Amph "You are of Bajor" A 'Trek' to 'Deep Space Nine'

Discussion in 'Community' started by Darth_Duck, Jan 4, 2006.

  1. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20061126025105/memoryalpha/en/images/6/66/Korworf.jpg]
    DS9 409: The Sword of Kahless
    -Premise: Klingon Dahar Master Kor, Jadzia Dax, and Worf search for the fabled Sword of Kahless on a remote planet in the Gamma Quadrant.

    -T2Q Comments: Kor returns, Worf references him and Kirk on Organia. That Lethian species attacks Kor with that psychic attack...has more impact after having seen that awful Bashir episode. Kor tells a good story. House of Duras's Torall returns from TNG Redemption. I think this is the first episode to reference back to the Emperor being a clone of Kahless.

    Slight editing error- the wide shot shows Dax raising her weapon at Worf and Kor, then goes to closeups for tension where she hasn't raised her weapon yet, then they go wide again and have her raise it again to fire.

    This one is basically a sequel to Blood Oath, with throwbacks to the Kahless clone of TNG and the overall Gowron stuff going on in DS9 with Worf, so we'll go Definitely Essential.

    Trivia: Directed by Levar Burton. This was the first episode of the 4th season, outside of Way of the Warrior, to have been written after Worf joined the show- as such, it's the first post-WOTW episode to fully integrate him into the show beyond B-stories. Initial fan reaction to this episode was less-postive than expected, as they apparently thought there should have been some tech explaination with the sword as to why the characters were acting the way they were, as opposed to just the power behind the concept of the sword itself revealing darker shades to them.





    Up next: DS9 410: Our Man Bashir.
  2. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    HA...a little too much "Wars" in their "Trek"... [face_laugh]

    Anyway...

    Not a terrible episode, but not a great one...Blood Oath was way better.

    Possible Spoiler: This one is probably the start of the Worf/Dax arc in earnest...which has always seemed one of the more forced romantic combinations in television history.

    You'd think with all the cross-series connections that 2nd mentioned, this would be like the nexus of Trekkie geekdom...Is it Worf? I don't think so...is it the Klingons? They were doing everything they could to get them into the DS9 story arcs...so what is it?

    I blame Dax...
  3. Magellan_the_Cat Jedi Padawan

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    [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20061126025105/memoryalpha/en/images/6/66/Korworf.jpg]

    Is it just me, or does that Bat'leth look, well, like a BAT-man prop.
    Very Choraptera...
  4. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I thought it looked much better than the usual bat'leth, which had a tendency to look cheap.
  5. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    Just so that it's said.

    Netflix added every Star Trek series to instant watch EXCEPT DS9!!!!

    Can someone explain this one?

    I've read scatterings across the web that it should be there before the end of the year...but how can you get the other 4 series out there in a flash...and have to hold back ONE!? This isn't a gradual roll out or anything...I don't understand this decision.

    Could it be that DS9 has some disc sales potential they don't want to ruin? (DS9 is the only series I've ever considered buying)

    Or, conversely, they don't think anyone cares about DS9 and are in no rush to put it out there.

    Or, maybe Netflix made this call...perhaps DS9 discs are in good rotation and they're not going to go to instant until the discs run out their usage "life".

    I'm grasping at straws...this makes no sense at all.
  6. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    It is a hard thing to justify. Best guess I could make is they wanted to give people a chance to catch up on TOS & TNG first, since they (mostly TNG, though) sets up a lot of things for DS9? Meanwhile VOY is kinda it's own thing and seems to have a different fanbase. ENT is just there for the hell of it. Takes time to watch 10 seasons of TV (anywhere from several months... to several years ;)).

    But a more gradual rollout would have supported that theory better, true.
  7. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050921222429/memoryalpha/en/images/e/e3/Julian_Bashir%2C_secret_agent.jpg] [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050921223358/memoryalpha/en/images/3/38/Obrien_as_Falcon.jpg] [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100810213713/memoryalpha/en/images/4/49/Anastasia_Komananov.jpg]
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    DS9 410: Our Man Bashir
    -Premise: A transporter accident replaces the characters in Bashir's secret agent holosuite program with the physical forms of the station's senior staff.

    -T2Q Comments: Did they really just end the teaser with a "What could possibly go wrong?" line? ugh.

    The Bond-esque holo program works when juxtaposed against Garrak (oh, I forgot- Garrak! Huzzah!), "I think I joined th wrong intelligence unit".

    The warp core ejection system isn't responding...what. a. ****ing. shock.

    I wonder if Eddington is thinking, after seeing the whole command crew essentially vaporize in front of him, "Well, that's ONE way to get a promotion"

    Ok, with Russian Kira we officially know this will be a silly, silly episode.

    So the goon who wasn't affected by the earring flashbomb decides that, rather than shoot at Bashir, he'll charge at him.

    "It's behind the spatula".

    A somewhat amusing spoof/homage to 60's spy films, but the whole concept to make it happen feels really forced and holds me back from being able to embrace it and full enjoy it but for what it is, not bad- just not good enough for me to really recommend it on those grounds. I think if Bashir or Garak had actually just programmed the characters into looking like crew members instead of forcing the whole transporter/holodeck malfunction angle into things to make it happen, I would have found it much more enjoyable.

    Average Episode (though, depending on how the holoprogram references go from this point on, I may place it as "Potentially Essential".

    Trivia: This episode aired 10 days after the release of GoldenEye. The title is an homage to "Our Man Flint" (which was itself a parody of James Bond) and various situations, characters and elements are homages to multiple Bond films. The various references to Bond were apparently less subtle than they intended, as the producers got an angry letter from MGM after this episode aired. As a result, the next episode to return to this holonovel of Bashir's was designed to be more subtle in it's homages to Bond and, also as a result, they scaled back their original intentions to do several more episodes about this premise. This episode had the longest production schedule of any single episode. Alexander Siddig and Nana Visitor had become romatically involved by time this episode was filming. The episode's stardate is 49300.7.



    Up next: DS9 411: Homefront & DS9 412: Paradise Lost.
  8. Magellan_the_Cat Jedi Padawan

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    Or it could simply be that the others were already converted, whereas DS9 is in the works. Or maybe there was some technical glitch with the DS9 conversions.

    So long as they don't have the annoying problem of incomplete transfers (Highlander and Lois&Clark had lots of episodes that were missing sections and resulted in not seeing the entire episode. Here's a clue: if you have 22 episodes that are 45 minutes long, one that is 35, and one that is 29, those two are probably *#$&ed up somehow). Patience. I expect the DS9 will be up soon enough.

    Our Man Bashir: I could see this being a fun running gag if done properly. Kinda like Janeway's constant 18th century governess novels in seasons 1&2 (haven't seen any in 3 yet).
    MGM needs a sense of humor. After all, Moonraker had Bond key in the Close Encounters theme. Lawyers...
  9. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    If I've read correctly, they dropped Janeways' holonovel after Season 2.
  10. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050724024251/memoryalpha/en/images/b/b6/StarfleetHeadquarters2372.jpg] [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050921052622/memoryalpha/en/images/0/02/Benteen_and_Leyton.jpg] [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060115204160/memoryalpha/en/images/d/d8/AntiChangelingPhaserDevice.jpg]
    DS9 411: Homefront
    -Premise: Sisko is recalled to San Francisco after a terrorist bombing reveals that Changelings have reached Earth.

    -T2Q Comments: Tholian observer- how hot. Changelings on Earth. Brock Peters from Star Trek 4 & 6 as a different character... "No, Sisko, I AM your father!" ;). General Hague...I'm assuming this is the episode that created the doublebooking that lead to his B5 character being killed offscreen and JMS's subsequent revenge on the set of Jeremiah. Not-Dr Leah Brahms. Nog returns.

    I have a suspicion regarding a twist I sense coming... hmm, no, the timing with the Admiral/pidgeon incident and Sisko/his father doesn't work- I really thought the father had been replaced by a Changeling (not eating, not seeing a doctor, etc)...unless there are two Changelings... ha, at least the episode is addressing up the theory.

    It's interesting to see them addressing the notions of paranoia and the utopia of Earth- it calls back to the whole "It's easy to be a saint in paradise" speech by Sisko earlier in the series. I don't think it has a huge amount of weight to it yet, but Part II could resolve that- still, advances the Dominion War plotline. Definitely Essential.

    Trivia: This episode was originally developed as the 3rd season finale, with the Changelings destabilizing the Federation to the point of civil war, making the Vulcans withdraw from the Federation and the cliffhanger being a Starfleet ship opening fire on a Vulcan ship near Earth.

    When Paramount told them not to do a cliffhanger finale, they did The Adversary instead, and intended to make Homefront the 4th season opener. However, Paramount's further instructions to shake up the show between seasons led to the introduction of the Klingons and Worf, which pushed Homefront back to mid-season.

    This episode was an intentional misdirection to convince the audience that martial law was a good thing, then show them how wrong that feeling is in part II. This is the first time we see Sisko wearing a TNG style uniform since the pilot. There was disappointment that they didn't have the necessary money for this two parter (but would have, had it not been Way of the Warrior).

    The fans and producers were not fond of how the Federation president came across here, with the latter seemingly unhappy with the performance. The writers saw him as a Jimmy Carter type character. The president makes reference to there not being a state of emergncy on Earth in a century, with exception to the Borg incident. This could refer to either the V'Gar incident or the Whale Probe attack. Rene, Dorn and Peters all appear in this episode and all played supporting characters in Star Trek 6.


    [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080919220606/memoryalpha/en/images/5/50/USS_Lakota_fires_on_the_Defiant-3.jpg] [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060917164428/memoryalpha/en/images/7/74/Sisko_asks_odo_hides_paradise_lost.jpg] [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060917170455/memoryalpha/en/images/0/02/Sisko_false_positive_paradise_lost.jpg]
    DS9 412: Paradise Lost
    -Premise: While Starfleet tightens security measures on Earth, Sisko and Odo discover that Admiral Leyton is deviously plotting to take over the planet.

    -T2Q Comments: The Starfleet intrigue is an interesting addition..I almost think this conversation should have been the cliffhanger moment. Excelsior vs Defiant- nice. The coup plotline is much more interesting than Part I, though I'm glad they made it a two-parter and didn't try to rush it- though it's unfortunate we have yet another Starfleet Admiral-Gone-Bad.

    The coup plotline is a bit of a diversion from really addressing the security vs freedom question it's
  11. Magellan_the_Cat Jedi Padawan

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    I'm just starting Voyager season 6. Yes, Janeway has another holodeck obsession, played wonderfully by John Rhys-Davies!!!
    But that is also only for a few episodes...
  12. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20050922225151/memoryalpha/en/images/a/a2/Kira%2C_Shakaar%2C_Odo.jpg] [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060926085603/memoryalpha/en/images/7/7b/Shakaar_makes_wish_crossfire.jpg] [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060926085847/memoryalpha/en/images/e/e1/Stop_turbolift_crossfire.jpg]
    [image=http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060926090139/memoryalpha/en/images/b/be/Kira_odo_friends_crossfire.jpg] [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060926090433/memoryalpha/en/images/d/d3/Odo_smashed_quarters_crossfire.jpg]
    DS9 413: Crossfire
    -Premise: Odo must face his feelings for Kira when she falls in love with First Minister Shakaar, her former Resistance leader.

    -T2Q Comments: [link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCwn1NTK-50]"Crossfire! You'll get caught up in the- Crossfire! Crossfire! CROSSFIYEAAH!"[/link]

    (sorry ;))

    "Luck had nothing to do with it.". Shakaar returns. The Odo/Worf pairing and examination of their similar personality traits is good- would like to see more of that. The episode seems to continue that pattern with Odo's analysis with the politician's feelings and thoughts about Kira mirroring Odo's.

    That's a nice shapeshifting trick there.

    "That's what she said."

    Well, that was a really great episode; the quality combined with the furtherment/resolution of the Odo/Kira subplot makes this one Definitely Essential (and, whats more, we don't really need to see the previous Shakaar episode to understand this one)

    Trivia: The story evolved from an initial suggestion of doing a Bodyguard-type story. The Worf/Odo scenes doubled as a hint of Worf's move to the Defiant. The scene in Odo's destroyed room had an improvised touch with the loose strand of Odo's hair- Rene was trying to evoke an image from a Japanese print of a warrior in defeat. The plant Odo destroys was the one given to him by Kira in The Abandoned and the pot was Odo's old bucket.



    Up next: DS9 414: Return to Grace.
  13. Nobody145 Jedi Master

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    Just to chime in, I liked the Defiant vs. Lakota battle back during that two-parter. I only got into DS9 somewhere around the fourth/fifth season, so when I was catching up on older episodes in syndication at the time, seeing two Starfleet ships fight was a highlight. Also a good example of just how much power they packed into the tiny Defiant with how it could go up against an upgraded Excelsior (although both were still slightly holding back).

    And I know it was silly, but I liked Bashir and Garak in a Bond parody. Voyager's holodeck episodes got really annoying later on (Janeway's and Paris').

    I remember reading that they killed off General Hague as the actor wasn't available despite having booked him earlier, but oh well, B5's story arguably worked out even better that way anyway. He works here, just too bad they have to keep continuing the evil/corrupt/idiotic senior officer trend most Treks follow.
  14. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Yeah, that was why Hague was killed offscreen (and, amusingly, the actor playing the character that replaces Hague's function in Severed Dreams was actually hired by mistake, as JMS misremembered the actor's name he had originally wanted and didn't realize his mistake until the actor was on-set; however, JMS was happy with the actor's performance).

    Additionally, the Hague actor was brought in to play the President in JMS's Jeremiah, so JMS wrote a really long and difficult monologue for the actor to perform which JMS had no intention of ever including in the episode, as revenge for the DS9/B5 incident. [face_laugh]
  15. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090406102344/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8e/Dukat_Kira_cargo_exercise.jpg] [image=http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20040910102536/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8e/Groumall_and_bop2.jpg] [image=http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20061002015739/memoryalpha/en/images/e/ea/Tora_Ziyal%2C_Return_to_Grace.jpg]
    DS9 414: Return to Grace
    -Premise: Kira and Gul Dukat chase the Klingon Bird-of-Prey that destroyed a Cardassian outpost where Cardassian and Bajoran representatives were holding a conference.

    -T2Q Comments: Continuation of Duhkat's daughter subplot- not surprising that it's another Duhket/Kira episode. I forget if I commented on/noticed this before in a previous Duhkat episode, but Duhkat's makeup looks different now.

    "I can just imagine that Klingon Captain explaining this to his superiors."
    "He won't get the opportunity."
    (kaboom!)
    "Was that necessary?"
    "You're the terrorist. You tell me."

    Seems pretty important to Duhkat's plotline, and, presumably, to anything with daughter coming up, so, I guess, once again, Definitely Essential.

    Trivia: The original idea behind this episode originated with the question of what might have happened if the Jews and Nazis were forced to work together after WW2. The original conclusion to the episode involved Kira and Dukat beaming over to the Klimgon ship and overpowering the entire crew of the Bird of Prey. This was changed when it was pointed out that no one would buy two people taking on 60 Klingon warriors and winning.

    Dukat's line of "What Cardassians? I am the only Cardassian left!" is based on a statement by Sioux leader Sitting Bull. The actor playing Damar initially was dissapointed in his part here, feeling that any extra could have played it, but the director told the actor that there were big plans for him, and, as such, he was shot as if he was a major character. The comparison between the Cardassian and Federation rifles mirrors the real world debate between the M-16 and AK-47.



    Up next: DS9 415: Sons of Mogh.
  16. CaptainPeabody Jedi Master

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    Crossfire is, to my mind, one of the most under-appreciated gems of Star Trek. Just a quiet, beautiful little piece, played perfectly.

    DS9 was blessed with some of the best actors of any Trek show, as well as some of the best writers; the reason it remains my favorite Trek spinoff.

    And Dukat is hilarious, as always.

  17. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    It was an excellent episode, it'll definitely be on my list of top episodes for the series, I think.
  18. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    I think in general they cut back a bit on the "alien-ness" of Cardassian make-up.

    The look of the Cardassian evolves significantly from the early TNG appearances.

    I think with DS9...given the frequency of appearances, mirrored with the regular appearance of other HEAVY makeup species (Jem Hadar, etc)...toss in the bottom line...Cardassian makeup had to find the easiest street.
  19. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I think they did update some of the appliances, though- I recall noticing the same thing about Quark's makeup in the Season 4 premiere as well.

    It's not necessarily a bad thing- takes some getting used to, but it helps the alien characters look like they're aging slightly, as their human counterparts do.
  20. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    [image=http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20060902041051/memoryalpha/en/images/e/e6/Sons_of_Mogh.jpg]
    DS9 415: Sons of Mogh
    -Premise: Worf's brother Kurn arrives on the station, and asks Worf to kill him.

    -T2Q Comments: Worf's black robes here with the grey stripe evokes the B5 Army of Light uniforms (but not so much so that I'll add it to my list). Worf/Dax teased. Worf's brother Kurn returns.

    "Tell me, Worf, does Starfleet ever make mistakes- even in their furniture?"

    "I have never asked you for anything" actually, I'm pretty sure you asked for a hell of a lot back in those TNG episodes.

    The runabout chairs recline, for some reason, that's nice to know, ha. The scene where Sisko reprimands Worf illustrates a big difference between Picard and Sisko- I think Picard, while not approving, would have discussed or debated the issue- Sisko just gets mad and says "No! End of story!"

    "He'll be alright...again" Bashir's medical care is kind of a running joke here this episode so far as Kurn is concerned.

    "There..very ugly. Well, uglier....joke."
    "I got it."

    Mine field detontation a neat shot. "Just like flushing quayle"

    Well, that was an unexpected way to tie off that character/plotline- always figured they'd just regain their house after this Klingon conflict ended. Definitely Essential.

    Trivia: While hinting at Worf/Dax, Moore originally wanted to insert a line that Worf was no longer involved with Troi but was unable to find an appropriate place for it. The exchange between Kurn and Worf about the comfort of Worf's quarters echoes a similar conversation from Kurn's first appearance in TNG: Sins of the Father.



    Up next: DS9: Bar Association & DS9: Accession.



    The Babylon Project Log:

    -Space stations ending with a numerical designation that are of commerce ports in nature (prominently featuring a casino area), near a giant swirling blue vortex passageway (wormhole/jumpgate) used for travel and a location of advanced creation (prophet temple/Great Machine).
    -Hard-edged female second in command, pessimistic, sarcastic security chief. somewhat ethnic doctor.
    -Characters named Dukat/Dukhat
    -A spiritual race recently coming free of occupation by a more militaristic civilization, the conflict of which led the spiritual race to become more militant themselves.
    -Gambler conman (Quark/Londo) has somewhat fluctuating antagonistic friendship with hard-edged chief of security (Odo/Garabaldi).
    -Characters played by Julie Caitlin Brown have a long-standing grudge against a notorious murderer who has prolonged their life at the expense of others through scientific experimentation (Rao Vantika/Jha'dur "Deathwalker").
    -The term "Changeling" has significance in relation to early parts of both series (the B5 pilot "the Gathering" and DS9's "Vortex" & beyond), though applied to different elements (technology versus a species).
    -A main character slowly constructs a device (chrysalis/clock) piece of piece in their quarters while conversing with a subordinate .
    -A main character often referred to as Chief (Miles/Garibaldi) has a recurring assistant (Neela/garibaldi's Aide) who is a plant by another faction that attempts to bring about political change by assassinating a prominent rival leader (Bariel/Santiago) in the first season finale so that one of their faction may replace him (Adami/Clark). Their plot is uncovered by the Chief character.
    -The Circle/Homeguard Bajoran for Bajorans, vandalism with a symbol; subdues and brands an alien on the middle of the forehead with their logo
    -Second Season opens with a command officer (Sinclair/Kira) being reassigned from the station to be among the religious order of a species heavily involved with the operation of the station, partly due to prophecy
    -A near-human alien race has their hair up in a fan-style to represent social status.
    -A character played by Julia Nickson (Catherine/Cassandra) romances (or attempts to romance) the commander of the station (Sinclair/Sisko).
    -Characters have discussion of higher and lower lifeforms awareness of each other to that
  21. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    star 5
    Never liked this episode...felt like a cop-out.
  22. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    Yeah I think that kinda sums up my "unexpected way to tie off that character/plotline" comment better- it's like "we don't want to deal with him anymore, but we don't want to kill him off either".
  23. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    Which makes NO sense...with the Klingons becoming more enveloped in the series, he could've been a great character to bridge to the Klingon perspective.

    Spoiler-ish:
    And as the series goes on, they had to up the importance of Martok to the franchise, wwere Kern would've been perhaps a more interesting choice.

    My final thought on it is there must've been real world reasons for the write-out/cop-out...which means money.

    More Spoiler-ishiness:
    And if you think this feels like a cop-out...Alexander's return ain't much better.
  24. Jedimarine Jedi Master

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    DS9 ON NETFLIX INSTANT!!!

    I'm gaining on ya FAST, 2nd!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
  25. The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth

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    I'm trying not to rush through it- with DS9 being the inspiration for this whole project, I only have a little more than 3 seasons left- after that it's just Voyager and Enterprise :p.