrontational, but your tone about the Transformers films sounds very authoritative. I understand it's your opinion, but your passing it off as if it's this widely accepted truth that the TRansformers films were horrible, and any critic that dared to like them were under some "obligation" as you put it to do so.

    And I completely disagree with your analysis on audiences. While it's true that many people won't care to watch No Country For Old Men, and leave pondering the theme that the decline of manners and traditional values brings upon the destruction of society. But that's not to say that audiences (on some level) don't appreciate basic elements like characterization and story structure.

    From my point of view, I thought the first Transformers film had a solid script that built to an exciting conclusion, featured likable characters, and a great sense of excitement and wonder. The sequel, while a bit fat, expanded themes and story while creating a familiar environment that audiences liked. Based on audience reaction and box office, I'd say that those elements resonated with people.
  7. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    I'm not a "mega-fan", I'm just willing to give the film a fair shake based on the fun-looking trailers. I'll be right here complaining about any aspect of the movie that fails to impress me once I've seen it.
  8. Jedi Vince Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 2, 1999
    star 3
    I saw the film at a midnight screening last night.

    The action was well-crafted, but it was hard to enjoy it because the entire picture seemed pulled down by an absolutely pathetic screenplay. In a film that aims to be popcorn escapism, there better me likable characters. It's hard to mess up SnakeEyes, but the rest just came off as cold and distant.

    Again, since the script was all over the place, there really wasn't a narrative there at all. Consequently, I found them not only to be uninteresting, but poorly executed as well.

    Oh well ... at least I enjoyed three action scenes, and Rachel Nichols' hotness.
  9. Jedi_Johnson Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 6, 2002
    star 5
    I think I'm going to give it a chance this weekend. I'm slightly optimistic. I mean Michael Bay waited until Transformers 2 to rape my childhood at least. Hopefully its the same with GI Joe. [face_praying]
  10. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2005
    star 5
    My childhood officially died when I heard Marlon Wayans stating that Scarlett was going to be his character's "love interest".
  11. Raven Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 5, 1998
    star 6
    Even in movies that are reviewed badly, there are generally critics ? even ?Cream of the Crop? critics ? who like the films. They generally don't suggest movies like Transformers or GI Joe should win Oscars, but they'll call them worth going to see. Even movies that receive good reviews and win Oscars have top-notch critics that pan them. There aren't many movies that have gotten universally positive reviews. A prime example of that phenomenon is Star Trek ? the vast majority of critics liked the movie, but some big names like Roger Ebert didn't. Some fans really hated it for multiple reasons.

    I don't think that you can wield reviews as authoritative statements about whether someone's opinion on a movie is wrong. I'm not going to say that someone who dislikes Star Trek is wrong. I'll say we disagree. The 2007 Transformers movie is currently scoring 68% on Rotten Tomatoes among the ?Cream of the Crop? critics, which isn't a terribly bad score. And yet, people routinely make the argument that the movie was terrible. I can see their points ? some I very strongly agree with, some I don't ? but that doesn't mean that blanket authoritative statements that the movie was terrible are legitimate.

    As for GI Joe, I think that there was a valid concern that predetermined notions about the film would sink it by weight of terrible reviews before release. Looking at the reviews, they are bad overall, with the movie scoring 33% on the Cream of the Crop at Rotten Tomatoes. From a marketing perspective, holding off on reviews made sense.

    I went in to the movie expecting it to be terrible. I have absolutely no childhood connection to GI Joe (I've watched very little television, even as a child I'd go find other things to do than watch TV), and I thought that the trailer was laughably bad.

    I enjoyed the film. I'm not saying that I'd call it a great film by any means, but it's not a terrible film. I'd give it two and a half stars out of four, which is basically my rating for movies that I enjoyed enough that I'd get on DVD and will happily show up for a sequel to but won't bother seeing in theatres again. The Ripcord character was a little annoying, but if it wasn't for his relationship with Scarlet he'd be fine ? those two had absolutely no chemistry and the movie ground to a halt whenever their romantic plot came up. The Duke/Baroness relationship was fun, and I hope that it does have a happy ending if sequels occur (perhaps have her go back to Cobra in the first sequel, but use a scene like the last scene of RoC to show that she's actually on the Joe side, and then have her sabotage Cobra in the third part?).

    The action was really what the movie was about, and it did it well. I was never bored, and the eye candy stayed interesting and varied the entire way through. Overall, better than the first Transformers movie in my opinion. I left the theatre with a smile on my face and feeling like my money was well spent, which is really all I ask from a movie.
  12. gonzoforce Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 27, 2002
    star 5
    I saw it, it was better than I thought it would be, actually much better than Transformers, but that's not saying much.

    I watched the cartoon as a kid, and vaguely remember the 80's animated movie.
  13. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    Saw it and loved it. It's the cartoon come to life. I'd give it 3.8 out of 4, the only way it could have been better would be if it was longer and had a larger cast.

    I thought the characters were great. I still say Scarlett was just being friendly and humoring Ripcord, afterall Scarlett was intimate with Snake Eyes resting herself on him and all.

    Destro was great. Cobra Commander was amazing, his voice was so over the top comic book evil, just like it should be.

    Baroness... eh, if it turns out she is faking being good and is really just going to break Cobra Commander and Destro out in the sequel all will be forgiven.

    I have to say the movie follwed the cartoon series formula quite well. Cobra Commander being captured so he can escape and start his revenge.

    Ripcord didn't really annoy me at all. I actually thought he was funny and a good character.
    Now that the Rise of Cobra is done, I can't wait for the Revenge of Cobra.
  14. gundarkhunter Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 2, 2008
    star 3
    Saw this for the first time tonight. It wasn't as good as it could've been but it was cool summer eye candy which, to be honest, was about all I expected out of this movie after reading some reviews.

    A few more call backs to A Real American Hero such as giving Cobra Commander his cloth mask or battle helmet or giving "Ripcord" a code-name more fitting the character he portrayed(Ace comes to mind) or just plain using more of the orginal storyline and character development that Hama had already given us, would have been nice.

    There were just a few other things I didn't like but, overall, I did enjoy it.

    Best part of the evening, though, was being escorted out of the theatre by the cops for having Cobra costumes that were a little too scary.
    [face_skull] [face_skull] [face_skull]

    COBRAAAA!!!!!
  15. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2005
    star 5
    I don't think you remember the cartoon very well.
  16. darthcaedus1138 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2007
    star 5
    This was a great cartoon movie!!!
  17. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    I just watched all of season one. ;)

    It fits the cartoon formula so well though.
    1. Cobra unveils some mass destruction weapon.
    2. Small team of Joes fights Cobra.
    3. Duke gets captured.
    4. Massive battle between Joe vehicles and Cobra vehicles.
    5. Cobra Commander gets captured at the end only to escape in the next episode.

    And honestly Ripcord was not bad at all. He was a great comic relief, not inept just funny.
  18. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    You'll need expand on this Q_M because it is very much like the cartoon coming to life.

    I think the film delivered in every way that a G.I.Joe film could. It took parts from the cartoon, parts from the comic and mixed it all together into a very fun flick. The Snake Eyes/Storm Shadow back story was excellent, pretty much copied and pasted from the comic.

    And I really liked the story triangle involving Duke, CC and Baroness. It really gave the characters motivation for their actions and added to the drama of the film.

    All in all I found this to be the best summer blockbuster thus far. If you didn't like G.I.Joe before your not going to like it now, but this film delivers on a lot of levels and is pure fun. Just don't go in expecting Saving Private Ryan or another serious military flick. Thats not what G.I.Joe has ever been about.:)

    G.I.Joe is very Sci-Fi and very silly and thats what it needed to be.
  19. Merlin_Ambrosius69 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 4, 2008
    star 5
    Sounds like fun, thanks to all for the reviews! I haven't had a chance yet -- it was sold out yesterday at the two times I had allotted -- but I plan on seeing it soon. The 95% positive reviews I'm hearing sound very encouraging. The only people still dissing the movie are those who haven't even seen it!
  20. Gobi-1 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 22, 2002
    star 5
    Went in with zero expectations but I enjoyed the film. As B Grade entertainment it hits the mark. Not great by any means but as popcorn entertainment it's just good enough. Much, much better then the horrible Transformers 2. However there's certainly room for improvement. At the top of that list would be making Cobra Commander look like Cobra Commander. The ending to this film would have been epic if CC had been wearing his iconic helmet or hood. It would have been a great payoff. Hopefully they'll correct this in the sequel if there is one. They also need to cut down on the CGI and focus more on the military hardware they have. Having more stuff happen in camera on location. Overall though I enjoyed the film and even I don't remember the cartoon series all that well but I think the film did a good job of being a live action cartoon. I welcome the sequel.

    G.I. Joe: Cobra Strikes
    Summer 2011 ???

  21. Quiet_Mandalorian Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 19, 2005
    star 5
    Yes, and...?

    And pretty much only the formula, it would seem. It's formulaic. That's a problem.

    Numerous reviews and Marlon Wayans' filmography say otherwise. :p

    I?m not particularly interested in seeing a big-budget movie version of the cartoon, any more than I would Super Friends. Those are things best enjoyed in the context they were created in, which is a roundabout way of saying that if Batman got The Dark Knight despite the tremendous silliness of the old live-action TV show or the Joel Schumacher movies, why can?t G.I. Joe get a similarly respectful, high-quality film adaptation of the Larry Hama comics?

    Fixed.

    Um, no. Just no. The SE/SS backstory the movie presents you with is one part Sigma 6 SE/SS and one part Firefly backstory from the later comics. About the only thing true to the original comics about it is the the Hard Master's death and Storm Shadow being blamed for it

    It really messed things up, particularly with Duke?s constant inability to shoot the Baroness calling into question Hawk?s judgment in letting on the team in the first place.

    You?re just continuing to demonstrate that you have no real familiarity with the Marvel comics (which is to say, with the origin of the whole mythos). May I direct your attention to G.I. Joe #109?

    Think so? [face_whistling] ;)
  22. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 10
    Well that kinda sucked. I'm actually kinda angry since they blew perfect casting for some characters because of the other awful acting and terrible script. Not as angry as most of the audience I saw the movie with (I don;t think I've ever heard angrier comments from people walking out of a movie ever). But mildly pissed.

    It is somewhat similar to The Mummy in that it came close to getting a lot of things right but fell far enough away from the makr to make them awful. Sadly I don't see a future GI Joe movie being able to pull a "Mummy Returns" and perfect those things because this first GI Joe movie is still even worse than the first Mummy movie.

    And you know what? Marlon Wayons wasn't anywhere near the worst thing in this movie- in fact, he's not annoying at all. He's comic relief, but he's far from being Jar jar or whatever. It's the stuff that's not supposed to be funny that awfl.

    The good:

    -Snake Eyes & Storm Shadow
    -Zartan
    -France Chase (though mostly ruined by them starting every trailer ever with the eifel tower's destruction)
    -Underwater Battle
    -Follows the cartoon formula
    -Cobra Commander's performance
    -Cool hardware

    The bad:
    -Cobra Commander not really being in the movie until the last 10 minutes (up until then we think he's Mindbender) and not wearing his iconic mask or hood (which, as stated above, might have made for a really awesome moment to end with that is otherwise ruined by the actual ending of the movie's plot).
    -Duke's actor, who is so dull and so heavily focused on we really don't care abotu the entire story at all, which drags down the otehrwise decent action sequences.
    -The Baroness is ruined (WHY would you make her a good guy all along? W.T.H. WTH?!!)
    -Quaid's surprisingly disconnected performance- I would have thought he'd have been the easiest to succeed here.
    -The script is awful, especially the flashbacks which is just so bad and cliche you can predict almost every single line of dialogue before it happens. It's takes a lot of screwing up to take the cartoon formula and render a script that is worse than half of the actual 80's cartoon plots!

    It's just a damn shame.

    Go watch GI Joe: Resolute instead and don't watse your time here.
  23. GenAntilles Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2007
    star 4
    Well you said I don't remember the cartoon very well and I pointed out I had recently watched all of season 1 thus showing that I do remember the cartoon quite well. ;)


    But it's such a good formula. Why ruin a good thing?


    I still say he was great in the role. :)


    Huh, the audience I had loved it and it was just the regular matinee crowd, not any die hard Joe fans.
    Since it was the Rise of Cobra I can say I?m glad with the Cobra Commander we got. Better than having him already be Commander without us seeing the rise, but that?s just my opinion. I?m fully confident with Joseph Gordon Levits performance he will nail the role of Cobra Commander by the next movie. Not to mention Sommers has said he hopes to have the chrome mask in the next movie.

    I thought Duke was good, but I agree it would have been better if they hadn?t constantly shown him hesitating to kill the Baroness. But more than likely Flint will get some of his screen time in the next movie, just like the cartoon. I would immensely enjoy a Flint/Lady Jaye romance subplot in the next movie over the Duke/Baroness one.

    And on the Baroness. Like I said if she goes back to being evil, even if it is just her nanites being reactivated, all will be forgiven. Of course I?m still not convinced she?s good. Cobra Commander?s ultimate plan many have use of her gaining the trust of G.I. Joe?s field commander.

    I am very disappointed that Quaids scene with Destro in the hall
  24. Black-Tiger Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2008
    star 3
    Yes, that's exactly what I was going to say. And you who ask for a live action cartoon call yourselves G.I. Joe fans?! No, you're just fans of the baby cartoon, not the more mature comicbook. Same happened with the 80's MOTU movie. The film makers were so drunk on the baby cartoon that they totally overlooked the more mature Marvel mini-comics (the REAL source material). And I have a very bad feeling they've done exactly the same with this movie, totally overlooked all the Marvel comics in favour of the cartoon fans. As a result I predict this film franchise will get a second movie if it's very, very lucky, but then it'll die a death, Schumacher style. Now, if it'd followed the comics it could've gone on to be a trilogy.

    And those who hope for a CC with hood, don't hold your breath because it WON'T HAPPEN. Reason for this is because the film makers have stated that the hood looks too KKK. In other words, this was a PC decision so nope, no hood for CC in any of the movies, that is if the movie makers have anything to do with it. As for the helmet, chances are PC will stop this too because of its similarities with WWII German Stormtrooper helmets. So nope, I very much doubt PC will allow this either.
  25. Kimball_Kinnison Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 28, 2001
    star 6
    Quit your whining.

    So what if someone else considers himself a fan of GI Joe because they enjoyed the TV show as a kid? The TV show had a much wider audience than the comics did, and holds a fond place in the memories of many people in the under 35 age group today. The toys that most of us played with were based more on the TV series than on the comics. (Remember, the whole idea behind the TV series was to market the toys.)

    So, who are you to look down your nose at someone like me, who never even knew the comics existed until I was in my 20s? I thoroughly enjoyed the TV series as a kid, and I look back on it with fond memories (even as I will mock it at times). I am looking forward to seeing this movie (I haven't had time to go with my fiancée yet, but hope to this week), and see it as a nostalgic tribute to something I loved as a kid.

    Kimball Kinnison