Yoda the strongest?????

I would like Yoda to be the strongest, as would most of us I think. But the fact remains that he didn't actually win one single fight. Was this wise of Lucas, I don't know, probably not. I think he should have owned Sideous, and the fight would have been interrupted or something. The problem is that Lucas has severly weakened our perception of Yoda, and as well Obi-wan (up until the Griveous and Anakin duel)... Does anyone have any ideas about this?

 

Yoda: Do not underestimate the powers of the Emperor, or suffer your fathers fate you will

It wouldn't have made sense to see Yoda beating the Emperor and hearing him say that in ROTJ (not to mention hiding away on Dagobah in the first place). However even though he doesn't beat Palpatine he certainly doesn't appear weak, they seem very evenly matched for the most part and it was just bad luck he fell from the senate pod and Palpatine hung on.

I also think you could argue Yoda beat Dooku, Dooku initiated the "contest" and ultimately was the one who fled because he realised he couldn't win. I certainly don't remember many people complaining Yoda came across as weak after AOTC came out, and he puts up a great fight with Palpatine.

 

I agree. The Sidious/Yoda duel was very evenly matched and Yoda certainly did not seem weak in it. But its like Slave2 said, it wouldn't be rgith for Yoda to beat the emperor and then run away.

 

I see what you mean, however, I do feel that Yoda doesn't come off as strong as I think many have pictured him. If we look towards Obi Wan, he comes off as a real punk fighting Dooku, in both scenes. Is it really GL's intentions to show off the dark side as stronger (even though Yoda plainly tells Luke it isn't)? I think Yoda would have bested Sideous, but according to the story he simply can't... can that be a reason?
I'm new to this site, so please, be kind

 

I don't see how Yoda could seem weaker to anyone based on his battles with Dooku and Sidious. The duel with Dooku was brief, and the duel ended as Dooku chickened out and tried to crush Skywalker and Kenobi. The duel with Sidious was a draw between the two most powerful Force users in the galaxy. Again an even duel, any impression of Sidious having the advantage holds up only because the "I have the high ground" theory, while Sidious was launching the Senate seating at him from levels above. He took all Sidious had and threw it right back at him until he went over the edge and couldn't grab anything. Hardly weak in my opinion...

 

Lucas showed how Sidous and Yoda were perfectly even.
Yoda would of beat Dooku and that's why he made a diversion to get away.

If Anakin gained Jedi Master status he would have easily been the most powerful Jedi ever in the history of the Order.

 

Well, according to AOTC DVD audio comment by Lucas the dark side is stronger - no matter what Yoda says in the OT. (I refer to the comment in the Shmi Skywalker burial scene).

I see your point and it's the same with me; the prequels have changed my perception of the OT in many ways, one of them being how to judge Yoda and Sidious. I was really surprised of how powerful - and not just with respect to duels - Lucas had decided to portray Sidious during all of the PT. Well, there has to be a reason for this. As for me, I've come to the conclusion that the point of the prequels is that the dark side is more powerful when it comes to fighting. And that beating the dark-siders with weapons is not the way.

 

I see all your points. And I agree with you to some extent that Yoda and Sideous was equally matched. There are however many how doesn't feel this way. And indeed Yoda fled.
One thing I thought about though, was Yoda suspicious towards Palpatine, look at episode 1 & 2, the looks he gives after some utterances of Palpatine...
But nobody has answered my questions of Obi Wan... How could he beat (or tie) with Anakin, when Anakin bested Dooku (which was weird, Sideous involved?) and Obi-Wan didn't seem to stand a chance against Dooku.
But is it really only me and mandragora who feels Yoda should have come out stronger than he did? I mean, I think Windu put up a perhaps better fight against Sideous than Yoda did (I'm not saying Yoda did poorly, but I like him, so I think he should have done bettter

 

I wouldn't say he "should have come out stronger". I had expected him to come out stronger - but I think this was due to me not understanding an important part of Lucas' message. As I see it now, I'm completely fine with it. It adds so much to the message of the Saga. I still like the Yoda, even though he not quite as flawless and invincible as I perceived him before. He doesn't need to be flawless or invincible for me to like him. And what adds even more to the Saga for me - while Sidious was just some weird wicked villain before, after having seen the prequels despite his malicious intentions I've developed some strange sort of respect for him.

 

I would like Yoda to be the strongest, as would most of us I think. But the fact remains that he didn't actually win one single fight. Was this wise of Lucas, I don't know, probably not. I think he should have owned Sideous, and the fight would have been interrupted or something.

I feel just the opposite. Lucas said the dark side is stronger on the AOTC DVD commentary, so I think the Emperor should have hurt Yoda a lot more badly in their duel. Some people feel the Emperor seems less powerful than before ROTS, which I don't think is a good thing.

 

I see all your points. And I agree with you to some extent that Yoda and Sideous was equally matched. There are however many how doesn't feel this way. And indeed Yoda fled.
One thing I thought about though, was Yoda suspicious towards Palpatine, look at episode 1 & 2, the looks he gives after some utterances of Palpatine...
But nobody has answered my questions of Obi Wan... How could he beat (or tie) with Anakin, when Anakin bested Dooku (which was weird, Sideous involved?) and Obi-Wan didn't seem to stand a chance against Dooku.
But is it really only me and mandragora who feels Yoda should have come out stronger than he did? I mean, I think Windu put up a perhaps better fight against Sideous than Yoda did (I'm not saying Yoda did poorly, but I like him, so I think he should have done bettter



I agree I think to some extent Yoda was a tad bit suspicous towards Palaptine. The reason Anakin beat Dooku and Obi-Wan did'nt is because Anakin used the Dark side to beat Dooku and Anakin is slightly stronger than Obi-Wan. Yoda came of just how I imagined him, wise beyond are imaginations I mean he is the Albert Einstien of Star Wars and he's pretty damn good with a light saber.

 

I would say Yoda is in like the top 5.

Good Stuff

 

Yoda believed that sumission to the will of the force was the way of things. Wheras the Sith believed the force was to be used as a weapon, or a tool. You see the differance? If Yoda practiced a passive submission to the Force itself, it makes sense that he would not have killed Sidious, because it was the will of the FOrce that the Chosen One( Anakin) bring balance. Just a theory.