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Amph "You are of Bajor" A 'Trek' to 'Deep Space Nine'

Discussion in 'Community' started by Darth_Duck, Jan 4, 2006.

  1. Likewater

    Likewater Jedi Master star 4

    Dec 31, 2009
    I have the Deepspace 9 season 1 box set, could never find the others! Irritating as I loved that series.
  2. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001
    Okay...well I'm running through the first few seasons...skipping the obvious stinkers.

    When I catch up to ya, I'll match pace...just keep giving the "up next" note so I know what you're on.

    Unlike SG-1, I can't get ANYONE around here to go through this one.

    "Star Trek...really? Missing High School?"

    That's the comment, plus/minus a word or two, from 4 people!
  3. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    Ha, yeah, it can be tough sell. I've been marathoning through TNG with a friend whom I've marathoned other shows with before (24, B5, Farscape & SG1/SGA, as well as a little DW) and it was kind of a hard sell even with her (I think she originally just wanted to watch Generations since she hadn't seen it yet at that time, so I was able to convince a longer viewing schedule extrapolated back to the TOS movies (2/3/4/6 only) and working forward through TNG from there.

    Between Data and Worf (and my promise of DS9/B5 similarities) she's managed to get hooked enough to continue forward over the past few years (I only get a chance to hang out with her 2 or 3 times a year so we hit 8-10 episodes at a time, kinda averages out ;)). Last time we managed to squeeze in DS9's pilot, so it'll be interesting to see how the early seasons strike her compared to the TNG-at-it's-peak episodes we'll be alternating with.

    It was kinda funny, actually- when we started TNG, she thought we were doing TOS and was wondering where Kirk and Scotty were (since Trek 09 had just come out, or was about to come out). So, next time around, I rotated in some TOS episodes (Mirror, City & Tribbles) and she couldn't stand the first two, but liked Tribbles a lot. I guess the contrast helped keep her on TNG, ha.
  4. Magellan_the_Cat

    Magellan_the_Cat Jedi Padawan star 4

    Jul 21, 2003
    Really? I don't remember seeing your reviews of StarTrek:TAS! :-B
  5. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    I really wanted to get to the TOS movies/TNG and away from TOS, plus while some episodes are considered cnaon, it seems the overall series canonocity is questionable, so I skipped them. Though I did do a brief overview update on the series at that point in the timeline.

    Looking back at the threads, it looks like I didn't repost that particular entry here since we didn't have a separate thread for it. I'll do so over in the TOS thread.
  6. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    Finally got around to typing up an update (though I'm still about 6 episodes (combined) ahead of where this update is)...

    DS9 416: Bar Association
    -Premise: Quark's employees, led by Rom, form a union against Quark's unfair labor practices and promptly go on strike.

    -T2Q Comments: Another good Odo/Worf scene with Odo recounting some examples of theft aboard the Enterprise. This union forming scene is unfortunately very corny. Sisko's means of forcing Quark to discuss things with his brother is awesome, however.

    The Ferengi Brunt returns. Labor dispute to be resolved "by any means necessary". The Nausican's way of playing darts is kinda awesome, haha.

    Well, that ended up being a pretty decent Ferengi episode, though not without it's bumps (the aforementioned corny union formation scene, mainly). Seems like an important step for Rom, too, plus we have Worf moving to the Defiant and developing the Dax relationship a little as well. So, I guess Potentially Essential- you don't HAVE to see this, but it doesn't hurt.

    Trivia: Directed by Levar Burton. Originally pitched to be a B-story for either Rejoined or Crossfire, this story was instead expanded into it's own episode after realizing how rich a subject it was.

    The TNG events Odo references are from A Matter of Time and Rascals. Rom's comment of self-administered co-mox is the first allusion to masturbation in all of Star Trek. Worf's stolen tooth sharpener was sold to him by Nog in Little Green Men.

    Although fans believed the scene of Sisko chastizing Worf, O'Brien and Bashir was an homage to The Trouble With Tribbles, the writer was thinking of a John Ford film titled Fort Apache. Armin Shimerman sits on the Board of Directors of the Screen Actors Guild.

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    DS9 417: Accession
    -Premise: A three-hundred-year-old Bajoran ship comes through the wormhole, and its passenger claims that he is the Emissary of the Prophets.

    -T2Q Comments: That's an old-school looking Federation shuttle/transport there. Keiko returns with kid...s.

    Potential new emmisary.

    "So. you're off the hook. How does it feel?"
    "Feels...good. No more ceremonies to attend. No more blessings to give. No more prophecies to fulfill. I'm just a Starfleet officer again. All I have to worry about are the Klingons, the Dominion and the Maquis. I feel like I'm on vacation!"

    Kira's dilemma is interesting, even though it's mostly of her own doing in that she allows her religion to abuse her faith.

    so, that was sort of a big reset button there...and makes you wonder about the temporal effects on everything else but, whatever, we'll go with it. Important as far as the Emissary subplot goes (and the second part of the Emissary Trilogy), though the guy playing the other Emmisary was a bit dry.

    So Good Episode, But Not Necessarily Essential.

    Trivia: The producers had to fight to get this episode made, as the studio had told them not to do any more episodes about religion (Bajoran religion in particular) as they were somewhat unpopular with viewers as far as ratings go.

    David Warner was originally going to play Alorem, but was talked out of it by his wife since he was on vacation and she didn't want him to work.

    First time we hear "You are of Bajor". Bashir and O'Brien tease Worf about the birth of Molly from TNG: Disaster. The closing credits feature some changes in crew due to a number of DS9 crew members helping out on First Contact. Quark's comment about babies in this episode is one of the few times a Ferengi says "ears" instead of "lobes". Kira's lack of artistic abilities was mentioned previously in The Circle.

    Up next: DS9 418: Rules of Engagement.

    The Babylon Project Log:

    -Space stations ending
  7. Magellan_the_Cat

    Magellan_the_Cat Jedi Padawan star 4

    Jul 21, 2003
    Yeah, I almost always turned of an ep if it started being about Bajoran religion or internal politics. I just didn't give a tinker's damn about the characters--they were just annoying.
  8. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001 I tried rushing and skipping the stinkers...except I kept remembering things from the stinkers, so I kept going back to watch the stinkers.,,I did manage to do a little fast forwarding through segments of the stinkers...but still...

    This could take awhile.
  9. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    An understatement [face_laugh].
  10. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001
    So I got a chunk of season 2 viewed.

    I forgot how phenomenal the Bajoran Trilogy was to start season 2...I really do think that was the first great story of the show...season one was so much about really see what they can do with it in the trilogy.

    2 best scenes are the crowd in Kira's quarters..."By all means, come in!" [face_laugh]

    And then the aftermath of Quark being branded...just great back and forth.

    I think you could tell the cast was happy to be back, and it showed in their performances.


    Skip ahead to the end of my chunk...The Maquis 2-parter.

    It's amazing how Sisko rides the fence here...You go from his "They've crossed the line" speech, to his "Saints in Paradise" speech, and yet manages to somehow remain consistent in his duty. It's an ugly business he's forced to handle, and much like Picard at the end of TNG, he is clearly irritated by policy, Admirals with no sense of reality, and betrayal by his old come away with the sense that any time the words "demilitarized zone" "Maquis" or "Badlands" come up, a shiver runs down his spine.
  11. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    Or a hair falls out ;)
  12. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001
    So I got through season 2, and finally broke free...started running the Dominion story arc, so I'm well ahead of you now, 2nd.

    But as I've skipped episodes, I've been recalling what I've missed as I pass by, and I'm afraid your rubric for weighing episodes is going to start to break on you.

    By your current viewing definitions, most if not all of season 5 will be essential, and I don't see much in season 6 that won't be either. Now, you can take that as a good thing...the way the show is mandatory viewing almost every week...but if your intent was to streamline for the most important's not going to be fact, it might be impossible to weed even a stinker episode because of some minor point.

    I guess what it may come down to is "first view" or "review"...if you've never seen it, the viewing rules would be different that someone familiar with the show's course.

    It may prove insurmountable to streamline this show in a meaningful way.

    But, I know you will good luck, 2nd!

  13. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    Well, I think going in I expected the majority of the streamlining to occur within the first 3 seasons, much like TNG (although both TNG and even VOY have enough standalones to make slimming things down more feasible). It's not unsurprising that the later seasons, especially with DS9's focus on a larger arc, would be harder to trim- not unlike B5, really.
  14. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001
    Made it to the finale.

    I teared up, gotta say.

    I think in the end I watched 50-60 episodes, but a lot of that was the first 2 seasons, and I wouldn't necessarily count them as essential.

    I also skipped some personal favorites to focus on the important arc.

    Season 5 and 6 are heavily interconnected...season 7, beyond the final 8-9 which are specifically linked, seems less interconnected, perhaps because of the "character episode" focus...much like how TNG ended with different character episodes to tie things up and give a final spotlight.
  15. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    I should be able to get a few more under my belt in a couple weeks once this semester ends- and I'll try to catch up on the reviews for the episodes I've already watched as well.
  16. Rebel_Padawan

    Rebel_Padawan Jedi Master star 4

    Apr 11, 2003
    The whole reason I keep coming back and reading these reviews is in anticipation of episode 6 of season five ;)

    Not too far away now!
  17. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    About half a season to go before I get there
  18. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
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    DS9 418: Rules of Engagement
    -Premise: The Klingons try to extradite Worf after he accidentally destroys a transport full of Klingon civilians.

    -T2Q Comments: Starfleet court episode- danger! A Kligon not wearing warrior clothes or a Starfleet uniform, not too common a sight. The flashback testimonials are a strange technique to explore here. That bell is way too weak to make any symbolic gesture.

    "Care to step onto my battlefield?"

    "Life is a great deal more complicated in this red uniform."
    "Wait till you get 4 pips on that collar. You'll wish you had gone into botany."

    Maybe this franchise has finally turned the corner on trial episodes... not only did that not suck, but the Admiral in charge didn't go insane either. That's remarkable constraint on the part of this franchise. Good Episode, But Not Necessarily Essential.

    Trivia: The concept of this episode, inspired by an incident in 1988 where a US Naval vessel shot down an Iranian passenger aircraft, originated with the author of a Sam Peckinpah biography, whose film work Ira Steven Behr had a love for. The original version of the story had Sisko on trial and the revelation was that the destroyed ship was a holographic projection. The 4th-wall breaking, speaking-to-camera style was inspired by Spike Lee's Clockers. A deleted line from the script explains the lack of Worf's baldric as resulting from a request by the advocate for him to not wear it until the hearing is over, as a dishonored Klingon wearing Klingon emblems offends him. Goof: the quantum torpedoes shown glow orange like photons, instead of blue.

    Up next: DS9 419: Hard Time & DS9 420: Shattered Mirror.
  19. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
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    DS9 419: Hard Time
    -Premise: Convicted of espionage, Miles O'Brien is given the memories of twenty years in prison in a matter of hours. Returning to DS9, O'Brien finds he cannot shrug the memory of his awful experience or rid himself of the guilt he feels over the death of his cellmate.

    -T2Q Comments: Miles crazy aged hair looks ridiculous... old age makeup fails the franchise yet again. Seems like Miles should call up Picard and ask him about dealing with the memories of a false lifetime... but, seriously, how would he be fit for duty at all in the immediate future? He'd have to remember tech stuff he hadn't thought about or worked on for 2 decades.

    Ok, criticism retracted- they're actually dealing with that in the story. This I like.

    Yeah, you knock those obviously-empty containers over, Miles. Good Episode, But Not Necessarily Essential (but recommended!).

    Trivia: Story for this episode is by Daniel Keys Moran (same author as the various Boba Fett tales) and was originally pitched during the 1st season but took several attempts by Robert Wolfe, Piller and Behr to get it made. Hard Time takes the original pitch and adds the killed-cellmate angle from an unproduced pitch that would have shown Ensign Jaxa (from The First Duty and Lower Decks) was still alive and had been in a Cardassian prison. Actress Margot Rose appears in both this episode and TNG's The Inner Light. One of the annual "O'Brien-Must-Suffer" episodes.

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    DS9 420: Shattered Mirror
    -Premise: Professor Jennifer Sisko uses Jake to lure Sisko to the "mirror universe" to help the rebels build another starship Defiant.

    -T2Q Comments: "I imagine that's why you don't have any fiends." "Look whose talking."

    I wonder what Sherry Palmer thinks about Sisko visiting the AU version of his dead wife.

    Alt-Garrak, huzzah! Alt-Worf, huh, hadn't thought about his inclusion having an impact on the Mirrorverse.

    "You are attempting to shift the blame away from yourself!"
    "Am I succeeding?"

    "Spoken like a Klingon!"
    "I'm trying..."

    Neat shot- essentially Defiant in drydock, something we've never seen before.

    "But at least..what?"
    "But at least I could please her from time to time."
    "You...are not my type."
    "I never said I was."

    This whole chase around DS9 battle is really quite fun. I suppose this sequence shall hereby be known as the "Don't **** With the Defiant" sequence ("Don't **** With Sisko on the Defiant" would also be permitted).

    "Make it so!"

    Alternate universe plus badass battle equals Definitely Essential.

    Trivia: Mirror Worf was originally going to appear in Crossover but couldn't due to filming of TNG at the time, so his role was given to Garak instead. 3rd consecutive mirror episode to kill a Ferengi (Quark in Crossover, Rom in Through the Looking Glass, Nog here).

    Up next: DS9 421: The Muse & DS9 422: For the Cause.

    Alternate Universe Log:

    -TOS: The Alternative Factor (Anti-Matter Universe)
    -TOS: Mirror, Mirror (Mirror Universe)
    -TOS: The Tholian Web (Mirror Universe & "Solo-Kirk" Universe)
    -TNG: We'll Always Have Paris (Simultaneous Continuum universes, "Manheim Dimension")
    -TNG: Yesterday's Enterprise (Federatio
  20. Darth_Omega

    Darth_Omega Jedi Grand Master star 6

    May 19, 2002
    Shattered Mirror is also notable for having a Star Wars reference. :p
  21. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    As yes, "I will deal with the rebels myself!"
  22. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
    DS9 421: The Muse
    -Premise: A mysterious woman helps Jake write a novel; Lwaxana Troi, pregnant with a son, asks Odo to help her escape her husband.

    -T2Q Comments: That transport is whipping around the station pretty fast- surely there's some kind of speed regulation when being that close to the station? (outside of battle, obviously).

    Mama Troi returns...with an awfully cliche cliffhanger for the teaser "I'm pregnant", plus it's paired with a goofyily exagerated expression of reaction by Odo; and the goofy expression carriers over as the scenes picks up- did no one tell the actor to dial it down?

    The stuff with the titular Muse is interesting, Mama Troi's plight, not so much (I even forgot she got married, quite frankly), however, tying it back to the her lost child from TNG: Dark Page is an interesting connection. Briefly touches on Odo/Kira, and has some nice symbolism throwing back to the first Odo/Mama Troi episode where he had to rest in her lap, now she in his.

    As a bit of meta observation, the Muse speaks of writing in a stream of conciousness and then editing later- not much unlike what I do with this episode viewing project, ha.

    That's not Evilyn, is it? It is! I'd recognize Meg Foster's eyes anywhere.

    So her husband is a Technomage and a Klingon. Am I the only one to notice that Jake doesn't take any of the pages he's just written with him? If I was writing what I thought to be my best work, i wouldn't just leave them laying around in a relative strangers' room.

    That's Lyta/Patricia Tallman as the nurse. And another magic energyball lifeform that can pass through walls and travel through space.

    So, I'm mixed on this one- it's ultimately handled competently but the whole marriage plotline I don't care for and it makes the more interesting Muse plotline feel like more of a distraction that forces in an obligatory "we need more scifi stuff here" moment and combines it with a cliched ending- I suppose I wish they could have focused more of the episode on that and the nature of creativity and inspiration and it would have been more satisfying. Average.

    Trivia: Originally titled "Playing House". The pitch for this episode came from Majel. The script meeting took twice as long as even a problematic script would and was the longest in the entire seven year run of DS9. Producers and crew were all unhappy with the episode, citing script problems and directorial problems- though Meg Foster was universally praised.

    Among those the Muse mentions she's inspired are an english poet named John Keats, a BC Roman poet named Catullus and the alien Tarbolde- one poem of whose was quoted by Gary Mitchell in Where No Man Has Gone Before. The novel Jake begins writing is "Anslem", which also appeared in The Visitor. Jake is reading a Hortio Hornblower novel in this episode- the same novel he read in The Visitor. One of the ambassadors that boards the station early on was played by John Paul Lone, who won the guest spot for designing the makeup of the Rasiinian species. This is Majel Barrett's last appearance as Lwaxana Troi in Star Trek and her final on-screen Star Trek appearance.

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    DS9 422: For the Cause
    -Premise: Sisko discovers that Kasidy Yates may be a Maquis smuggler.

    -T2Q Comments: Continuing the Maquis plotline via post-Klingon attack on Cardassia, with a dash of Sisko and Sherry Palmer. Garrak, huzzah! Does his makeup look a little different here or is just me? Garrak and the daughter of Dukat? hmm..

    Sisko's d
  23. Jedimarine

    Jedimarine Jedi Master star 5

    Feb 13, 2001
    I love "For the Cause".

    The ending NOT victory or lesson, moral or otherwise.

    If this were any other series in the franchise, they would've apologized Kassidy right into insignificance...the fact they don't, takes a major step towards maturing the nature of the fictional universe to something not so perfect and utterly unrealistic.
  24. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Jan 27, 2000
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    424: The Quickening
    -Premise: Dr. Bashir works to rid a planet of a plague that was sent by the Dominion as punishment for resistance.

    -T2Q Comments: My name is Sisko McCloud of the Clan McCloud. Born 300 years in the future with a head he can no longer unshave. Now is the time of The Gathering, where the strike of a Defiant can unleash the power of The Quickening, in the end, there can be only one. Now that we've gotten the obligatory reference out of the way...


    Ok, I have few if any criticisms about that episode- great friggin episode. Outside of the Trevean subplot element not really being needed, this is a great, grounded story that doesn't throw in any weird stuff just for the sake of making it more sci-fiy and shows Starfleet (albeit it one officer) at their best- helping people in a terrible situation, a situation that underlies how horrific the Dominion really are, and the exterior sets really look like a different place instad of the same recycled sets and locations we see so often.

    This, currently, has no connecting plotlines to other episodes, but I'm going to say it's Definitely Essential regardless.

    Trivia: Conceptually inspired by the 1995 film Restoration, as well as beginning as a n AIDS metaphor, though that metaphor was ultimately dropped by time the final script was written. Originally titled "the Healing Touch", the title was changed because it was felt the original title implied Bashir would be successful. Instead they went with the double meaning of "The Quickening", which means both in the story that the virus becomes active and, outside the story "to quicken" means "to come to life".

    Trevean is an anagram of "veteran" and Ekorio (the original name for Ekoria) is an anagram of "rookie". The director played up the relugious overtones of the story by trying to visually frame Ekoria as a virgin Mary type figure, in ways such as having a shot of her in front of a rounded arch window to make the arch look like a halo.

    The later-stage blight disfiguring effects were actually achieved in post-prodiction through an early form of motion capture instead of elaborate makeup on set. Exterior scenes were filmed at a field laboratory in southern california where shuttle testings resulted in earth being burned and scorched from rocket engines. This was shot before To the Death, but aired afterwards, which is probably why the two episodes are in reverse order in my reference list.

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    423: To the Death
    -Premise: Following a hit and run attack on Deep Space 9 by a band of rogue Jem'Hadar, Sisko and his crew are joined by the Dominion on a mission to locate the rebels who have discovered another Iconian Gateway.

    -T2Q Comments: Ah, looks to be a good ol' "off to kick some ass" episode. Brian Thompson, yay! Andorian Dude Combs as Vorta. Iconian Gateways brought up again.

    "We consider Klingon women our partners in battle, they are the mothers of our children."
    "And a lot of fun at parties too."

    Oh well, Brian Thompson the Jem'Hadar is gone, but there's still Brian Thompson the Klingon running around the universe ;).

    I actually remember part of this episode where Dax & the Jem'Hadar talk about ages. I must have popped in towards the end of the season, though I don't remember the rest of this episode.

    "I am Fi
  25. DRush76

    DRush76 Jedi Master star 4

    Jan 25, 2008
    Due to its premise - which was a rip-off of "BABYLON 5" - "DEEP SPACE NINE" could have been the best TREK series. But its writing proved to be just as inconsistent as the other four series and the end, I believe it failed to achieve its potential.